Somethin' stuck in your beard? Share a tip!

[Exalted]

Oh, now I get it. Thanks.

 

[Makke]

..................

 

[Breezy]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6B5QxFBBIs

Platform canceling explained in depth.

Also, Mr. R's combo video "Messiah" shows how to make great use of it.

 

[Mystu82]

hmm.... ive never knew about that

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Always throw Samus offstage.

Always.

Pretty much the only way you'll ever be killing her is with DAir or BAir, offstage.

 

[Noobicidal]

Always throw Samus offstage.

Always.

Pretty much the only way you'll ever be killing her is with DAir or BAir, offstage.

I'd really rather not try messing with her offstage.

 

[KillerJawz]

Always throw Samus offstage.

Always.

Pretty much the only way you'll ever be killing her is with DAir or BAir, offstage.

Ummmm..... What?

Samus's offstage game is near to unrivaled by a very large majority of the cast. You try and bair or dair us off stage and you're not coming back. We'll simply space our bombs, then zair the ledge so you can't recover.

 

[Terodactyl Yelnats]

Ummmm..... What?

Samus's offstage game is near to unrivaled by a very large majority of the cast. You try and bair or dair us off stage and you're not coming back. We'll simply space our bombs, then zair the ledge so you can't recover.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBf8YXlJZ3I

Or 3:01 would happen.

 

[Vermanubis]

Not if you WPC.

 

[Terodactyl Yelnats]

Not if you WPC.

Well, WPC too broke though.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I always forget she has ZAir.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Always throw Samus offstage.

Always.

Pretty much the only way you'll ever be killing her is with DAir or BAir, offstage.

Actually no, throw her upwards, juggle her offstage, THEN kill her.

That's how you do it properly. But yes, all your kills against Samus have to be edgeguards.

 

[KillerJawz]

.................

I would like you to actually play this match up before you start actually talking about it.

inb4a2zreplieswiththeorycraft

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I'm not even entirely sure sometimes A2Z has ever even played Brawl.

 

[Vermanubis]

I have pretty good experience with this MU, playing Clove, Rhyme and a few others. The best way to kill Samus is just kill her, honestly. You can tipman if she's beneath you offstage, but only low enough that you can recover back on stage if she ZAirs the ledge. She's not that hard to kill regularly. She's middle-weight.

 

[KillerJawz]

I have pretty good experience with this MU, playing Clove, Rhyme and a few others. The best way to kill Samus is just kill her, honestly. You can tipman if she's beneath you offstage, but only low enough that you can recover back on stage if she ZAirs the ledge. She's not that hard to kill regularly. She's middle-weight.

*Sigh* She's 7th heaviest in the game, making her a heavy weight.

But yes, EVERYTHING you said is exactly right. I knew it was the right decision to dedicate my life to you.

It may also be nice to note that it's practically impossible for Samus to UpB OoS nearly every move in your arsenal.

 

[Vermanubis]

Is she really that heavy? I never would've guessed. o_O

Anyway, speaking of Up-B, I also wanna mention that if Samus is below you offstage by a considerable amount, if you miss a tipman, her up-B will carry you back up 9/10 times.

 

[KillerJawz]

Is she really that heavy? I never would've guessed. o_O

It's because she's floaty. She dies quicker off the top and lives really long off the sides.

Anyway, speaking of Up-B, I also wanna mention that if Samus is below you offstage by a considerable amount, if you miss a tipman, her up-B will carry you back up 9/10 times.

That's true. However, should your DI not be on point, Samus will stage spike you with UpB. I've gotten wins at 0% with this. Her stage spike with UpB has DISGUSTINGLY high base knockback (as you can probably tell, seeing as UpB always FORCES the opponent into the screw attack).

 

[Vermanubis]

Which sucks, because getting in close enough on the ground in this MU to DAir is virtually impossible. Also yeah, I've been spiked with it before.

 

[A2ZOMG]

.................

I would like you to actually play this match up before you start actually talking about it.

inb4a2zreplieswiththeorycraft

You wouldn't know, but I've actually gotten some pretty legit Samus experience offline, hence why I can tell everyone to never jump against her unnecessarily. I know from playing Ganon vs Samus that you have to kill her by edgeguarding. Actually throwing her forward however isn't always the best idea, when she can attempt to airdodge -> Z-air.

Actually landing Ganon's ground moves in this matchup is stupidly difficult, partly because Samus's ground game is better, also because she's in the air too much zoning. At best he's going to be fishing for DAs and grabs here and there, and after that do as much damage with juggles as possible. Landing Smashes and tilts is almost out of the question in this matchup, especially since Flame Choke only leads to Jab on Samus.

Generally speaking Ganon's aerials and DA aren't going to be fresh enough to kill Samus onstage. Smart edgeguarding is pretty much how he makes up for it.

 

[KillerJawz]

You wouldn't know, but I've actually gotten some pretty legit Samus experience offline, hence why I can tell everyone to never jump against her unnecessarily. I know from playing Ganon vs Samus that you have to kill her by edgeguarding. Actually throwing her forward however isn't always the best idea, when she can attempt to airdodge -> Z-air.

Well the Samus you're playing is hideous to say the least. To get edgeguarded is just appauling, let alone by Ganon. You won't kill a good Samus by edgeguarding her. You will have to READ her. Apply pressure on her, bait her OoS options, force her into a position where her options are limited, for example, up close. You will NOT be killing Samus offstage.

Actually landing Ganon's ground moves in this matchup is stupidly difficult, partly because Samus's ground game is better, also because she's in the air too much zoning. At best he's going to be fishing for DAs and grabs here and there, and after that do as much damage with juggles as possible. Landing Smashes and tilts is almost out of the question in this matchup, especially since Flame Choke only leads to Jab on Samus.

You actually honestly believe our ground game is that much better then yours to even worth mentioning? We're not even going to be in a position to use our ground game like that, simply because we fear giving you ANY opportunity to Gerudo, even if it leads to a jab, Samus will not appreciate you being able to chase us like that. A good read, and we're pretty much gone. A good and I repeat GOOD Ganon will be getting those reads, landing those smashes when he can, punishing a jump up close with a uair OoS and applying just enough pressure on her shield for her to do something. Samus won't and can't roll OoS, she'll have to do something else, this is where Ganon can capitalize.

Generally speaking Ganon's aerials and DA aren't going to be fresh enough to kill Samus onstage. Smart edgeguarding is pretty much how he makes up for it.

Once again, incorrect. See now, had Verm, who has quite clearly proven to me he has legit Samus experience told me what you had, I would have gladly responded to him in a much more... leniant tone, because it would have been clear he was just simply questioning something. I don't appreciate you giving out this wrong information to upcoming Ganon mains who have a hard enough time as it is without you leading them astray. I do not mean to sound offensive but seriously, only post if you actually know what you're talking about, or have something you desperately feel needs to be contributed to the match up.

Also correct me if I'm wrong, but shouldn't this one-sided discussion be taking place in some kind of export?

 

[A2ZOMG]

Well the Samus you're playing is hideous to say the least. To get edgeguarded is just appauling, let alone by Ganon. You won't kill a good Samus by edgeguarding her. You will have to READ her. Apply pressure on her, bait her OoS options, force her into a position where her options are limited, for example, up close. You will NOT be killing Samus offstage.

You're pretty bad at reading English.

Ganon has to kill Samus with edgeguards to WIN.

Does it make sense how bad this matchup is for Ganon? Killing her onstage is so difficult that he has to resort to difficult edgeguards to keep up.

You actually honestly believe our ground game is that much better then yours to even worth mentioning? We're not even going to be in a position to use our ground game like that, simply because we fear giving you ANY opportunity to Gerudo, even if it leads to a jab, Samus will not appreciate you being able to chase us like that. A good read, and we're pretty much gone. A good and I repeat GOOD Ganon will be getting those reads, landing those smashes when he can, punishing a jump up close with a uair OoS and applying just enough pressure on her shield for her to do something. Samus won't and can't roll OoS, she'll have to do something else, this is where Ganon can capitalize.

Samus's tilts, particularly F-tilt, are plenty annoying for Ganon to deal with, just since Ganon's options for punishing at that range aren't very good.

And Ganon's Flame Choke is only good for land traps unless his opponent sucks or makes a really big mistake on the ground. You're being pretty irrational not looking at the bigger picture of what Ganon's options are. It's true that a good Flame Choke read can lead to kills, but you don't really understand how much it hurts Ganon to lack the option of tilt when doing Flame Choke shenanigans. With D-tilt, Ganon could start resets, and even better, SAFELY pick up on DI patterns while doing 20 damage. And besides, Ganon doesn't pose a real poke threat to Samus outside of his Dash attack. If she has to wait in shield, it's not unsafe since a Flame Choke can be dodged on reaction, and any other move on shield is punished.

You obviously don't understand what you're talking about. I have a lot of experience using Ganon, and I've promoted the advancement of his metagame.

 

[Bat_Tom]

This has probably been mentioned before, but DON'T CARE NECESSARILY:

Interesting edge guard:
Thanks to Ganon's EPIC [/sarcasm] jumping, it's possible to return to the stage after Wizard's Footing off the edge!
1. At the very edge, hop once (full height).
2. At the apex of the jump, WIZARD'S FOOT.
3. 2nd Jump like your life depends on it.
4. Dark Dive straight up, and in the opposite direction.
Came up with it while raging about Meta Knight and trying to come up with ways to keep his *** off the stage. Turns out his WF blows through MK's UAir, a move I've noticed TourneyMKs using in combo with the multiple jumps to prevent interception.

 

[KillerJawz]

You're pretty bad at reading English.

Kay. Unnecessary flame much?

Ganon has to kill Samus with edgeguards to WIN.

Are you even reading what I'm writing down here?

Does it make sense how bad this matchup is for Ganon? Killing her onstage is so difficult that he has to resort to difficult edgeguards to keep up.

No, it isn't. See, you're so fixed on theorycrafting you've forgotten how players adapt. Ganon is a bad character, you know this, the player however, is a totally different story. You can read and manipulate your opponent's actions, how do you think one Ganon is better then another? Simple, it's the player. You clearly seem to have forgotten this.

Samus's tilts, particularly F-tilt, are plenty annoying for Ganon to deal with, just since Ganon's options for punishing at that range aren't very good.

That's true, but at lower percentages, a ftilt is unsafe on hit and we will get punished for it. Let alone the fact that as a Ganon main, your PSing should be on point, if you're getting hit by ftilt, you're going in for a UPHILL struggle.

And Ganon's Flame Choke is only good for land traps unless his opponent sucks or makes a really big mistake on the ground.

Or you could simply READ THE OPPONENT. As said by my good friend Noobicidal "Ganon thrives from good reads".

Spoiler

Namesearch bait

You're being pretty irrational not looking at the bigger picture of what Ganon's options are.

I'm the one being irrational about it? Just look at what you're saying. You're not even LOOKING at my posts, you're just looking for something that disagrees with your logic.

It's true that a good Flame Choke read can lead to kills,

Then how on earth could you argue that killing Samus ONSTAGE is difficult? You can't kill her offstage. You CANNOT KILL HER OFFSTAGE. Understand this.

but you don't really understand how much it hurts Ganon to lack the option of tilt when doing Flame Choke shenanigans. With D-tilt, Ganon could start resets, and even better, SAFELY pick up on DI patterns while doing 20 damage.

Then work with what you've got.

You obviously don't understand what you're talking about. I have a lot of experience using Ganon, and I've promoted the advancement of his metagame.

And yet your own Ganons joke about you. Laugh at you. You have promoted absolutely nothing. You may have a lot of experience with Ganon, but certainly not in this match up. I actually just want to see you against any top ten Samus player and see how you cope. I am asking you this, not as a poster of smashboards, not as a moderator, but as a human being. Accept that you are wrong.

 

[A2ZOMG]

I read your posts. The problem with your posts is that you're just as stubborn as I am and insistent that you are correct. And if you want to accuse me of theorycrafting, keep in mind you're participating in it as well. Both of us are explaining our experiences and knowledge of the matchup as we've played and seen in.

I could turn around basically 80% of your post and use it as my own argument since it's about player adaptation.

You have to read the Samus and adapt to her to win, and chances are, it's not going to let you kill her onstage, just because Ganon's options to set up into kill moves onstage is too terrible. Landing Flame Choke is hugely impractical on Samus most of the time, partly because it's easy for Samus to avoid, also because the guaranteed followups on her suck and thus leave her fairly low risk for rolling backwards. Sure you might be able to eventually convince her to do something more punishable, but it's not something a Ganon player can rely on considering how hard it is to land the Choke in the first place.

You say I'm fixed on theorycrafting, when in fact my posts are based on offline experience.

It's when Samus is above Ganon, and offstage where Ganon barely has enough options to make a read that might kill her. Even if it's just edgetrapping her, it's a position that Ganon needs in order to set up kills.

And you overrate Samus's recovery slightly. It's solid for sure, but it's not untouchable. No recovery is completely untouchable, since everyone has to fundamentally land or reach the edge. Grabbing the ledge and preventing her from tethering helps. People do make mistakes, and Samus's Up-B can be beaten by various moves Ganon does.

 

[Heartstring]

You're pretty bad at reading English.

Ganon has to kill Samus with edgeguards to WIN.

Does it make sense how bad this matchup is for Ganon? Killing her onstage is so difficult that he has to resort to difficult edgeguards to keep up.

Samus's tilts, particularly F-tilt, are plenty annoying for Ganon to deal with, just since Ganon's options for punishing at that range aren't very good.

And Ganon's Flame Choke is only good for land traps unless his opponent sucks or makes a really big mistake on the ground. You're being pretty irrational not looking at the bigger picture of what Ganon's options are. It's true that a good Flame Choke read can lead to kills, but you don't really understand how much it hurts Ganon to lack the option of tilt when doing Flame Choke shenanigans. With D-tilt, Ganon could start resets, and even better, SAFELY pick up on DI patterns while doing 20 damage. And besides, Ganon doesn't pose a real poke threat to Samus outside of his Dash attack. If she has to wait in shield, it's not unsafe since a Flame Choke can be dodged on reaction, and any other move on shield is punished.

You obviously don't understand what you're talking about. I have a lot of experience using Ganon, and I've promoted the advancement of his metagame.

okay, seeing as this is the 'share a tip' thread, i think ill share one with a2 right now...or three actually

-samus is most comfortable when on the ledge, she has the largest ledge sweetspot in the game, she can grab it from miles away with zair too, also she has an above average up-b and generally a great recovery, and all of her kills come from being offstage too.
-when reading an opponent samus and getting a flame choke, she doesnt have 4 options, but instead has two. and its a well known fact that both of samus's rolls are so bad that you can stomp her out of it, before the roll is even close to being finish (i think theres like, 20 frames in vulnerability before she can do anything else). in this case you can actually jsut watch her roll and act accordingly
-and even if you dont fancy trying to predict/watch what the samus does, you can jab her straight out of flame choke anyway, giving you a situation reset which you asked for in this post.
ive played a top samus many many times and i can tell you-from experience, i admit-that jumping off vs. samus is basically saying 'take my stock'

and so 3 kind little tips (plus extra data) from your loving sword user, who also fails miserably against samus ^_^

 

[A2ZOMG]

-samus is most comfortable when on the ledge, she has the largest ledge sweetspot in the game, she can grab it from miles away with zair too, also she has an above average up-b and generally a great recovery, and all of her kills come from being offstage too.

Grab the ledge first before she Z-airs. Get lucky with D-air and U-air, which beat her other recovery options if they're connecting.

-when reading an opponent samus and getting a flame choke, she doesnt have 4 options, but instead has two. and its a well known fact that both of samus's rolls are so bad that you can stomp her out of it, before the roll is even close to being finish (i think theres like, 20 frames in vulnerability before she can do anything else). in this case you can actually jsut watch her roll and act accordingly

I'm sorry but have you even played this matchup? Samus's getup rolls are average. No different from those from most other characters. She's not excessively vulnerable for rolling away out of Flame Choke. Just like it is for everyone else, it's a conservative option she has against Flame Choke.

Even better, waiting on the ground before moving is an option for everyone when getting Flame Choked by Ganon.

-and even if you dont fancy trying to predict/watch what the samus does, you can jab her straight out of flame choke anyway, giving you a situation reset which you asked for in this post.

Yeah. And can we edgeguard her? I think you have to really be good at it to beat Samus.

ive played a top samus many many times and i can tell you-from experience, i admit-that jumping off vs. samus is basically saying 'take my stock'

Depends on how far you jump out. But yeah, it's not easy to edgeguard her safely. Too bad Ganon doesn't really have more reliable options of killing her.

 

[Heartstring]

Grab the ledge first before she Z-airs. Get lucky with D-air and U-air, which beat her other recovery options.

I'm sorry but have you even played this matchup? Samus's getup rolls are average. No different from those from most other characters. She's not excessively vulnerable for rolling away out of Flame Choke. Just like it is for everyone else, it's a conservative option she has against Flame Choke.

Even better, waiting on the ground before moving is an option for everyone when getting Flame Choked by Ganon.

Yeah. And can we edgeguard her? I think you have to really be good at it to beat Samus.

Depends on how far you jump out. But yeah, it's not easy to edgeguard her safely. Too bad Ganon doesn't really have more reliable options of killing her.

yknow onstage stomp kills samus at like 120% or something stupid, also fsmash kills at reasonable percents, samus has decent horizontal DI so i reckon about 90%. just get a good read from a flame choke, much safer then jumping offstage where you will undoubtedly die
also, i tend not to trust luck when im offstage, in teh words of the great john smith 'no nonsense'

 

[Vermanubis]

Relax, guys. A2 and Jawz both have good points. Jawz is absolutely correct in that which kill Samus via edgeguarding is not the brightest idea against top Samuses. A2 has good points about Ganon's ability to threaten Samus offstage under the right circumstances.

I'm more interested in using my new music editing software right now, but just keep it civil, guys.

 

[KillerJawz]

I read your posts. The problem with your posts is that you're just as stubborn as I am and insistent that you are correct.

See but that's the thing. I'm not only going off of what I've played, I'm going off of many other Samus players experiences with Ganondorf. I am just as, if not more stubborn then yourself, but when you spew this kind of stuff, I have to step in.

I could turn around basically 80% of your post and use it as my own argument since it's about player adaptation.

Yes, then we consider the tools each character has off and onstage.

You have to read the Samus and adapt to her to win, and chances are, it's not going to let you kill her onstage, just because Ganon's options to set up into kill moves onstage is too terrible.

See you're taking parts of what I'm saying, putting them into your own post then going back to your old posting style.

Landing Flame Choke is hugely impractical on Samus most of the time, partly because it's easy for Samus to avoid, also because the guaranteed followups on her suck and thus leave her fairly low risk for rolling backwards.

Yes it's easy to miss, but I'm not only talking about gerudo here. You know about applying pressure on people. That's what you need to do here. Apply the pressure just well enough where she is FORCED to airdodge or shield. She's STUCK in her shield, what can she do? Absolutely nothing.

You say I'm fixed on theorycrafting, when in fact my posts are based on offline experience.

Offline from when exactly?! Who was this Samus!? Do you have videos!? Perhaps the Samus could come and give us his/her thoughts on the match up?

It's when Samus is above Ganon, and offstage where Ganon barely has enough options to make a read that might kill her. Even if it's just edgetrapping her, it's a position that Ganon needs in order to set up kills.

Go on then, tell me. What exactly are you going to "trap" me off stage with? You do realise that I'm obviously in the lead in this scenario, and you've just put one of the greatest off stage characters... OFFSTAGE... BAHAHA. Oh wow I'm sorry I'm actually in tears writing this, forgive my punctuation errors.

And you overrate Samus's recovery slightly. It's solid for sure, but it's not untouchable. Grabbing the ledge and preventing her from tethering helps. People do make mistakes, and Samus's Up-B can be beaten by various moves Ganon does.

I didn't mention a word about her recovery.

Either way, I'm done here. I await the day when you take a Samus offstage and get gimped below 50.

Good day Ganons, thank you for having me here. Summary: Take Samus offstage = loss of a stock/timeout.

 

[A2ZOMG]

yknow onstage stomp kills samus at like 120% or something stupid, also fsmash kills at reasonable percents, samus has decent horizontal DI so i reckon about 90%. just get a good read from a flame choke, much safer then jumping offstage where you will undoubtedly die
also, i tend not to trust luck when im offstage, in teh words of the great john smith 'no nonsense'

Stomp probably kills her much earlier than that when fresh, but actually landing it is hard, especially against Samus. If you can somehow to convince her to roll inwards after choke (which is probably even harder to land than Stomp in the first place), go for it.

F-smash kills basically anyone from 80-90%, but Samus has too many moves that outrange and outspeed it. And again, your best way of landing it is somehow finding a way to land Flame Choke, which in itself is hard to do in this matchup.

As for edgeguarding, I personally think it's a weakness of a lot of players who don't understand there are skillful ways to universally edgeguard safely and effectively, but players that utilize solid reactions are somewhat uncommon for this game sadly. Not that Ganon edgeguards Samus easily, but in the face of lacking any more reliable options, it's an option you have to consider.

Yes it's easy to miss, but I'm not only talking about gerudo here. You know about applying pressure on people. That's what you need to do here. Apply the pressure just well enough where she is FORCED to airdodge or shield. She's STUCK in her shield, what can she do? Absolutely nothing.

What options does Ganon have to pressure? It's basically threat of DA. Not impressive. He still loses to shield since Samus has faster and safer options out of shield than most of what Ganon has. Samus's poke options, and even her airdodge are threats Ganon can't just ignore when dealing with Samus on the ground.

And there aren't any videos of TonyGuacamole's Samus yet. You could try PMing him, but he's not on SWF very much.

 

[Heartstring]

Stomp probably kills her much earlier than that when fresh, but actually landing it is hard, especially against Samus. If you can somehow to convince her to roll inwards after choke (which is probably even harder to land than Stomp in the first place), go for it.

F-smash kills basically anyone from 80-90%, but Samus has too many moves that outrange and outspeed it. And again, your best way of landing it is somehow finding a way to land Flame Choke, which in itself is hard to do in this matchup.

As for edgeguarding, I personally think it's a weakness of a lot of players who don't understand there are skillful ways to universally edgeguard safely and effectively, but players that utilize solid reactions are somewhat uncommon for this game sadly. Not that Ganon edgeguards Samus easily, but in the face of lacking any more reliable options, it's an option you have to consider.
What options does Ganon have to pressure? It's basically threat of DA. Not impressive. He still loses to shield since Samus has faster and safer options out of shield than most of what Ganon has. Samus's poke options, and even her airdodge are threats Ganon can't just ignore when dealing with Samus on the ground.

And there aren't any videos of TonyGuacamole's Samus yet. You could try PMing him, but he's not on SWF very much.

im sorry but simply enough your not listening, techchase them, read them, predict what they wll do in any given situation, when you do that you will find yourself having a much easier time landing d-airs and fsmashes.
for example-yes i know its wifi and yes i know its ganon ditto's-most of the game was spend predicting the other persons movement and then attacking accordingly, there are only a few things ganon can do to bair, but punishing a move? i can say that he is at least competent at that.
there are ways to edgeguard safely, there are also ways to prevent an edgeguard safely with the right characters
i too say goodnight, exams in the morning, *sadface*

 

[A2ZOMG]

Hey I know how prediction works. Everyone uses it all the time. I'd dare say that my prediction skills are at least decent, though I prefer to rely on hard reads sparingly.

What's left to predict against a Samus who simply camps you? She doesn't really need to worry about most of Ganon's ground moves when she just wins in range and speed in most situations minus the ones where she's directly above you. And in the event she does get Flame Choked (which is very difficult to do), Flame Choke Jab just isn't enough, and it's fundamentally complicated to punish her wakeup effectively if she chooses to wait or roll away.

You're more likely to find reasonably early kills on Samus by watching her recovery and outspacing her offstage. You'll definitely get her offstage at some point in the matchup if you're patient. And by landing a hit on her closer to the blastzone (or getting a spike), it effectively makes up for stale moves in this matchup.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Uhh, A2, if someone is just camping, you do realize it's really, REALLY easy to predict what she does, right?

And why bother going for the early kills? So long as we aren't offstage, with good DI she kills us at like 200%. We kill her at half that. You seem to be forgetting that Ganon learns the moves "Powershield" and "Spotdodge".

Can we buffer a dash attack to hit Samus before she gets up? I can never find the chart when I need it.

 

[Heartstring]

Uhh, A2, if someone is just camping, you do realize it's really, REALLY easy to predict what she does, right?

And why bother going for the early kills? So long as we aren't offstage, with good DI she kills us at like 200%. We kill her at half that. You seem to be forgetting that Ganon learns the moves "Powershield" and "Spotdodge".

Can we buffer a dash attack to hit Samus before she gets up? I can never find the chart when I need it.

no, her animation ends too fast, however we can jab her just because of the general height she is when we buffer it

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Alrighty, so only Jab works, but really, what's it matter? Learn her habits, and tech chase with a STOMP. After all, Samus rolls. They still make me chuckle.

 

[Heartstring]

Alrighty, so only Jab works, but really, what's it matter? Learn her habits, and tech chase with a STOMP. After all, Samus rolls. They still make me chuckle.

i tried explaining this, still this is the tip thread and not a matchup export thread, so i think this topic needs t obe dropped now

 

[the king of murder]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=285736

Verm, could you stick the whole page to this thread please? This has basically become a Samus MU discussion.

Edit: G.P ninja'd me.

 

[Exceladon City]

Okay, so I was scrolling down the character boards and I see "Something Stuck In Your..." and I see that "The King of Murder" posted. So me being me, I ended up reading it as "Something Stuck In Your Murder..."

 

[Gamegenie222]

I was curious to see how Ganon and Falco do in teams, anyone's opinion on that?