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Smash Bros. Canon Tournament! (Mario Vs. ????) - 06/14/10

Akuma2120

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Prove your first comment.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWdy-RAYSc8

You can kind of see it in this vid. Gah, most of the vids I find are blinded by the sun.

@EDIT: *facepalm* Oh yeah? Prove Samus' defensive capabilities = Darknut's/Iron Knuckle's defensive capabilities. Samus' armor hasn't been stripped off by anything except for story lasers.
Did not see

And prove what? That the concept matters because the only way to represent it is in a limited way due to hardware limitations? I think that speaks for itself:ohwell:

^@ Edit: There's no swords in Samus' games so we wouldn't know if it's possible to strip her armor in HER games, but we know in LINK'S games he can strip armor via sword attacks

It doesn't have to be the exact same, just made of metallic material
 

PowerBomb

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No, because saying the arrow travels that far in that amount of time is ludicrous. Not to mention the arrow pauses in the air as the Fire Arrows fall down.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAE68O65mMg&feature=related

Somewhere in there. It's still blinded (again).

EDIT: Samus' armor hasn't been torn off by swords, nor scythe's, nor lasers. Therefore, Link's sword won't tear off her armor. Stop making baseless claims. Link's sword doesn't tear off all metallic material.
 

Akuma2120

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No, because saying the arrow travels that far in that amount of time is ludicrous. Not to mention the arrow pauses in the air as the Fire Arrows fall down.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAE68O65mMg&feature=related

Somewhere in there. It's still blinded (again).

EDIT: Samus' armor hasn't been torn off by swords, nor scythe's, nor lasers. Therefore, Link's sword won't tear off her armor. Stop making baseless claims. Link's sword doesn't tear off all metallic material.
It is ludicrous but many things in the Zelda universe are ludicrous in terms of logic, your point?

And as I stated above, hardware limitations, this should not affect the concept

And still did not see

Proof that her armor is impervious? Why would a ZSS exist then? Reason is it's not right? My claim isn't baseless, Link can strip off metallic armor via sword attacks, Samus is wearing metallic armor, there's a connection.

Link's sword DOES strip off metallic material: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4oLE7fg7jeA
 

PowerBomb

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I'm not saying her armor is impervious, I'm saying her armor won't be torn off by Link's sword.

My god, it's like ANOTHER GALEKILL.

This is what you're basically saying.

Let's say you have armor made out of aluminum. Aluminum is metallic, but easy to rip apart.
Now let's say my friend has armor made out of steel. They're both metallic, right?

If my hands can rip apart the aluminum armor, which is metallic, I can rip apart the steel armor, right?

That's what you're saying.

EDIT: You know, prove that the arrow went to the sun. Look harder; there are two arrows. One that's still floating 'on it's way to the sun', and the fire arrows.
 

Akuma2120

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I'm not saying her armor is impervious, I'm saying her armor won't be torn off by Link's sword.

My god, it's like ANOTHER GALEKILL.

This is what you're basically saying.

Let's say you have armor made out of aluminum. Aluminum is metallic, but easy to rip apart.
Now let's say my friend has armor made out of steel. They're both metallic, right?

If my hands can rip apart the aluminum armor, which is metallic, I can rip apart the steel armor, right?

That's what you're saying.

EDIT: You know, prove that the arrow went to the sun. Look harder; there are two arrows. One that's still floating 'on it's way to the sun', and the fire arrows.
Link tears off metallic armor, prove that her armor is something much stronger than metallic material, otherwise it's coming off

That's what I'm asking for, proof that her armor is made of stronger metal than Iron which is known for it's high strength

I saw an arrow shot to the sun and fire arrows come back

And concept>hardware limitations, it's the concept that counts, if it were possible they still wouldn't do it because it's just a waste of space and time, it's the concept that counts here

Look neither of us are going to agree here, I've made my point, until you get proof of the material of Samus' armor I'm done arguing with you
 

KAOSTAR

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Pokemon can still use items tho right?

not tms to learn moves-trainer=backup lol

and whoever said that teleport was only to run from battles-You can use it to teleport to diff cities and locations. Theres no reason why you cant teleport a shorter distance and not actually leave the fight.
 

PowerBomb

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Metroid Prime 2: Echoes

In Sanctuary Fortress, there are lasers which turn on and off. These lasers can maul Samus and make her lose lots of HP. Her armor isn't torn off.

Metroid Prime (and 2 as well, I think)

Pirates have energy scythes, which they slice at Samus. Her armor doesn't chip off.
Every other huge-*** enemy mauls her and nothing gets stripped off.

What makes you think a swipe from Link's sword will do anything? Since Link's sword strips off their armor and stuff stronger than Link's sword doesn't strip off Samus' armor, Link's sword won't strip armor off. There.

The concept is stupid. The arrow never travels to the sun, it's visible right after you shoot it. Also, unless you can prove the stupid arrows go to the sun and come back, then you've not really done anything.

Hardware limitation = lawl

They could've just mirrored the shot with the Fire Arrow moving. If they can do that for pick-ups...

MY GOD, IT REALLY IS ANOTHER GALEKILL.
@above: Who cares, Mewtwo doesn't learn that crap anyway
 

Sasha

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Metroid Prime 2: Echoes

In Sanctuary Fortress, there are lasers which turn on and off. These lasers can maul Samus and make her lose lots of HP. Her armor isn't torn off.

Metroid Prime (and 2 as well, I think)

Pirates have energy scythes, which they slice at Samus. Her armor doesn't chip off.
Every other huge-*** enemy mauls her and nothing gets stripped off.

What makes you think a swipe from Link's sword will do anything? Since Link's sword strips off their armor and stuff stronger than Link's sword doesn't strip off Samus' armor, Link's sword won't strip armor off. There.

The concept is stupid. The arrow never travels to the sun, it's visible right after you shoot it. Also, unless you can prove the stupid arrows go to the sun and come back, then you've not really done anything.

Hardware limitation = lawl

They could've just mirrored the shot with the Fire Arrow moving. If they can do that for pick-ups...

MY GOD, IT REALLY IS ANOTHER GALEKILL.
@above: Who cares, Mewtwo doesn't learn that crap anyway
1) Well, the Master Sword is magical, so there's that...
2) Why does it matter if the sword can take off armor or not? All Samus has to do is RUN at Link and he freakin dies.
3) I agree that the arrow doesn't go all the way to the sun. I played OoT when I was like 8 years old and I noticed it then. It's still obvious now. >.>
4) All I can see stopping Samus is (possibly) Ice Arrows. Link just has to be able to take out his bow, shoot an arrow, AND hit Samus before Samus reaches super speed while running at him. She's supposed to be invincible at her max speed, so yeah.

I don't know anything about Wario, but I like the idea of Wario exploding because he ate an orange. :laugh:
 

Salem

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1) Well, the Master Sword is magical, so there's that...
2) Why does it matter if the sword can take off armor or not? All Samus has to do is RUN at Link and he freakin dies.
3) I agree that the arrow doesn't go all the way to the sun. I played OoT when I was like 8 years old and I noticed it then. It's still obvious now. >.>
4) All I can see stopping Samus is (possibly) Ice Arrows. Link just has to be able to take out his bow, shoot an arrow, AND hit Samus before Samus reaches super speed while running at him. She's supposed to be invincible at her max speed, so yeah.

I don't know anything about Wario, but I like the idea of Wario exploding because he ate an orange. :laugh:
Ice Arrow?

She'll just screw attack it becoming invincible and making the arrow do nothing and due to magic arrow lag(YES, I remember that wierd magic arrow limitation!) she'll just go and speed booster.
 

Diddy Kong

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What are you talking about?

Mewtwo is wild. Do you see a Master Ball summoning him? No, obviously not.
Cause in Melee, every character appears from Trophies. <_< There's no way telling. Besides, how'd Mewtwo learn Shadow Ball then? He appeared in Melee even with a TM move, why the hell can't he have his TM moves here while other characters get obsure **** as the Star Rod, in Bowser's case.

Do wild Pokemon know TM moves (not level-up moves)? No? Of course not.
Does Bowser lose his Star Rod at the end of Paper Mario? Of coarse he does.

Does Mewtwo have a trainer behind him? No, he doesn't. Can you select Mewtwo when you pick Pokemon Trainer? No, you can't.
Pokemon Trainer also wasn't there when Pika and Jiggly where fighting in Smash 64. Pokemon Trainer first appeared in Brawl, Mewtwo only appeared in Melee. Huge difference.

Mewtwo can't learn TMs. Sorry.
Then how'd he get Shadow Ball in Melee? We're using the Mewtwo who appears in Melee right? If he already learned himself a move for Melee, and if he learned himself moves in Pokemon Stadium like Thunderbolt and Blizzard then why can't he have TM moves?

EDIT: Actually, we'd place Pichu at level 100 (for potential) with IVs at 31. Level up movepool and blah blah blah
Well okay, but I still disagree.

EDIT2: Move tutors are only available via the trainer. Also, you dunno the mechanics of Me First, do you? It takes the move the foe was about to use, and uses it against them with 1.5x power. If it's not an attacking move, it fails. Invincibility spam
I'm still right here then. Mewtwo first uses Me First, Bowser does an attacking move, both get damage, Bowser probably has more damage, Mewtwo uses Psychic and Bowser dies.

I don't see mention of a trainer.
Neither do you see a mention of the trainer in Smash 64 for Pikachu and Jigglypuff. Pikachu's character bio is even his Pokedex data. Yet still it's not being used as a source. <_<

tldr; Mewtwo can learn TMs in Mystery Dungeon, he learned himself TMs in Pokemon Stadium and apperantly in Melee even, otherwise he didn't have Shadow Ball.
 

UncleSam

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Link tears off metallic armor, prove that her armor is something much stronger than metallic material, otherwise it's coming off

That's what I'm asking for, proof that her armor is made of stronger metal than Iron which is known for it's high strength

I saw an arrow shot to the sun and fire arrows come back

And concept>hardware limitations, it's the concept that counts, if it were possible they still wouldn't do it because it's just a waste of space and time, it's the concept that counts here

Look neither of us are going to agree here, I've made my point, until you get proof of the material of Samus' armor I'm done arguing with you
A knight's Armor can be cut off if hit at certain areas where the armor links to other plates.
Samus' armor doesn't have that mechanic. Brawl's indication of the armor "falling apart" was just so you can switch between Samus and Zamus. That doesn't actually happen.
 

Salem

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A knight's Armor can be cut off if hit at certain areas where the armor links to other plates.
Samus' armor doesn't have that mechanic. Brawl's indication of the armor "falling apart" was just so you can switch between Samus and Zamus. That doesn't actually happen.
Guys.

Smash Bros is non canon in here.

^^^^
Quote this when you hear anything about the smash series in here.

Move on. XD
 

UncleSam

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Guys.

Smash Bros is non canon in here.

^^^^
Quote this when you hear anything about the smash series in here.

Move on. XD
I know it isn't.
As for the current one, Diddy wins. If you have complaints redirect it to somebody who gives a crap (i.e. diddy kong).
Why are we still talking about M2 vs. bowser?
 

Diddy Kong

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The Mortal Draw in TP was able to cut of the armor of the Dark Nut enemies, who where heavily armored so it COULD be possible. But only if Samus would stand still and do nothing, which she wouldn't, which is the biggest point in this Link vs Samus thing... Samus will just not get hit by anything Link has.

Samus' abilites >>> every other Smash character's abilites. Including even Ganondorf imo, but he can't be killed so. <_< It's natural Link loses to Samus, everone does so get over it.

Found this about Wario btw: http://www.mariowiki.com/Wario

"Powers and Abilities
His strength is many times stronger than a normal man. He is fat but has extraordinary arm strength. He is so strong that his strength exceeds his rival Mario and rivals that of Donkey Kong and even the powerful Bowser. In Wario World, Wario could use his strength to punish his enemies in a variety of ways, including the Piledriver, Corkscrew Conk, and Wild Swing-Ding.

Wario is commonly associated with explosives, including Bob-ombs, and ways of stealing coins, such as a magnet or even a large vacuum of sorts.

Wario's greatest strength, though, is with items, such as the Garlic Pot, Jet Pot, Bull Pot, and Dragon Pot, which give him amazing and unique transformations. He also shares some transformations with Mario such as Fire Wario and Metal Wario. Wario has other various ways in transformings, resulting in transformations such as Crazy Wario, Flat Wario, Fat Wario, Frozen Wario, Electric Wario, and many more. Wario also has the power of farting to stun his opponets."

I think I was right here, Diddy needs to keep his range in this match up. Still think Wario would be stupid enough to eat an Orange Grenade, so that's a plus for Diddy.
 

UncleSam

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Alright.
You find Mewtwo as a wild pokemon.
Probably the best moveset for Mewtwo would be:
Me First (mewtwo is faster then bowser and will duplicate the move of bowser before bowser does it.)
Miracle Eye (all of mewtwo's attacks will ignore evasion and accuracy modifiers allowing mewtwo to hit bowser better)
OR
Recover (this move is obvious, it will allow Mewtwo to tank bowser.)
Psychic (this move is a given)
Psycho Cut (with good accuracy and A high critical hit ratio, this move will be devastating)
OR
Swift(this ignores all evasion in general)
 

Diddy Kong

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Well then most likely Mewtwo would still win if Bowser uses an attacking move first. Mewtwo uses Me First, Bowser attacks then Mewtwo finishes with Psychic. I think that'd be enough, and given Bowser's slowness it'd work.
 

Falcon88

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Alright.
You find Mewtwo as a wild pokemon.
Probably the best moveset for Mewtwo would be:
Me First (mewtwo is faster then bowser and will duplicate the move of bowser before bowser does it.)
Miracle Eye (all of mewtwo's attacks will ignore evasion and accuracy modifiers allowing mewtwo to hit bowser better)
OR
Recover (this move is obvious, it will allow Mewtwo to tank bowser.)
Psychic (this move is a given)
Psycho Cut (with good accuracy and A high critical hit ratio, this move will be devastating)
OR
Swift(this ignores all evasion in general)
Ey, guys. Sorry to just jump in, but wouldn't Psycho Cut be worse than Psychic since Psycho Cut is a physical attack, and Mewtwo's Sp. Atk. is wayyyy better than his Attack? Well, I suppose we could EV train this Mewtwo.

As for Samus vs. Link, that seemed like Samus will win to me at first. Although you can't count out the Triforce of Courage! The Goddesses have the ultimate power, you know. Not to mention Link's awesome that way.
 

UncleSam

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Ey, guys. Sorry to just jump in, but wouldn't Psycho Cut be worse than Psychic since Psycho Cut is a physical attack, and Mewtwo's Sp. Atk. is wayyyy better than his Attack? Well, I suppose we could EV train this Mewtwo.
Mewtwo's Base Atk is 110. It maxes at 350 so...
but if you wanna roll like that Aura Sphere can replace Psycho Cut.


As for Samus vs. Link, that seemed like Samus will win to me at first. Although you can't count out the Triforce of Courage! The Goddesses have the ultimate power, you know. Not to mention Link's awesome that way.
I haven't played an LoZ game in a while, what does this provide Link with?
oh and Samus has this:

don't forget the precious.
 

Falcon88

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I haven't played an LoZ game in a while, what does this provide Link with?
oh and Samus has this:

don't forget the precious.


Oh snap. Yeah...
Well, Link may not have a ship, but he has skills! Literally! Let's see, provided he has enough magic, he could use Nayru's Love, which would make him temporarily invincible... At which point he could do just about anything. If you want to go TP-style, just give him the Magic Armor, and there's a big advantage. (Magic Armor negates damage as well.)

Although Samus is pretty uber herself. That armor is nothing to sneeze at, and it gives her initeresting abilities, such as super speed. Man, this really is kind of a toss-up. But, if Link's invincible, well...
 

UncleSam

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Oh snap. Yeah...
Well, Link may not have a ship, but he has skills! Literally! Let's see, provided he has enough magic, he could use Nayru's Love, which would make him temporarily invincible... At which point he could do just about anything. If you want to go TP-style, just give him the Magic Armor, and there's a big advantage. (Magic Armor negates damage as well.)

Although Samus is pretty uber herself. That armor is nothing to sneeze at, and it gives her initeresting abilities, such as super speed. Man, this really is kind of a toss-up. But, if Link's invincible, well...
Link is invincible until he runs out of rupees/magic.
and Samus has OHK headshots like the Imperialist and Nova Beam.
 

Diddy Kong

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Magic wears out after a while, Samus could just use Speed Booster and let Link waste precious time trying to deal damage while still being invincible. Potions run out after a while to, and no doubt Samus does more damage to Link than Link does to Samus.
 

Diddy Kong

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Yeah I remember that from Prime 3. Someone borrowed it from me and I never finished it, but Hyper Mode is awesome yeah.

Btw, Mother 3 is a bit too gay friendly for my tastes. =/
 

PowerBomb

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Cause in Melee, every character appears from Trophies. <_< There's no way telling. Besides, how'd Mewtwo learn Shadow Ball then? He appeared in Melee even with a TM move, why the hell can't he have his TM moves here while other characters get obsure **** as the Star Rod, in Bowser's case.
Melee is not canon. Samus can hold her charge shot in that game, but that's not canon. Her bomb's in Brawl don't explode when in close proximity, that's not canon. Bowser's just using items he had from that game since he himself can get them without anyone else blah blah blah'ing. Mewtwo needs a trainer. He has no trainer because the trophy does not state he has a trainer, nor do you see any mention of a trainer. There is no trainer! If there was, he'd appear alongside Mewtwo with that animation and as a trophy. But he doesn't.
Does Bowser lose his Star Rod at the end of Paper Mario? Of coarse he does.
He still uses it the entire game.
Pokemon Trainer also wasn't there when Pika and Jiggly where fighting in Smash 64. Pokemon Trainer first appeared in Brawl, Mewtwo only appeared in Melee. Huge difference.
So? That shows Mewtwo doesn't have a trainer. Regardless of trophies or appearance, if he had a trainer, it wouldn't have been that hard to include a trainer trophy of Red or something.
Then how'd he get Shadow Ball in Melee? We're using the Mewtwo who appears in Melee right? If he already learned himself a move for Melee, and if he learned himself moves in Pokemon Stadium like Thunderbolt and Blizzard then why can't he have TM moves?
1. Smash is not canon. Pikachu learns Skull Bash in that game, but not in his version games. But we should give him Skull Bash because he knows it in Melee, amirite?
I'm still right here then. Mewtwo first uses Me First, Bowser does an attacking move, both get damage, Bowser probably has more damage, Mewtwo uses Psychic and Bowser dies.
Again, Bowser invincifies himself/heals or something. You're assuming he's attacking, I'm assuming he's not. Besides, the first thing Bowser would do is try to invincify himself.
Neither do you see a mention of the trainer in Smash 64 for Pikachu and Jigglypuff. Pikachu's character bio is even his Pokedex data. Yet still it's not being used as a source. <_<
So? He has no trainer. My god, is it really that hard to figure out that when there is no mention of a trainer nor a trophy of him, that Mewtwo has no trainer?
tldr; Mewtwo can learn TMs in Mystery Dungeon, he learned himself TMs in Pokemon Stadium and apperantly in Melee even, otherwise he didn't have Shadow Ball.
1. Pokemon Mystery Dungeon is a spin-off. It is not canon to the version series in any way.
2. Dunno 'bout stadium, but something was up with it. Mewtwo did weird stuff there, didn't he?
3. Melee is NOT canon.
4. Don't bring up Pokemon Mystery Dungeon again. It breaks EVERYTHING
 

UncleSam

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Again, Bowser invincifies himself/heals or something. You're assuming he's attacking, I'm assuming he's not. Besides, the first thing Bowser would do is try to invincify himself.
Mewtwo goes first. It will copy anything and at that time Bowser won't be invincible when M2 uses Me First.
and If bowser attacks he's screwed.
It's more like a tie.
 

Diddy Kong

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Mewtwo goes first. It will copy anything and at that time Bowser won't be invincible when M2 uses Me First.
and If bowser attacks he's screwed.
It's more like a tie.
It's very true to Bowser's cocky personality that he'll try to attack first. Likely he'd underestimate Mewtwo, and think he could destroy him easily if he'd just attack. So yeah, that way he'd lose.

I think a draw would be the best solution here. Both characters belong to the same tier anyway I believe.
 

Salem

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Melee is not canon. Samus can hold her charge shot in that game, but that's not canon. Her bomb's in Brawl don't explode when in close proximity, that's not canon. Bowser's just using items he had from that game since he himself can get them without anyone else blah blah blah'ing. Mewtwo needs a trainer. He has no trainer because the trophy does not state he has a trainer, nor do you see any mention of a trainer. There is no trainer! If there was, he'd appear alongside Mewtwo with that animation and as a trophy. But he doesn't.


He still uses it the entire game.


So? That shows Mewtwo doesn't have a trainer. Regardless of trophies or appearance, if he had a trainer, it wouldn't have been that hard to include a trainer trophy of Red or something.


1. Smash is not canon. Pikachu learns Skull Bash in that game, but not in his version games. But we should give him Skull Bash because he knows it in Melee, amirite?


Again, Bowser invincifies himself/heals or something. You're assuming he's attacking, I'm assuming he's not. Besides, the first thing Bowser would do is try to invincify himself.


So? He has no trainer. My god, is it really that hard to figure out that when there is no mention of a trainer nor a trophy of him, that Mewtwo has no trainer?


1. Pokemon Mystery Dungeon is a spin-off. It is not canon to the version series in any way.
2. Dunno 'bout stadium, but something was up with it. Mewtwo did weird stuff there, didn't he?
3. Melee is NOT canon.
4. Don't bring up Pokemon Mystery Dungeon again. It breaks EVERYTHING
Let's bring up Pokemon Mystery Dungeon again, as nintendo didn't say if the game was canon or not. >_>
 

Diddy Kong

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If Mystery Dungeon is allowed, Bowser deffiantly loses. There's move linking for example, which let's Pokemon able to fuse all of their moves, and do them all in one turn. There's are items like Berries which restore full health and other items which do... other stuff. Ohhh, and of coarse TMs, and even equipment of sorts.
 

REL38

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It's very true to Bowser's cocky personality that he'll try to attack first. Likely he'd underestimate Mewtwo, and think he could destroy him easily if he'd just attack. So yeah, that way he'd lose.

I think a draw would be the best solution here. Both characters belong to the same tier anyway I believe.
Who has more options here?

Bowser has a grandeous amount of healing, attack and status effect items.

Bowser has the Star Rod that makes him invincible, use lightning, use shock waves and heal damage.

Bowser has great defense, fire capabilities, teleportation, sharp claws and a giant jump.


What does Mewtwo have that makes him
anything?
Me First and Psychic.

That's only 2 moves that you're relying on here.
Bowser outnumbers Mewtwo in options.

What's guaranteeing that Me First would be a OHKO?
Nothing.
You're just assuming that.
Bowser can very well tank a hit.

So what does he do then?
Go invincible.
Use a status item.
Heal.

But the thing is, Bowser would be using Invincibility right off the bat.
Using their "mindset" as a reason isn't good enough and isn't guaranteed.

Bowser has more options, lives longer and has invincibility.

Explain to me how an opponent with vastly greater chances of winning only manages a tie with a Pokemon with average defenses, limited useful moves and no way of healing itself?


@Mystery Dungeon

Sure, Pokemon are always shown to have their own community in the wild while they are never shown to interact with each other in the main series. As well as ignore the fact that this is all happening in the same region as the main series takes place. Sounds legit enough . . . oh wait . . .
 

Crystanium

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That's what I don't agree with, you're going with game limitation logic instead of common sense, so the trees in the game don't get cuts, that doesn't mean trees in in the series are impervious to sword strike, I'm sure if there was a cutscene or a need to cut a tree down with a sword it would happen.
So, what do you want, realism or in-game limitations? Because from what it seems, that arrow example of arrows flying at 187 mph is realistic. You, on the other hand, go off to say that it flies at superluminous speed. It takes 8 seconds for the light from the Sun to travel to Earth. Link's arrows would have to fly at superluminous speed to get to the Sun from Hyrule. You then say that it's in the game, and it's illogical, so big deal. It seems like this benefits Link, but when something isn't in Link's favor, you seem to dismiss it.

But by your logic it is not possible, i do not agree with your approach with this, I vote for common sense, if Link slashes at a tree, the trees gonna get cut, instead of your logic, which would be that since Link cannot cut any part of a tree that DK could hide behind a bunch of branches and Link would never be able to approach him, this is not an efficent way to go about this, it creates too many questionable limitations
That's not called "common sense." That's called "realism." In reality, if Link struck a tree with his Master Sword, it would leave a mark from the sword. So, which is it going to be? A tree doesn't get damaged by the Master Sword. That's unrealistic. An arrow flying to the Sun in a matter of seconds is also unrealistic. If a tree takes damage, then the arrows Link fires will be traveling on a realistic level as well. The reason why I said the temples wouldn't be smashed is because this is simply how the game would work. In reality, I'm sure the temples could be smashed if Link had something to break them with.

If she truly can run at those speeds then I agree Link is ****ed, slowing time down would do the trick via Farore's Wind + Inverted Song of Time but that's only if she doens't use this ability right away
Playing an ocarina takes more than one second. The Speed Booster takes one second to start up. After that, Samus is running at supersonic speeds. If Link plays his music, he is left open. Also, Farore's Wind can only be used inside dungeons. Even if it was allowed, Farore's Wind also takes time, which leaves Link open. If Samus travels at Mach 4.9, she'll be running 1 mile per second.

And here I thought you were still using game logic instead of real world logic:ohwell:, in OOT the arrows Link shoots hit targets very far away pretty much instantaneously so we should use that as reference:p, I believe it also goes to the sun to get the fire arrow within seconds, super speed arrows FTW:psycho:
Would the developers want us to wait for an arrow to travel to the Sun? That would be mighty boring if we had to wait for days before we acquired the Fire Arrows. Oh, I know, let's make it to where when you fire an arrow, you don't have to wait for a very long time. Let's make it instantaneous. I'm sticking with the 187 mph.

Like Samus' grappble beam, you could only use it on specified objects, not everything so Link's shield wouldn't be grappable,
Samus has grabbed metal and energy objects with her Grapple Beam. In Super Metroid, when Samus fights Draygon, one of the ways she can defeat Draygon very quickly is by allowing Draygon to grab her. Once this happens, Samus can equip the Grapple Beam, and when Draygon gets close enough for Samus to use the Grapple Beam on an electric current, she can grab it with the Grapple Beam, electrocuting Draygon in the process and killing him. In Metroid Prime 3: Corruption, there is an object obstructing the way on Bryyo to get an Energy Tank. If you scan it, it says it can be pulled with an "electrolaser." The object is metal. The jetpacks Samus strips off her opponents are metal. Interestingly, the Korakk Beast she fights isn't metal, nor energy. It's a living creature. The Mirror Shield is made of metal.

this is a game limitation set to balance the game just like the Giant's Mask, you can't set one to be ok but not the other, it has to be yes for all or no for all, let's use some realistic sense saying she can grapple whatever she wants, then we must also say Link can use the masks wherever he wants
So far, I've proven from in-game that Samus can use the Grapple Beam to latch onto metal objects, living creatures, and electric conduits. Your turn.

BTW Link has shown to be able to strip armor off Darknuts and Iron Knuckles with his sword so he could strip Samus'
By cutting the back part of the Darknut, right? See WW and TP for details. Iron Knuckles were never given a weakness. It was just, "Strike the Iron Knuckle multiple times until the armor falls off." Anyway, Samus' armor is not Medieval armor. It's powered armor. This armor is protected by a layer of energy, which is created by the Energy Tanks. The more Samus has, the longer she can put up with attacks. Besides that, Samus doesn't need to approach Link anyway, and if she does, she can use the Speed Booster. Or she could just use the Screw Attack. I mean, that would work, too.

By that, I meant he cannot mean what you're saying because that would contradict the in-game evidence, game evidence>what developer's say is true, can't change what's there no matter what, so it's more like even if he didn't mean that, it doesn't matter
How would it contradict in-game evidence?

Nintendo has officially stated there is no timeline to Zelda, yet miyamoto has said there is, contradiction, this is why you ignore these people and look to the game only
http://www.zeldauniverse.net/zelda-news/there-is-no-timeline/
Did you read why NoA said there wasn't a time line? I read the link already. It was an automated machine. But, again, Miyamoto said they're not the same Link.

Explain what else it could be when it involves same soul different body
I'm still waiting for you to prove that a spirit of Link is being reincarnated. I don't need to do any explaining. You do.

It says that he is the ancient hero of legend, I would suppose that these deities having been watching over hyrule would know who he is so who else would they be referencing, so you're doubting their knowledge despite having shown much about the history of hyrule? That is futile
I doubt the way you interpret it.

"It was a sign that the power of the chosen one rests within you...and that they are awakened. Look at your awakened form. The green tunic that is your garb once belonged to the ancient hero chosen by the gods... His power is yours, his true power that slept within you. Your name is Link. You are the hero chosen by the gods."

Get to interpreting. Explain, please. I'll get back to explaining a few issues here later.

So which Link is it then, if the TC agreed to this and established it, why is it not in the OP? Not listing all the rules does not help, if the TC has agreed that only 1 version of Link is to be used then fine, but that is mighty gay, just take Link off this list then or put at the very bottom immediately because people against Link can just choose his weakest version and say the character they support would win, what a cheap method
Nope. Maybe you didn't read what else I said when I was replying to someone. I said that when galekill was here, he used Link from OoT, while TP was used as a side note. I said that Link in SSB and SSBM were from OoT. Link in SSBB is from TP. We stuck with OoT Link, because he is stronger than Link in TP. No one is choosing the weakest incarnation. If anything, we're going with the strongest of the two for the selection. Link just ended up fighting against Samus first, probably because the two characters are similar.

One more thing though, with playing songs to slow time or use nayru's love which has startup time, how is it you get to decide what the character would do, maybe they would just sit there and laugh at Link playing a song, you see this is why I say you list what is possible for them to do rather than what you think they would do, which is why I say Link would dodge grapple beam, you apply certain rules to one character and not the other, how can you go about this and think it reasonable?
But we're all saying what we think these characters would do. Like I said before, "You're saying what you would do if you were in Link's position. Is that what Link would actually do?" We're all guilty of this.

In the end, it really doesn't matter, though. Characters have been given ships they use in-game. Captain Falcon used his Blue Falcon, Fox, Falco, and Wolf used their Arwing and Wolfen ships, and Meta Knight was allowed to use his Halberd. I then asked if Samus was allowed to use the Gunship as she did in Metroid Prime 3: Corruption. WhatIsRaizen? permitted this in the previous pages. Not that Samus would need to use her Gunship, though. Let's see if Link would be able to defeat Samus, though, if one incarnation was combined with every item. So throw every item out on the table and tell me why it would be effective against Samus.
 

Diddy Kong

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Who has more options here?

Bowser has a grandeous amount of healing, attack and status effect items.

Bowser has the Star Rod that makes him invincible, use lightning, use shock waves and heal damage.

Bowser has great defense, fire capabilities, teleportation, sharp claws and a giant jump.


What does Mewtwo have that makes him
anything?
Me First and Psychic.

That's only 2 moves that you're relying on here.
Bowser outnumbers Mewtwo in options.

What's guaranteeing that Me First would be a OHKO?
Nothing.
You're just assuming that.
Bowser can very well tank a hit.

So what does he do then?
Go invincible.
Use a status item.
Heal.

But the thing is, Bowser would be using Invincibility right off the bat.
Using their "mindset" as a reason isn't good enough and isn't guaranteed.

Bowser has more options, lives longer and has invincibility.

Explain to me how an opponent with vastly greater chances of winning only manages a tie with a Pokemon with average defenses, limited useful moves and no way of healing itself?


@Mystery Dungeon

Sure, Pokemon are always shown to have their own community in the wild while they are never shown to interact with each other in the main series. As well as ignore the fact that this is all happening in the same region as the main series takes place. Sounds legit enough . . . oh wait . . .
Your assuming yourself as well here man. <_<

And I don't think your reading my post well. What makes Mewtwo win, even without TMs is indeed Me First, and Psychic. Why? Cause the fight would go like this:

Mewtwo concentrates on using Me First
Bowser attacks
Me First comes into play, 1.5 x damage to Bowser of his original attack
Damage to Mewtwo
-Next "turn"
Mewtwo uses Psychic cause he's faster, or Aura Sphere if teleporting somehow gets priority which I doubt.
Dead Bowser

I'm not denying Bowser can't dish out good damage to Mewtwo, or can take a few hits from him. He might very well be able to do that.

However, you can't deny that Me First is a great advantage for Mewtwo, if Bowser decides to attack first.

And what about Disable? Mewtwo could likely disable Bowser from using the Star Rod.
Also you said Mewtwo can't heal? What about recover? <_<

Besides, Mewtwo's defences aren't average. Maybe amongst the ubers yeah, but comparing to the rest of the Pokemon, it's high above average.

His Special Attack is only beaten by Deoxys in Attack Mode, thus he'd deal a huge amount of damage to Bowser. And if Bowser's defences REALLY are so awesome, Mewtwo could just Guard Swap, and then OHKO Bowser.

There's still plenty of options for Mewtwo. It depends all on who does what first, thus this match is best described as a draw.
 

UncleSam

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oh god everybody is assuming and flaming, it's turning into the TDB! quick everybody duck and cover! loljk
What does it mean by invincibility?
In paper mario, he was invincible to Mario's attacks.
Psionics was never mentioned.

just something to munch on.
 

Diddy Kong

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I doubt that Bowser could turn Mewtwo in a block. <_<; No doubt he's able to resist things like that. Did Bowser ever used it as an attack on Mario or anyone?

Raizen make this a draw please.
 
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