Stage Ban Quick Reference (Ongoing)

[Ingulit]

Does anyone else have stage recommendations?

 

[T-block]

Strike:
(1) Smashville
(2) Lylat Cruise
(3) Castle Siege
(Runner Up) Yoshi's Island
---
Ban:
(1) Brinstar
(Runner Up) Rainbow Cruise
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What they will likely ban
(1) Final Destination
(Runner Up) Battlefield
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Counterpick
(1) Final Destination
(2) Battlefield
(Runner Up) Pokemon Stadium1

No way PT will ban RC against Diddy... Diddy would probably ban it against PT if he didn't have to worry about Brinstar. Halberd isn't a terrible ban choice against PT, but I would rather get rid of RC.

Diddy does not want SV in this matchup because of the free switches it provides, and if PT is allowed to switch as often as he likes, Diddy start to actually be threatened in this matchup. That's why I would probably stay away from PS1 in this matchup as well, although the switches don't come quite as often, and the space it provides in neutral transformation might be good enough to be worth it.

 

[Player-1]

SV is still good because of camping ability, but I like BF mostly; It's the only neutral I have beaten reflex on, reflex says BF too I'm in the car with him right now

 

[T-block]

Oh it's still good. It just helps PT more than it helps Diddy in this case imo.

BF would defs be my pick when they ban FD, yeah.

 

[Player-1]

My CPs considering FD is banned would be BF then SV maybe frigate, but idk. I've only played PT on frigate once that being reflex and I 2 stocked him

 

[DOODE]

whats the point of striking smashville against pt? its basically fd which it says we should conterpick to ?
I dnt get it.

 

[Ingulit]

whats the point of striking smashville against pt? its basically fd which it says we should conterpick to ?
I dnt get it.

Pokèmon Trainer has some shiggs on Smashville, namely the ability to switch Pokèmon on the platform with no lag afterward.

So you think we should not strike it/should CP them there? That would make it 2 to 1, and I'd change it.

 

[Player-1]

wait why did tblock's write up of PT get put over mine if it was just 1-1. Pretty sure my opinion matters more than his when I'm a better Diddy that plays the best PT on a regular basis...PS1 is a bad stage to CP PT to, SV is MUCH better, even with lagless switch. In case you didn't know you have to get momentum in that direction to do the lagless switch, which is usually done by a roll, if you know it's coming then you can punish it. In most cases, PT switches when he is safe to do so on a normal stage like BF PT will get the opponent way by hitting them or such to switch wherever he wants on the stage which the cool down to that is what is punishable. On a stage like SV PT still has to get the opponent away so that he can set himself up for the lagless switch right which the part is punishable, the start up. The start up would be the harder thing to punish, but not by a large margin.

 

[DOODE]

Pokèmon Trainer has some shiggs on Smashville, namely the ability to switch Pokèmon on the platform with no lag afterward.

So you think we should not strike it/should CP them there? That would make it 2 to 1, and I'd change it.

k thanks but nah dont listen to me, i've never played a good pt. I asked cause I figured there was a reason for it and wanted to know.

I would listen to p1 tho since he's EDIT: taken games off reflex before

 

[Player-1]

I haven't beaten his PT in any sets only games and I've beaten his Wario in a set. But I still play him a lot and have gotten very close to beating his PT.

 

[T-block]

I main PT/Diddy, P-1 =P

I'm not saying SV is a bad stage for Diddy... Diddy does fine there against PT just like he does fine against any other character. It's just that SV helps PT more than it helps Diddy in this regard. The start-up is MUCH less punishable, since you're invulnerable on frame 1. Rolling is also not the only way - dash attack works as well for exmaple, but that's whatever. Yes, it's not a 100% free switch, but as long as PT isn't auto-piloting "land on platform, roll, switch", he can expect to get switches off more often than not.

PS1 also gives PT switches, but not nearly as often. It's also great for Diddy and gives him a lot more space to run from Squirtle.

There must be something I'm missing, because I'm not seeing it.

Do you agree that RC isn't a good place to CP PT to then? I know you're really comfortable on it, but in general Diddy has much better options.

 

[Player-1]

PS1 is a MUCH better stage for PT than SV is. There's absolutely no reason to strike it unless BF or FD are available. Diddy doesn't have much better options against PT. FD is good but it's usually banned, my 2nd choice would be RC against most PTs that aren't reflex, my 3rd choice would be BF, the only other options Diddy has his is SV at this point or maybe Frigate.

 

[T-block]

What makes you think Reflex is so much better on RC than any other PT?

PS1 is great for PT, no doubt. Whether it's better than SV depends on the opponent. In a matchup where two pokemon get absolutely wrecked, I think SV is a lot more beneficial.

Frigate would be an okay choice actually.

 

[Player-1]

Because Reflex knows the stage and can utilize it better than any other PT.

PS1 works better for all 3 pokemon against Diddy, the only thing it doesn't offer is the quick switch for the majority of the game which isn't a huge deal in the first place.

I 2 stocked reflex on frigate, although I don't think it would work that way for me again.

 

[T-block]

Hmm... PS1 might be better for Squirtle in Rock, Grass and Water (I'm super uncomfortable on Grass with Diddy for some reason... does anyone else feel the same way?). But I would rather play on Smashville than on neutral PS1 for Squirtle-Diddy. I'm of the opinion that the other two pokemon are largely irrelevant in this matchup. PS1 is probably a lot better for Ivysaur and Charizard, but that doesn't mean they stop getting *****, so does it really matter?

 

[Player-1]

The fact there are two platforms that don't move (aside from transformation) make them extremely reliable places to land instead of on the ground against Diddy with bananas and Squirtle in the air ****s Diddy over so much. The fact that Ivysaur and Charizard can add even a bit more than usual damage to Diddy for Squirtle to come back and wreck everyone later is enough.

Usually this is how a game goes with me and reflex:

Squirtle wrecks me for a stock and a half, I finally get the kill, I wreck the other two pokemon, I win.

or

Squirtle wrecks me for a stock and a half, I finally get the kill, reflex makes enough good reads on me to get some extra damage/kills on me, I wreck the other pokemon, squirtle comes out and wrecks me once again.



If the other pokemon can't do **** to me and it's only squirtle doing anything then I can usually win so the fact that PS1 helps in that sense helps PT out a lot more than SV.

 

[T-block]

You acknowledge that Squirtle is the one that pulls most of the weight... yet you'd rather go to the stage that allows Squirtle to be played for all three stocks?

You're assuming the stock order is as follows:
Squirtle
Ivysaur - Charizard
Squirtle

If we fix that, then PS1 might be better, because PT can get more done with the second stock. However, that isn't fixed. If Smashville allows for:

Squirtle
Squirtle
Squirtle

isn't that going to be harder for you? =P

 

[Player-1]

No, because Squirtle will be fatigued practically the whole game not to mention he actually has to baton pass twice every single time to get to that point which can be stopped (which I'm pretty sure is the reason why reflex doesn't do this against me). PS1 he can can do the same thing, he just has to get you away from him which isn't very hard with a simple grab>throw and especially when 3/4 transformations puts a wall between the two of you. Smashville helps get that switch done faster but not by a lot with the set up involved....

 

[T-block]

If Squirtle dies, his fatigue value is cut to 30%. If Squirtle is allowed to end the stock and can switch twice, he will spent plenty of time unfatigued.

 

[Player-1]

Well I mean good luck switching twice and not taking 50%, another 40 and squirtle is in kill range because he is so light.