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Fox isn't worse than Jiggs or Peach..Unless you're solely depending on your grabs, then Fox is a nightmare.<.<
If you use her mobility, aerials and tilts though, you'll see its not so bad..
-brother amsah was wrong: full metal alchemist-brotherhood sucks!!! that shiet is like a watered down version of the first series! it's abridged, sped up, and still missing stuff from the manga. amsah, you lied to us.
first of all, the number of levels of fox play is like...infinite. you never know wtf kind of fox is gonna roll on you. i mean, of all the chars i've played, beaten in tournament, been amazed by, and struggled against....it's always been fox. you can't tell me it's not the same for everyone not named m2k. the sheik v. fox matchup isn't hard to figure out...but the results are always variable
2ndly....brotherhood is garbbbs!! The first series had a lot of heart and emotion. it took it's time with telling the story. it also did the best combination of using the original manga story and new anime story plots of the last decade. brotherhood basically re-animated half the footage anyway! ugggggh. i only saw the first dozen of episodes tho...maybe it'll get better.
first of all, the number of levels of fox play is like...infinite. you never know wtf kind of fox is gonna roll on you. i mean, of all the chars i've played, beaten in tournament, been amazed by, and struggled against....it's always been fox. you can't tell me it's not the same for everyone not named m2k. the sheik v. fox matchup isn't hard to figure out...but the results are always variable
2ndly....brotherhood is garbbbs!! The first series had a lot of heart and emotion. it took it's time with telling the story. it also did the best combination of using the original manga story and new anime story plots of the last decade. brotherhood basically re-animated half the footage anyway! ugggggh. i only saw the first dozen of episodes tho...maybe it'll get better.
I don't have trouble with Fox..lol
If you outsmart a Fox player and find holes in their style, Sheik is more than capable of capitalizing on those mistakes. Honestly, the matchup is pretty even..
As for me losing to Lucky, he's just good..Had nothing to do with Fox..lol
And you're the crazy one. As much as I liked the first FMA, this one is much *much* better..
brother amsah is purrry gud. i read somewhere amsah's winning streak of high level of tournies was longer than mangos. that true? whats the timeline on that?
ok, brotherhood isn't horrible...but it's like watching the same thing again. congrats bones studio, i'm seeing a slightly different version of a series from 2003 that's based off a manga that wasn't as good to begin with!
From the summer in 2006 until April 2009 I didn't lose a single tournament. And the person that beat me wasn't even European or my streak would've started in February 2006..**** you CJ
That's as far as I know longer than Mango's winning streak..lol
amsah peach is a much better matchup than fox (i think its in sheiks favor and most other sheiks too but lets not get into that again, our stances are clear)
heres how i see the biggest threats to sheik, ignoring icies cuz i cant legitimately comment on too much from lack of experience
fox 60/40= faster than you, can combo you, better camping projectile. also foxes can be verrrry good in general
falco 55/45= laser is a pain in the ***, can also combo you
peach 40-60= kind of a "d@mn i cant my normal stuff on her". crouch cancellings out, her priority can actually challenge yours, much combo ability is lost, your aerial game needs to be more precise, and peach can stagegaurd the hel1 out of u
jiggs 50-50= grabs are risky, combo ability is mostly gone, jiggs can edgeguard the he1l out of you (really just death if ur too far out), gotta be careful with whiffing moves
I am terrible terrible terrible new sheik who just got back into melee again.
I used to be a mewtwo main and I found sheik pretty similiar but I know next to NOTHING about her except for needle cancels, dthrow, jab, and fair </3 [and crouch cancel dtilt, and other stuff like Tech chasing, but idk who I can CG/how to CG]
Can someone give me quick rundown of what I should learn as a new sheik?
amsah peach is a much better matchup than fox (i think its in sheiks favor and most other sheiks too but lets not get into that again, our stances are clear)
Powershielding destroys his entire laser game and though he can combo you, with a little smash DI and good techs, you can limit the damage. Sheik on the other hand can tech chase him from 0% to death and gimp him at nearly any percentage with one grab and any two moves you can think of.
I would say it's 55/45 as well, but in Sheiks favor, not the other way around.
peach 40-60= kind of a "d@mn i cant my normal stuff on her". crouch cancellings out, her priority can actually challenge yours, much combo ability is lost, your aerial game needs to be more precise, and peach can stagegaurd the hel1 out of u
If you can't do any of your normal stuff, and the stuff you can do goes even at best, while Peach can still do all over her normal stuff, how is that not in Peach's favor?
I'll concede the fact that it's not as hard in NTSC as I thought it would be though. 55/45 in Peach's favor.
In NTSC this is the only true counter against Sheik in my opinion, much like Peach in PAL, nothing Sheik does works on Puff while Puff's entire moveset works on Sheik, 60/40.
though it feels like 99/1
Though I'll be honest, I hardly know the matchup so I might change my mind as I learn it.. :embarrass
*Side note*
I base this entirely on my Pound 4 experience playing the best Fox's (Mango, Lucky, Jman), the best Falco's (Zhu, DrPP, Mango), the best Jiggs (HungryBox (didn't play Mango)) and the best Peach (Armada) in the world.
Not entirely true. Yes, Sheik is worse in PAL, but fighting against Fox and Falco is actually harder in NTSC and you can't really grab Jiggs anyway so it doesn't change anything..
It's just fighting Peach that really changed.
You seemed to really enjoy the Dthrow combos against Armada.
Not by much. The grab is fun and all, but I don't really rely on it to kill Marth anyway, so for me all that changed is that Marth can actually spike me now..
before i read the rest of that amsah i left out the ways sheik can fight those chars on purpose
first off im not doubting your experience so ill get that out of the way (i also think there are better foxes than jman and lucky but w.e). i am an intelligent person who is capable of analyzing matchups and all that fun stuff. ill even type in serial mode to sound more legitimate.
Okay, maybe the Sheik vs. Fox matchup is 55-45. I really believe that there is a reason that Sheiks don't win major tournaments. Furthermore, good Jigglypuffs are a recent fad in the grand scheme of melee, and I could be mistaken, but I would never describe the Peach population as large. If Sheik goes even with Fox and has the advantage against Falco, why are there not more Sheiks? It would be logical that a character with so many matchups in her favor, in addition to going even with fox, would be a much more prevalent in tournament scenes. Yet, Sheik is a decidedly rare pick across the U.S. So Amsah I ask; why are Sheiks so rare if she has such comparatively good matchups against the two hardest and most common character choices?
The Peach vs. Sheik matchup has been argued extensively, so I'll take a different route on the matter. Most Sheiks believe the matchup is in Sheik's favor or even at worst. On the other hand, I believe that most peaches believe it to be even at best, and perhaps more still believe it to be a slight disadvantage. Perhaps the truth is evident from the majority of both parties view on the matter.
Finally, in relation to the Jigglypuff vs. Sheik matchup, Just because something has a high risk to reward ratio doesn't mean it is not worth it if the opportunity is there. Jigglypuff is not grab-proof. There is just a potential big penalty for messing up the grab. That being said, if you can get a grab go for it, its free damage.
Okay, maybe the Sheik vs. Fox matchup is 55-45. I really believe that there is a reason that Sheiks don't win major tournaments. Why are there not more Sheiks? It would be logical that a character with so many matchups in her favor, in addition to going even with fox, would be a much more prevalent in tournament scenes. Yet, Sheik is a decidedly rare pick across the U.S. So Amsah I ask; why are Sheiks so rare if she has such comparatively good matchups against the two hardest and most common character choices?
In Europe there are quite a lot of Sheiks (and she doesn't even have her lame grab) and she does win tournaments..:embarrass
Finally, in relation to the Jigglypuff vs. Sheik matchup, Just because something has a high risk to reward ratio doesn't mean it is not worth it if the opportunity is there. Jigglypuff is not grab-proof. There is just a potential big penalty for messing up the grab. That being said, if you can get a grab go for it, its free damage.
A 20% combo is not worth risking a stock for. So unless Jiggs is at high percentage and the risks and benefits are equal (you get it Jiggs dies, you miss you die) I wouldn't recommend grabbing.
Ok the only thing i wanna say is this. Jigs does not counter sheik. Its just the way i feel. You beat her on the ground. She beats you in the air. You still have set ups for your kill moves between d tilt and for tilt and if your lucky off of down throw. Your aerials still work against her so long as its properly spaced. Namely her b air. Sheik does lose alot of her advantages how ever. Your grabs are rendered use less. And you basicly die if you use up b. Maybe we wrong about sheik beating puff but i can say its either even or still in sheiks favor. Im going with dead even. Falco doesn't beat sheik. Its even. Fox either wins or its even. Sheik beats peach. Just my two cents.
the reason why there are no topsheik-mains is easy, amsah said it in a nice way, but to be honest, you guys just suck because you need your broken grab for everything
In Europe there are quite a lot of Sheiks (and she doesn't even have her lame grab) and she does win tournaments..:embarrass.
A 20% combo is not worth risking a stock for. So unless Jiggs is at high percentage and the risks and benefits are equal (you get it Jiggs dies, you miss you die) I wouldn't recommend grabbing.
2) Bah, you can't counter-argue with a different version of melee, however better it may be for Sheik. I think the real reason is the matchup ratio everyone else suggests.
2) Bah, you can't counter-argue with a different version of melee, however better it may be for Sheik. I think the real reason is the matchup ratio everyone else suggests.
For the sake of arguing version does matter. Fox is not as good over there and I don't Falco is as good either. I've heard you say peach is worse over there (except against sheik). Taking an argument from one version and applying it to another is like saying... I don't know. Wow that's the best soccer punter ever, I bet he would be the best kicker if he played football. Doesn't work like that.
For the sake of arguing version does matter. Fox is not as good over there and I don't Falco is as good either. I've heard you say peach is worse over there (except against sheik). Taking an argument from one version and applying it to another is like saying... I don't know. Wow that's the best soccer punter ever, I bet he would be the best kicker if he played football. Doesn't work like that.
Saying soccer is to football with PAL is to NTSC is not even remotely true.
3 our of the top 4 players play a character that's the same in PAL as in NTSC. And my character is relatively worse than in PAL, so no, it doesn't matter.
For the sake of arguing version does matter. Fox is not as good over there and I don't Falco is as good either. I've heard you say peach is worse over there (except against sheik). Taking an argument from one version and applying it to another is like saying... I don't know. Wow that's the best soccer punter ever, I bet he would be the best kicker if he played football. Doesn't work like that.
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