Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Jubileus57]

I cannot wait to have more information on AT and other similar stuff so we can reopen the graveyard thread from the Sm4sh speculation . That field of gravestones really was a sight to behold.

I hope Chandeelure will still provide us the picture.

 

[Roberk]

I believe we will get 2 of the following 4 things before E3:

Fire Emblem Direct
Pokemon Direct
Smash Direct
General Direct

Reasoning: I can't see Nintendo cramming an E3 full of Pokemon, Fire Emblem, Smash Bros, Animal Crossing, Yoshi, Retros new DKC and MP4 all into a single 30 minute direct.

FE, Pokemon and Smash have all been announced but we've yet to see any gameplay so I bet we will see something beforehand so E3 can focus on unannounced titles coming like DKC and Animal Crossing (Strong hints and teases they will be at E3 this year!)

FE has an anniversary today (Awakening), multiple anniversaries tomorrow on the 20th (FE1, SOV), and FE7's 15th anniversary on the 25th.

If we are predicting announcements based upon important dates for a franchise, I could definitely see an FE Direct soon. Probably next week since the Directs this year have been announced on Wednesdays and played on Thursdays. It would fill the gap between March's Direct and June's E3, and Nintendo has had big stuff on April Directs (Smash 4, MK8, Splatoon 2, Arms).

 

[Chandeelure]

I don't want to sound biased, but I think a Kirby character is pretty likely.
It doesn't really have to be Bandana Dee, because Sakurai can decide for another character that he likes more or something.

But the Kirby franchise has been huge for the last years, with all the 25th Anniversary stuff.
Kirby Cafe, Kirby Train, A LOT of merchandise, Kirby's Blowout Blast, Team Kirby Clash Deluxe, Kirby Battle Royale and obviously, Kirby Star Allies.

I don't know, Sakurai must be crazy to ignore all that lol.
(I'm ready for moar Super Star content)

I cannot wait to have more information on AT and other similar stuff so we can reopen the graveyard thread from the Sm4sh speculation . That field of gravestones really was a sight to behold.

I hope Chandeelure will still provide us the picture.

Sure, it was fun haha.
I've already been asked to do it again, but we still don't see disconfirmations, so the thread is not necessary for now.

 

[Jubileus57]

I don't want to sound biased, but I think a Kirby character is pretty likely.
It doesn't really have to be Bandana Dee, because Sakurai can decide for another character that he likes more or something.

But the Kirby franchise has been huge for the last years, with all the 25th Anniversary stuff.
Kirby Cafe, Kirby Train, A LOT of merchandise, Kirby's Blowout Blast, Team Kirby Clash Deluxe, Kirby Battle Royale and obviously, Kirby Star Allies.

I don't know, Sakurai must be crazy to ignore all that lol.
(I'm ready for moar Super Star content)

Kirby is much too huge to ignore, really. After all it is one of the biggest series out there with as few as 3 reps. I mean, if Fire Emblem can have 6 reps Kirby sure can have 4 or 5.

Sure, it was fun haha.
I've already been asked to do it again, but we still don't see disconfirmations, so the thread is not necessary for now.

Hopefully it will be soon

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

FE has an anniversary today (Awakening), multiple anniversaries tomorrow on the 20th (FE1, SOV), and FE7's 15th anniversary on the 25th.

If we are predicting announcements based upon important dates for a franchise, I could definitely see an FE Direct soon. Probably next week since the Directs this year have been announced on Wednesdays and played on Thursdays. It would fill the gap between March's Direct and June's E3, and Nintendo has had big stuff on April Directs (Smash 4, MK8, Splatoon 2, Arms).

Arms was actually in May. I only make that distinction to say that I think a May direct is just as likely (if not more at this point at the end of April).
(Edit: double checked and apparently there was Arms info in April as well. I thought you were referring to the Arms specific direct in May. My bad!)

While I still don't think we will get Smash news before E3, historically we have had directs in April-May before E3 (last year I think there were 2 actually) so it is absolutely possible, crossing fingers for some news.

 

[Phaazoid]

I don't want to sound biased, but I think a Kirby character is pretty likely.
It doesn't really have to be Bandana Dee, because Sakurai can decide for another character that he likes more or something.

But the Kirby franchise has been huge for the last years, with all the 25th Anniversary stuff.
Kirby Cafe, Kirby Train, A LOT of merchandise, Kirby's Blowout Blast, Team Kirby Clash Deluxe, Kirby Battle Royale and obviously, Kirby Star Allies.

Unpopular opinion - every character from the Kirby series that's important enough to deserve a role in smash is already in there, and Kirby will get no new reps.

 

[New_Dumal]

Literally talking **** about my two most wanted unprovoked.

Come at me,bro.
At least I talk ***** about characters, while you do about people.
There's probably some character we both want,but I can't ignore the fact that WAAAAA and fire tiger are zzzzz.

Unpopular opinion - every character from the Kirby series that's important enough to deserve a role in smash is already in there, and Kirby will get no new reps.

We came to a point where the "deserving game" is no longer usable. I see a lot of people talk this same thing about Dk and it hurts. So I won't be sad with Kirby. I want Bandana Dee more than any Zelda newcomer... that's a series I think is good as it is now.

 

[Jubileus57]

Unpopular opinion - every character from the Kirby series that's important enough to deserve a role in smash is already in there, and Kirby will get no new reps.

If Bandana Dee doesn't deserves to be in Smash not many people do. Looking back at the last Kirby games, he had appeared en every game in some way or another, more often than not in a prominent role. I'd say he is right on par with Dedede and Meta Knight.

In fact looking back at the three last big games bar Star Allies each of the three had a very prominent role while the other two weren't as prominent (if not absent) in one of them: Dedede in Triple Deluxe, Meta Knight in Planet Robobot and Bandana Dee in Rainbow Curse. Culminating with Star Allies where the Dee is the first Dream Friend one can get and one of the only three that are not DLC with, you guessed it, Dedede and Meta Knight.

And he IS very popular amongst the fans.

Biased? Maybe a bit but one cannot deny that HAL has been heavily pushing him as THE fourth Kirby character.

 

[RodNutTakin]

Personally if Waluigi gets in his moveset should reflect his personality much like Wario's moveset.

His personality in question? Cheating to win.

Imagine if he pulled out-of-the-box tactics in his gameplay (Air swimming instead of an airdodge, a down throw that buries the opponent [essentially, his Assist Trophy attack], a rather high double jump complemented with a vertically-weak [read: less height than Little Mac] but multiple-use up special, a parodic take on a down special Counter attack)

 

[Chandeelure]

Unpopular opinion - every character from the Kirby series that's important enough to deserve a role in smash is already in there, and Kirby will get no new reps.

It's OK, it's just your opinion.

Give me your lunch money, now.

 

[Deleted member]

Come at me,bro.
At least I talk ***** about characters, while you do about people.
There's probably some character we both want,but I can't ignore the fact that WAAAAA and fire tiger are zzzzz.

GR8 B8 M8

I would hope there isn't a single character we both desire. Not with that sort of taste.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

If Bandana Dee doesn't deserves to be in Smash not many people do. Looking back at the last Kirby games, he had appeared en every game in some way or another, more often than not in a prominent role. I'd say he is right on par with Dedede and Meta Knight.

In fact looking back at the three last big games bar Star Allies each of the three had a very prominent role while the other two weren't as prominent (if not absent) in one of them: Dedede in Triple Deluxe, Meta Knight in Planet Robobot and Bandana Dee in Rainbow Curse. Culminating with Star Allies where the Dee is the first Dream Friend one can get and one of the only three that are not DLC with, you guessed it, Dedede and Meta Knight.

And he IS very popular amongst the fans.

Biased? Maybe a bit but one cannot deny that HAL has been heavily pushing him as THE fourth Kirby character.

I still wouldn't say he's on par with Dedede and Meta Knight, they have an incredibly rich history with the series and have brought it to where it is now, and they're also still bosses in the games even if they're playable, and as such play a more prominent part than Bandana Dee does.

The rest I do agree with, Bandana Dee has still been a very successful introduction to the series and has cemented himself as part of the main cast, I haven't encountered one person who hasn't been happy with his inclusion, he just slotted in so naturally. It's definitely gotten to the point where Kirby's representation in Smash doesn't feel quite complete without him, put him in and I think Kirby will be set for the next many installments.

 

[Roberk]

Arms was actually in May. I only make that distinction to say that I think a May direct is just as likely (if not more at this point at the end of April).
(Edit: double checked and apparently there was Arms info in April as well. I thought you were referring to the Arms specific direct in May. My bad!)

While I still don't think we will get Smash news before E3, historically we have had directs in April-May before E3 (last year I think there were 2 actually) so it is absolutely possible, crossing fingers for some news.

Yeah Smash is pretty unlikely, I’m just hoping for some news on anything at this point. 3 months with nothing is just cruel.

 

[Blargg888]

Personally if Waluigi gets in his moveset should reflect his personality much like Wario's moveset.

His personality in question? Cheating to win.

Imagine if he pulled out-of-the-box tactics in his gameplay (Air swimming instead of an airdodge, a down throw that buries the opponent [essentially, his Assist Trophy attack], a rather high double jump complemented with a vertically-weak [read: less height than Little Mac] but multiple-use up special, a parodic take on a down special Counter attack)

Wow, that actually sounds really cool.

Like, Waluigi can use moves or tactics that would normally only be possible by cheating, but he's still just as good as anyone else.

That sounds pretty hilarious honestly. Like, Waluigi goes into a freefall-like animation every time he uses his up-special, but he can keep using it five times before he actually goes into freefall, or something. That'd be pretty cool.

 

[Senselessbreak]

FE has an anniversary today (Awakening), multiple anniversaries tomorrow on the 20th (FE1, SOV), and FE7's 15th anniversary on the 25th.

If we are predicting announcements based upon important dates for a franchise, I could definitely see an FE Direct soon. Probably next week since the Directs this year have been announced on Wednesdays and played on Thursdays. It would fill the gap between March's Direct and June's E3, and Nintendo has had big stuff on April Directs (Smash 4, MK8, Splatoon 2, Arms).

Ya I expect an FE direct very soon. E3 is only 7 weeks away so they need to announce something soon.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Yeah Smash is pretty unlikely, I’m just hoping for some news on anything at this point. 3 months with nothing is just cruel.

Reminds me of that one year we went like...what 4 months? Without news after E3. God that was terrible.

(Edit: Found it! June 16 2015 to November 12 2015.....wow.)

 

[Phaazoid]

If Bandana Dee doesn't deserves to be in Smash not many people do. Looking back at the last Kirby games, he had appeared en every game in some way or another, more often than not in a prominent role. I'd say he is right on par with Dedede and Meta Knight.

In fact looking back at the three last big games bar Star Allies each of the three had a very prominent role while the other two weren't as prominent (if not absent) in one of them: Dedede in Triple Deluxe, Meta Knight in Planet Robobot and Bandana Dee in Rainbow Curse. Culminating with Star Allies where the Dee is the first Dream Friend one can get and one of the only three that are not DLC with, you guessed it, Dedede and Meta Knight.

And he IS very popular amongst the fans.

Biased? Maybe a bit but one cannot deny that HAL has been heavily pushing him as THE fourth Kirby character.

Honestly, I think I'm at the point where I agree that not that many people do deserve to be in smash. As much as we want a giant roster, it can't extend indefinitely. Both of our opinions are definitely biased, as is everyone's opinion ever, because we are humans and inherently have bias. My bias comes from liking older kirby games a lot more than newer ones, where bandanna dee wasn't even a thing. One thing I like about the character is the fact that he fights with a spear. I love the aesthetic of foot soldiers with spears (mainly because of fire emblem). I see where you're coming from and don't think any of your arguments are wrong but I personally don't really want another Kirby character. :shrug:

We came to a point where the "deserving game" is no longer usable. I see a lot of people talk this same thing about Dk and it hurts. So I won't be sad with Kirby. I want Bandana Dee more than any Zelda newcomer... that's a series I think is good as it is now.

Well it's less the game to me, and more importance to the series. But it's just my opinion. I know know there are a lot of people who want to see more characters from the series.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Deserving is subjective and I honestly think we're not ones to talk about who is or isn't deserving of being in the series.

Especially on a forum where a lot of us talked mad **** about Pac Man of all people getting in last game.

There were also people who talked mad **** about Ryu, Mr. Fighting Game getting in.

As if neither deserved it. One is the whole reason video games became a thing and the other sparked and ignited the genre Smash is.

And there were people here who thought they had no right to be in Smash.

So I think what some of this community has to say about ''deserving" kinda needs to be thrown out the window.

 

[Chandeelure]

Wow, that actually sounds really cool.

Like, Waluigi can use moves or tactics that would normally only be possible by cheating, but he's still just as good as anyone else.

Bayonetta already does that.

Has a Triple Jump, Double Up Special, can counter a Jab and kill you, frame 1 Air Dodge, has combos in Smash 4 that aren't Down Throw + Aerial...

Bayonetta is a better cheater than Waluigi.

 

[Yoshi-Thomas]

With absolutely no news, I'm leaning more towards a completely new game than a Smash Bros For. +, this is thrilling!
I want a trailer like we had for Brawl at this point, like six newcomers at once.
But I also want to keep the surprise until the very end. This is a strange feeling.

Deserving is subjective and I honestly think we're not ones to talk about who is or isn't deserving of being in the series.

Especially on a forum where a lot of us talked mad **** about Pac Man of all people getting in last game.

There were also people who talked mad **** about Ryu, Mr. Fighting Game getting in.

As if neither deserved it. One is the whole reason video games became a thing and the other sparked and ignited the genre Smash is.

And there were people here who thought they had no right to be in Smash.

So I think what some of this community has to say about ''deserving" kinda needs to be thrown out the window.

The problem is not deserving being in Smash or not, since many characters (one-shot, reoccuring, retro, 3rd party...) could get this reward, after all, being Waluigi, the Dee, Ridley, Dixie, K. Rool, Impa, Excitebiker, Donkey Kong Jr. (isn't it Donkey Kong?), and hundreds of others.
It's that for people, it'll always look like the said character stole the spot of another one.
When Pac-Man was confirmed, the arguments probably were something like "A Nintendo character couldn't get in because of Pac-Man" or for Ryu "Ryu, a third-party, is a DLC newcomer when many other Nintendo franchises didn't get another representant in this game".

I don't know the criterias Sakurai uses to make his roster, but one of them is certainly not that "If X is in, then Y shouldn't".
He doesn't have hatred towards characters, but he certainly won't waste time finding ideas to make characters work if he doesn't find them in time, nor completely delay the game to add a character not working (Ice Climbers).

Think about the poor man. He will never please anyone because whatever he adds/removes, he'll receive praises and insults.

"Too many third-parties!"
"Too many clones!"
"Too many Mario dudes!"

We don't have the final word in any case (well except maybe this time with the Smash Ballot!), so why would we be mad when we get a character? We don't know if the character we wanted could have been added anyway.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Deserving is subjective and I honestly think we're not ones to talk about who is or isn't deserving of being in the series.

Especially on a forum where a lot of us talked mad **** about Pac Man of all people getting in last game.

There were also people who talked mad **** about Ryu, Mr. Fighting Game getting in.

As if neither deserved it. One is the whole reason video games became a thing and the other sparked and ignited the genre Smash is.

And there were people here who thought they had no right to be in Smash.

So I think what some of this community has to say about ''deserving" kinda needs to be thrown out the window.

People talked **** about pac-man? I truly have no recollection of that what is wrong with them lmao

 

[Yoshi-Thomas]

People talked **** about pac-man? I truly have no recollection of that what is wrong with them lmao

The only thing Pac Man did wrong was trying to eat Adam Sandler, and failling.

 

[Deleted member]

Deserving is subjective and I honestly think we're not ones to talk about who is or isn't deserving of being in the series.

Especially on a forum where a lot of us talked mad **** about Pac Man of all people getting in last game.

There were also people who talked mad **** about Ryu, Mr. Fighting Game getting in.

As if neither deserved it. One is the whole reason video games became a thing and the other sparked and ignited the genre Smash is.

And there were people here who thought they had no right to be in Smash.

So I think what some of this community has to say about ''deserving" kinda needs to be thrown out the window.

Oh, I remember those times.

I mean, it was one thing to see Pac-Man as possibly boring of a character since none of us had any idea he'd be like the way he is in Smash, but to say he didn't deserve it when he's goddamn PAC-MAN and Namco was involved with development was rather silly.

Though I think most people's fears in regards to the Pac was that he'd be like his Ghostly Adventures counterpart and thus, people didn't really want him.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

People talked **** about pac-man? I truly have no recollection of that what is wrong with them lmao

A lot of people for some reason thought he was a waste of spot and not relevant.

Let me put it this way. They said he wasn't relevant because his modern games weren't huge hits.

These were the same people who praised Mega Man. Mega Man's franchise was truly dead at the time.

None of them seemed to understand Pac Man would be getting in on the merit that he's the god-father of all video games and didn't get why that was such a big deal when you know Mario was already in the game.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

A lot of people for some reason thought he was a waste of spot and not relevant.

Let me put it this way. They said he wasn't relevant because his modern games weren't huge hits.

These were the same people who praised Mega Man. Mega Man's franchise was truly dead at the time.

None of them seemed to understand Pac Man would be getting in on the merit that he's the god-father of all video games and didn't get why that was such a big deal when you know Mario was already in the game.

Yikes, I knew some people on here had to be dumb as hell but that's just...wow...lmao

 

[Pacack]

People talked **** about pac-man? I truly have no recollection of that what is wrong with them lmao

I can confirm that people argued that Pac-Man would be too generic or that he wasn't enough of an icon to be included.

I wish I was kidding.

 

[Pakky]

A lot of people for some reason thought he was a waste of spot and not relevant.

Let me put it this way. They said he wasn't relevant because his modern games weren't huge hits.

These were the same people who praised Mega Man. Mega Man's franchise was truly dead at the time.

None of them seemed to understand Pac Man would be getting in on the merit that he's the god-father of all video games and didn't get why that was such a big deal when you know Mario was already in the game.

I remember a lot of people saying that dude from Tales was bigger than Pac-man.

These people aren't dumb just uncultured. (The man's art is on the side of the cabinet, of course he would have hands and feet...)

 

[Pacack]

I remember a lot of people saying that dude from Tales was bigger than Pac-man.

These people aren't dumb just uncultured.

Yep. Klonoa was touted as a better alternative too.

 

[Pakky]

Yep. Klonoa was touted as a better alternative too.

Who? The rabbit thing that's like NiGTHs right?

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Who is deserving is just really all opinion based.

Like we might not even have Wario if it weren't for WarioWare.

And I think most of us are of the opinion that's just hecka wrong considering how much of a popular Nintendo character he was even before that.

However Sakurai's opinion was that Wario was boring before WarioWare. So you know...

Again subjective opinions really influence who is or isn't deserving even in Sakurai's eyes.

 

[Opossum]

A lot of people for some reason thought he was a waste of spot and not relevant.

Let me put it this way. They said he wasn't relevant because his modern games weren't huge hits.

These were the same people who praised Mega Man. Mega Man's franchise was truly dead at the time.

None of them seemed to understand Pac Man would be getting in on the merit that he's the god-father of all video games and didn't get why that was such a big deal when you know Mario was already in the game.

If I had a quarter for each time I saw people say "Pac-Man is only known for one arcade game and a ton of shovelware" as if he was some D-list character, I'd be able to straight up buy the arcade machine.

Dark times, man. I was wary over potentially getting Ghostly Adventure Pac-Man, too, but those people acted like he had ONLY the original arcade game and GA under his belt. People were so ignorant to his actual historical significance.

Honestly I'm just proud I correctly guessed he'd have one of his specials be Pac-Dot Chain. Yeah, I thought it'd be mapped to Up Special, but still. That made me happy.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Who is deserving is just really all opinion based.

Like we might not even have Wario if it weren't for WarioWare.

And I think most of us are of the opinion that's just hecka wrong considering how much of a popular Nintendo character he was even before that.

However Sakurai's opinion was that Wario was boring before WarioWare. So you know...

Again subjective opinions really influence who is or isn't deserving even in Sakurai's eyes.

Wasn't wario considered for melee tho? Or am I misremembering something?

 

[Pakky]

I'm starting to think if a 7th gen guy does get in Incenaroar might make more sense.

There are no wrestlers in Smash.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

I'm starting to think if a 7th gen guy does get in Incenaroar might make more sense.

There are no wrestlers in Smash.

There aren't any archers either...I mean Link and Pit have bows but they have one move with them lol. There aren't any mermaids either

 

[MrReyes96]

I was thinking of Impa in smash, they could explain in a canonical way she could appear as a younger version of her breath of the wild appearence.
Remember Purah’s aging reversing rune?

Spoiler

 

[True Blue Warrior]

A lot of the argument used against Pac-Man showcases just how misused the term "relevancy" is as it has everything to do with importance, not recency. Historical relevancy is a thing that exist.

There’s countless examples of characters, stories, games, etc. that have not received an update in decades, centuries, or millennia yet are still relevant because they continue to have an impact on the people who know them, possibly even cultural impact. But based off how misued the word is, you'd think relevancy=being flavour of the month.

 

[Deleted member]

Believe it or not, Waluigi is the one charcter I’ve wanted longer than anyone else.

I was only 7 when Brawl released, so of course I wasn’t heavy on speculation back then. My older brother followed the Dojo every day for updates, and I clearly remember him showing me that Wario was in the game, and me wondering why they hadn’t shown Waluigi with him yet. It was pretty disappointing when he showed up, but he wasn’t playable. I’ve been requesting him ever since.

I’m really hoping 7-year-old me finally gets vindication this time around

I wanted Waluigi ever since I got into Smash Bros.
So I wanted Waluigi for like... six to seven years.

I'm not a Waluigi hater but I'd rather see Toad and Paper Mario playable first.

I disagree with this. Waluigi would be a lot more hype than those two combined to be honest.

 

[Deleted member]

There aren't any archers either...I mean Link and Pit have bows but they have one move with them lol.

Here's the thing that I have with the logic of "no archers".
Pit for all intents and purposes in the original Kid Icarus was an archer. Bow and arrow was his primary method of attack if not his only means of attack.
Then it was mapped to only one move in Smash and more focus was put on having a brand new double-bladed weapon that could be used as one large weapon or two smaller ones in his Smash debut.

What is really stopping Sakurai from giving Decidueye just one arrow based attack for a Special and just focusing more on wings, talons, beak, wind, etc. instead?

 

[Kotor]

I was thinking of Impa in smash, they could explain in a canonical way she could appear as a younger version of her breath of the wild appearence.
Remember Purah’s aging reversing rune?

Spoiler

One problem with your examples. They're literally Paya with a different name. Maybe Impa did resemble Paya in her youth, but a young Impa never appeared in the memory cutscenes.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Sure, it was fun haha.
I've already been asked to do it again, but we still don't see disconfirmations, so the thread is not necessary for now.

We've had a couple of minor disconfirmations but thanks to the tricksy nature of NDAs we can't trust them.