Success/Popularity stuff. Final update coming later today!

[Ghostbone]

People used Sonic because they're furries and/or fanboys , and actually did something with him.

Super fixed.

 

[Espy Rose]

lol Niddo.
No one touched Jigglypuff because she is a terribly unpopular character.

Then they nerfed the one thing from Melee that made her so desirable to new players in Brawl (Rest).
Why anyone would pick her up simply because she's Jigglypuff is beyond me.

Even after only playing with her for a bit, I've seen that there's plenty of potential that people are severely overlooking with the character.

And don't you dare compare her to Sonic. Sonic had almost ten times the number of mains, which meant that much more players digging into his data, researching and discussing match ups and the like...

...you know, advancing his metagame at a rate that Jigglypuff has never had.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

If you look at where Jigglypuff was on the Melee tier list 5 years after Melee was released and compare it to her current placing, you'll see why you're wrong

Different game. One with a lot more combos to be discovered and the like.

lol Niddo.
No one touched Jigglypuff because she is a terribly unpopular character.

Then they nerfed the one thing from Melee that made her so desirable to new players in Brawl (Rest).
Why anyone would pick her up simply because she's Jigglypuff is beyond me.

Even after only playing with her for a bit, I've seen that there's plenty of potential that people are severely overlooking with the character.

And don't you dare compare her to Sonic. Sonic had almost ten times the number of mains, which meant that much more players digging into his data, researching and discussing match ups and the like...

...you know, advancing his metagame at a rate that Jigglypuff has never had.

Still doesn't change the fact that Sonic players where actually able to do something, while Jigglypuff has done squat. Advancing a lot slower would make sense, but something should have happened by now.

What about Link? He has a larger fanbase than Jigglypuff, and he still hasn't budged. Why? Because he's a crappy character. Sure he has a lot of tricks, but they don't add up to anything. Mario is pretty much in the same boat, though obviously slightly better off.

Jigglypuff had more than her Rest nerfed. The different engine screwed over her WoP. They screwed over what she was best at doing. As a character in Brawl, she simply does not work well at all. You can get the surprise win with her because nobody has a clue how to fight her, but at the end of the day she sucks. If she didn't suck so much, she would have shown at least a solid sign of improvement by now. Same goes for Mario and Link. The best she could ever hope for is a temporary boost for one tier list, and then people would figure out whatever had changed and she would drop back down. Her design does not allow her to climb up and stay higher.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

If you think that WoP was her best trait in Melee, you really need to play the game more.

 

[Espy Rose]

My god you're wrong, Niddo.

 

[san.]

I think Jigglypuff has a moveset that's at least mid-tier quality, but her weight is the sole thing dragging her down a lot. It skews a lot of her risk/reward options.

Her offensive game is surprisingly good, though. There are quite a few good followups to attacks.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

If you think that WoP was her best trait in Melee, you really need to play the game more.

*removes best*

*replaces with iconic*

Happy?

My god you're wrong, Niddo.

If I'm wrong, go win tournaments with her. Or at least place top 8 at a good sized tournament. I mean, both you and San show interest in the character, surely after this many years of Brawl one of you two could do something with her if she's actually as good as you all claim. I mean, mid tier moveset? Really? Well then, if low tiers like Lucas can make the occasional good appearance/characters barely mid tier like Ness or PT, then surely Jigglypuff can have the same thing happen, even after people figure her out if she has a spike in popularity, right?

 

[IhaveSonar]

Jigglypuff's air moves are top tier, but her ground game is, at least in today's metagame, bottom tier.

The only REALLY good one is grab, due to its amazing range. Dash attack can be a decent kill move, and utilt is useful for followups and comboing. Fsmash and usmash are laggy, but can punish with some prediction.

The rest of them are just flat-out bad. Jiggz users will use them occasionally, but they are very situational.

Oh yeah, her d-tilt and d-smash are probably the worst of their kind in the game.

@Niddo: I'm not exactly sure what you're getting at.... Bottom tier doesn't mean bottom tier forever. Sonic rose up out of low tier because people actually started to play him, advance his metagame, and realize he actually wasn't as bad as they originally thought. Same with Yoshi, Ike, and Ness. Jiggz hasn't really had the opportunity for that to happen yet, so why immediately dismiss the possibility of her not being complete crap?

Granted, it's not a very likely possibility, but it is still there.

 

[B0NK]

I think Jigglypuff has a moveset that's at least mid-tier quality, but her weight is the sole thing dragging her down a lot. It skews a lot of her risk/reward options.

Her offensive game is surprisingly good, though. There are quite a few good followups to attacks.

Her lack of any real kill power doesn't help either. Welp.

 

[Ghostbone]

Jigglypuff sucks because she sucks

What I read.

 

[infiniteV115]

Niddo, just curious, do you attend tournaments?

AND HOLY **** WTF YOU'RE IN ONTARIO?!

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Niddo, just curious, do you attend tournaments?

AND HOLY **** WTF YOU'RE IN ONTARIO?!

I do when I have the money. Meaning I attended about 5-6 tournaments in Texas because as I found out: Americans don't like hiring nonAmericans. And of course, that has left me still in the "trying to find first job" stage here in Ontario. Not fun.

 

[Luigisama]

spam half charged roll outs.

 

[Ripple]

see new title. tempted to just give it to john but IDK if it's that much more of a hassle for him

 

[John12346]

I'll... think about it. Seems like a bigger responsibility than what I've got atm. >___>;

For now, let's see if anyone else is willing to give it a go.

 

[Tesh]

^I can think of 75 willing people that aren't busy with anything.

 

[Marc]

It's closer to 85 now and I think some of us would be willing actually. Now that Tesh is volunteering we might not have to though.

 

[Deleted member]

Hmm...I wouldn't mind helping with this, John.

 

[Jimmyfosho]

FOW should have mk when putting the final results on /posted here to make Cassio happy

 

[John12346]

I'm still thinking about it. I may leave it off, but we'll see.

 

[Cassio]

imo if its the same as how youve done every other tournament then its worth being consistent. Those posts were just really annoying in that thread.

 

[SN Viper]

Whats the question he won games with MK therefore MK should be listed.

its a no brainer to me.

 

[Flayl]

He won more money thanks to MK. If you're not gonna count his MK, at least have his prize money downgraded a spot. It's still statistics manipulation but it's more honest.

 

[Tesh]

He used MK in finals?

 

[Deleted member]

If he won a game in bracket with MK, then sure, the character should be accounted for since it helped him advance.

 

[John12346]

Alright, this is the update for 12/3. Looks like we finally hit a circulation of $100k! Good job!

Raw Data

Spoiler

Character
GaW: 60
ICs: 180
Peach: 74
Pikachu: 60.33
MK: 92
Marth: 51.33
Snake: 20.33
Fox: 19
Luigi: 25
Z-Sheik: 5
Wario: 163
Wolf: 69
Olimar: 150
Falco: 5

User
GaW: 180
ICs: 345
Peach: 194
Pikachu: 136
MK: 107
Marth: 82
Snake: 56
Fox: 19
Luigi: 40
Z-Sheik: 5
Wario: 163
Wolf: 69
Olimar: 150
Falco: 10

Player
Vinnie ICs: 255
Vinnie GaW: 180
Vinnie Peach: 180
ESAM Pikachu: 90
ESAM ICs: 90
Mew2King MK: 54
Neo Marth: 36
Gallax Snake: 46
Gallax Marth: 46
Gallax Pikachu: 46
TrumpTight Fox: 19
Kyon Peach: 14
Boss Luigi: 10
Ed Z-Sheik: 5
Hunger Wario: 138
Kain Wolf: 69
Marshall MK: 23
Dabuz Olimar: 150
Malcolm Wario: 25
YoshQ Luigi: 30
YoshQ MK: 30
Xeylode Snake: 10
Xeylode Falco: 10

Tournaments Used
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315150
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315104
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315137
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315097
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315116
.
.
.
.
.
30+ Entrant Tournaments

Character
GaW: 60
ICs: 105
Peach: 60
Pikachu: 45
MK: 54
Marth: 36

User
GaW: 180
ICs: 270
Peach: 180
Pikachu: 90
MK: 54
Marth: 36

Tournaments Used
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315150
.
.
.
.
.
MK Banned Tournaments

Character
Snake: 147.5
Falco: 22.5
Ike: 100

User
Snake: 170
Falco: 45
Ike: 100

Usage
Snake: 7
Falco: 5
Marth: 2
Zelda: 1
Peach: 2
Diddy: 3
ICs: 1
Yoshi: 1
Lucas: 1
Pikachu: 1
Ike: 1
GaW: 1
Sonic: 2
TLink: 1
Wario: 1
Wolf: 1
Pit: 1
Olimar: 1

Tournaments Used
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315109
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315123

Normal Tournaments

MK Banned Tournaments

Please remember to Right Click and hit "View Image" on any image that is not large enough to be displayed properly.

 

[Orion*]

Super fixed.

LOOOL
+10

lol Niddo.
No one touched Jigglypuff because she is a terribly unpopular character.

Then they nerfed the one thing from Melee that made her so desirable to new players in Brawl (Rest).
Why anyone would pick her up simply because she's Jigglypuff is beyond me.

Even after only playing with her for a bit, I've seen that there's plenty of potential that people are severely overlooking with the character.

And don't you dare compare her to Sonic. Sonic had almost ten times the number of mains, which meant that much more players digging into his data, researching and discussing match ups and the like...

...you know, advancing his metagame at a rate that Jigglypuff has never had.

this

 

[Steam]

you didn't use CO tourneys?

sadfaec : (

also congrats on beating will :3

 

[John12346]

Steam, I'm simply using tournies who's results have been posted on SWF in the Console Tournament Results boards. If you wanna direct link me to some other results I may have missed, go ahead.

Also thanks, but I'm gonna have to beat Will consistently if I wanna get anywhere. Once in like ten billion tries isn't really anything to write home about >___>;

 

[Ghostbone]

But it means you're making progress, which is good

 

[Steam]

Steam, I'm simply using tournies who's results have been posted on SWF in the Console Tournament Results boards. If you wanna direct link me to some other results I may have missed, go ahead.

Also thanks, but I'm gonna have to beat Will consistently if I wanna get anywhere. Once in like ten billion tries isn't really anything to write home about >___>;

I already did a few weeks ago via pm. : D

and you still beat someone good. that's good. I've never beaten anyone good. though I never really get opportunities to either : (

 

[John12346]

Ah, I had forgotten to include those ones that you PM'd me to. I'll add them when I do the next update.

And don't get disheartened, just keep trying at it, and you'll figure out what you have to do. If you have any, link me to some recent gameplay of yourself in the Lucario boards, and I'll give it a shot.

 

[Steam]

Ah, I had forgotten to include those ones that you PM'd me to. I'll add them when I do the next update.

And don't get disheartened, just keep trying at it, and you'll figure out what you have to do. If you have any, link me to some recent gameplay of yourself in the Lucario boards, and I'll give it a shot.

I have some recent matches of me up in the video thread. :0

and I'm not demotivated, there just arent top players near colorado XD

 

[John12346]

Update for 12/10. MK randomly takes one of the largest weekly percentages of money ever, but it was likely caused by standard deviation due to there only being 3 MK legal tournaments that week.

Raw Data

Spoiler

Character
Ness: 132.5
MK: 341.16
Snake: 69.83
Marth: 26.5
Ganon: 5.3
Olimar: 5.3
Fox: 15.9
Diddy: 28.53
Mario: 11.86
Luigi: 10.6
Falco: 83.33
Pit: 30
ICs: 15.5
Pikachu: 8
DK: 8.33
Kirby: 8.33

User
Ness: 265
MK: 592
Snake: 103
Marth: 26.5
Ganon: 15.9
Olimar: 15.9
Fox: 15.9
Diddy: 35.6
Mario: 35.6
Luigi: 10.6
Falco: 150
Pit: 90
ICs: 23
Pikachu: 8
DK: 25
Kirby: 25

Player
FOW Ness: 265
FOW MK: 265 (Per multiple people's requests, FOW has been noted as using MK for E4S:Champion)
Tyrant MK: 132.5
Havok Snake: 53
Havok MK: 53
MikeHAZE Marth: 26.5
Tearbear MK: 15.9
Tearbear Ganon: 15.9
Tearbear Olimar: 15.9
TKD Fox: 15.9
Vato_Break MK: 10.6
Vato_Break Diddy: 10.6
Vato_Break Mario: 10.6
mrconcon Luigi: 10.6
Shugo Falco: 90
Shugo MK: 90
Shugo Pit: 90
Sparta Kick Snake: 40
Zinoto Diddy: 25
Lain ICs: 15
Lain MK: 15
Roller ICs: 8
Anther Pikachu: 8
Viper Falco: 50
Veggi DK: 25
Veggi Mario: 25
Veggi Kirby: 25
Megalalodon Snake: 10
Megalalodon Falco: 10
Megalalodon MK: 10

Tournaments Used
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315471
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315438
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315486
.
.
.
.
.
30+ Entrant Tournaments

Character
Ness: 132.5
MK: 337.83
Snake: 66.5
Marth: 26.5
Ganon: 5.3
Olimar: 5.3
Fox: 15.9
Diddy: 28.53
Mario: 3.53
Luigi: 10.6
Falco: 30
Pit: 30
ICs: 15.5
Pikachu: 8

User
Ness: 265
MK: 582
Snake: 93
Marth: 26.5
Ganon: 15.9
Olimar: 15.9
Fox: 15.9
Diddy: 35.6
Mario: 10.6
Luigi: 10.6
Falco: 90
Pit: 90
ICs: 23
Pikachu: 8

Tournaments Used
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315471
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315438
.
.
.
.
.
MK Banned Tournaments

Character
Snake: 14.13
Peach: 2.1
ICs: 2.1
Yoshi: 39
DK: 39
R.O.B.: 9.75
Falco: 9.75
Marth: 9.75
GaW: 9.75
Dedede: 4.33
Wario: 4.33

User
Snake: 22.8
Peach: 4.2
ICs: 4.2
Yoshi: 78
DK: 78
R.O.B.: 39
Falco: 39
Marth: 39
GaW: 39
Dedede: 13
Wario: 13

Usage
Snake: 3
Peach: 1
ICs: 1
Marth: 3
Sheik: 2
Pikachu: 3
PT: 1
DK: 3
Yoshi: 2
R.O.B.: 1
Falco: 2
GaW: 1
Dedede: 2
Wario: 1
Jiggly: 1
Falcon: 3
Diddy: 1
Lucas: 1
Olimar: 2
Mario: 1
Wolf: 1
Ike: 1

Tournaments Used
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315509
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315413

Normal Tournaments

[collapse=Updated in next post]MK Banned Tournaments

[/collapse]
Please remember to Right Click and hit "View Image" on any image that is not large enough to be displayed properly.

 

[John12346]

Whoops, forgot to add Steam's two MK banned tournies to the list.

Raw Data

Spoiler

Character
Snake: 62.67
Wario: 62.67
Falco: 62.67
TLink: 66.9
Fox: 14.5
Luigi: 14.5
Lucario: 41.11
GaW: 51
Peach: 17

User
Snake: 188
Wario: 188
Falco: 188
TLink: 66.9
Fox: 28.99
Luigi: 28.99
Lucario: 41.11
GaW: 51
Peach: 17

Usage
Snake: 2
Wario: 2
Falco: 2
TLink: 1
Fox: 1
Luigi: 1
Lucario: 2
Yoshi: 2
Peach: 2
Olimar: 2
Marth: 2
R.O.B.: 2
GaW: 1

Tournaments Used:

Spoiler

Summit #1 Brawl
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3843382/Summit/Summit #1 Brawl.gif
1: Fishbait ($111.50)
2: DTL ($66.90)
3: Level Zero ($28.99)
4: Steam ($15.61)
5: Soapy
5: Meno
7: Dartanian
7: Zack
9: Logophobic
9: I
9: Detta
9: Phox
13: AJ
13: David
13: Orion
13: Tate
17: Rapheal
17: Julie
17: Aaron
17: Dustin
17: Skes
25: Conkles
25: Brian

Summit #2 Brawl
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3843382/Summit/Summit #2 Brawl.gif
1: Fishbait ($76.50)
2: Dave! ($51.00)
3: Steam ($25.50)
4: Meno ($17.00)
5: Dart ($0.00)
5: I ($0.00)
7: Rubio
7: Soapy
9: Jose
9: Phox
9: Detta
9: Logophobic
13: Cooper
13: Skees
13: Lion
13: Dogg
17: Kid

MK Banned Tournaments

Please remember to Right Click and hit "View Image" on any image that is not large enough to be displayed properly.

 

[Raziek]

I feel like you haven't been told often enough what a hero you are.

Thank you, John.

 

[John12346]

I feel like you haven't been told often enough what a hero you are.

Thank you, John.

Haha, thanks. I do my best.

Anyway, update time! Here is the update for 12/17/11.

A few things to note down, I guess:
- After MK's ~1.5 month depression of subpar performance(likely a direct result of the ban's initial shock), MK seems to be bringing in results far above the par he had set quite some time ago.
- I don't think any tournaments have occurred for the weekend of 12/24/11, so it will mark the official first week where neither Snake nor MK made any money for a week in 2011.
- 50 MK Banned tournaments have finally made it onto the data. Get hyped!

Raw Data

Spoiler

Character
MK: 668
TLink: 44.5
Olimar: 84
Ike: 98
Wolf: 2.67
Falco: 148.6
Diddy: 207
Snake: 154.5
Lucario: 79.5
ICs: 61.5
Z-Sheik: 15
Peach: 67.5
Pit: 16.2
R.O.B.: 16.2
Yoshi: 13.5
Dedede: 10.33
Sonic: 24

User
MK: 1116
TLink: 89
Olimar: 216
Ike: 98
Wolf: 8
Falco: 394.6
Diddy: 219
Snake: 278.5
Lucario: 127.5
ICs: 123
Z-Sheik: 15
Peach: 67.5
Pit: 32.4
R.O.B.: 32.4
Yoshi: 13.5
Dedede: 31
Sonic: 72

Player
Lee Martin MK: 52
Lee Martin TLink: 52
Ally MK: 362(not a typo, he attended and won money at two tournies with varying character usage)
Ally Snake: 186
Ally Falco: 186
Logic Olimar: 72
Logic MK: 72
Mew2King MK: 40
Toronto Joe MK: 16
Berserker Ike: 8
Seagull Wolf: 8
Seagull MK: 8
Seagull Falco: 8
Gnes Diddy: 185
UltimateRazer Snake: 92.5
Trela Lucario: 55.5
MJG TLink: 37
MJG MK: 37
Ryo Ike: 90
2-D Jeff MK: 30
2-D Jeff ICs: 30
ScaryLB59 Z-Sheik: 15
DarkLink MK: 135
Kyle Peach: 67.5
KiraFlax Pit: 32.4
KiraFlax R.O.B.: 32.4
k9 Falco: 21.6
Hadesblade Yoshi: 13.5
Lain ICs: 93
Lain MK: 93
WTP Falco: 31
WTP MK: 31
WTP Dedede: 31
Tin Man Olimar: 144
Tin Man Falco: 144
Tin Man MK: 144
MeekSpeedy Sonic: 72
MeekSpeedy MK: 72
MeekSpeedy Lucario: 72
Googs Diddy: 24
Googs MK: 24
Maddie Diddy: 10
Viper Falco: 4

Tournaments Used
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315795
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315775
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315727
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315797
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315962
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315753
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315709
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315863
.
.
.
.
.
30+ Entrant Tournaments

Character
MK: 315.17
TLink: 44.5
Olimar: 36
Ike: 8
Wolf: 2.67
Falco: 2.67
Diddy: 185
Snake: 92.5
Lucario: 55.5

User
MK: 401
TLink: 89
Olimar: 72
Ike: 8
Wolf: 8
Falco: 8
Diddy: 185
Snake: 92.5
Lucario: 55.5

Tournaments Used
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315795
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315775
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315727
.
.
.
.
.
MK Banned Tournaments

Character
Falco: 125
Wario: 60
Diddy: 8.33
Snake: 108.33
ICs: 8.33
Marth: 10

User
Falco: 125
Wario: 60
Diddy: 25
Snake: 125
ICs: 25
Marth: 10

Usage
Falco: 3
Wario: 1
Diddy: 3
Snake: 8
ICs: 4
Marth: 3
Pikachu: 2
GaW: 1
Dedede: 3
Z-Sheik: 1
DK: 1
Sonic: 1
Fox: 1
Link: 1
Zamus: 1

Tournaments Used
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315744
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=315747

Normal Tournaments

MK Banned Tournaments

Please remember to Right Click and hit "View Image" on any image that is not large enough to be displayed properly.

 

[stingers]

Everyones getting ready for apex x.x

 

[John12346]

Alright, let's get this update out of the way. This one's for the weekend of 12/24/11.

As I suspected, no tournaments occurred over the course of that weekend, making this update more of a formality than anything else, but for the sake of completionism, I'll put it up anyway.

Raw Data

Spoiler

...Nothing happened!

Normal Tournaments

MK Banned Tournaments

Please remember to Right Click and hit "View Image" on any image that is not large enough to be displayed properly.

 

[SN Viper]

John# can i get a break down on falco for MK legal tourneys?

Thanks