The Captain Falcon Q&A Thread

[Kishin]

Ok, I did it a few times at some varying percents and got the replay. Now I'm attempting to get someone to upload to youtube for me.

EDIT: Here is the video, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGbW-DLJn2c

 

[eRonin]

ooh it's pretty sweet. But was the Marth doing anything after your dair? Maybe you should try letting the marth try to escape after the dair to replicate real situations. =)

 

[Player-3]

this would work if the opponent midair jumped soon as you daired them and you reacted accordingly, but if marth had up b'd you would have been stagespiked

 

[t3h n00b]

To lazy to search (le gasp) so...

Any moves that put opponent into a jab-lock like state? (back hit of uair, weak hit knee, weak hit bair?) weak hit bairs may allow a jab lock, not sure if Falcon's jab hits EVERYONE or ANYONE... thats why I ask.

I like to make them FORCE getup for an easy hit/grab. (sweetspotted knee anyone?)

Face answered your question accurately, but personally, I don't see the locks ever being useful past a theoretical standpoint. Maybe someone here uses them consistently, but I play mostly wifi, and I'm sure they would be even harder there.

Is falcon better on wi-fi than offline? Err, I'm sure all characters are hurt by wi-fi but is Captain Falcon hurt on a lesser extent compared to most of the other characters or no?

Also, be Careful.

I think he's about the same. Like everyone, powershielding projectiles is much harder, but his speed helps him somewhat. Maybe sweetspotting the knee is a bit harder, but people tend to run into Falcon Punch more. I use him on the aib ladder occasionally, and I do ok.

 

[illinialex24]

He's better because its harder to punish his move's lag as effectively and spacing becomes less important, which hurts any character that has weaker moves who relies on good spacing. He is roughly middle of the pack but above, I play most characters online and I can tell you some of the best:

Falco, Fox, Ike, Metaknight, Snake, and King Dedede.

Then these are some of the very good:
Donkey Kong, Bowser, potentially Ganondorf

Some of the middle:
ZSS, Samus, Falcon, Ice Climbers in low lag (easier the get a grab so they can be buffed if they can fully CG), Sonic, Olimar, Peach

Some of the lower:
Link, Toon Link, Mario

Some of the terrible:
Jigglypuff, Marth, Ice Climbers with no CG's

This is not complete whatsoever.

 

[t3h n00b]

I play a ton of the characters online. I use no-CG Ice Climbers and don't have much trouble, but maybe that's just me. I definitely agree with the Marth, and I wouldn't know personally, but I play a good Jiggs that doesn't have problems with the wifi. I mostly agree with the top of your list, but pretty much, lamer strategies work the best. Third place on the aib ladder is a 12 year old who spams Snake's fsmash. There are Sonics who abuse spindash and spring>dair. But Falcon, at least how I play him, relies on spacing a fair amount, and he doesn't really even have laggy moves, just moves with poor range and priority. What kind of lag is there to punish? A whiffed Falcon Punch or smash should, and mostly will, get punished on wifi. And while tiers aren't everything, and in my opinion, the gap between characters is narrowed on wifi, if you're the worst character with a marginal online advantage (which I don't think is true), you're still not a great character. I don't think any characters change much on wifi except those that require a lot of spacing (Marth), or (these types improve online) rely on grabs (ICs/D3), have a cheap strategy like charging fsmash (Ike/sometimes Snake), or have a spammable projectile with hitstun (Falco/Pit).

Correct me if I'm wrong and sorry for the long paragraph, but what laggy moves does he have that aren't easily punishable on wifi?

 

[Kishin]

The Marth was doing absolutely nothing during the whole thing. I am unable to control Marth and Captain Falcon by myself. I used it at varying percents to demonstrate it at percentages where you can't even foot stool Marth, where Marth could probably meteor cancel it with up+b, and where Marth could survive if he meteor canceled with a jump and side+b -> up+b. But hey, this is only Marth though so there may be other characters where this could be more useful on.

 

[eRonin]

^Yeah I think this kind of thing should be tested on every single character...or at least representatives from each weight or fall-speed group...

 

[illinialex24]

He has a lot of different moves that are harder to punish online, like his B-side on down. His recovery can also be better on some characters because it can be harder to time a move to interrupt it and you get stage spiked or something as a result.

His U-tilt is a fair amount better and he can get away free from a dair more often.

 

[hdrevolution123]

He has a lot of different moves that are harder to punish online, like his B-side on down. His recovery can also be better on some characters because it can be harder to time a move to interrupt it and you get stage spiked or something as a result.

His U-tilt is a fair amount better and he can get away free from a dair more often.

is Samus' uptilt stronger or better than CF's?

 

[illinialex24]

is Samus' uptilt stronger or better than CF's?

I believe it is faster but weaker.

 

[t3h n00b]

He has a lot of different moves that are harder to punish online, like his B-side on down. His recovery can also be better on some characters because it can be harder to time a move to interrupt it and you get stage spiked or something as a result.

His U-tilt is a fair amount better and he can get away free from a dair more often.

Raptor Boost and Falcon Kick probably have the most end lag out of any of Falcon's moves. I seldom use them, at least on the ground, because by the time they get there, you're usually not punishing what you were aiming for. Imo, they're pretty much almost like counters, based on prediction and not reaction. Sure, you can sometimes get away with a bad Raptor Boost where you wouldn't offline, but I think it the lag works against it at least as much because punishing is tougher. I'll be happy to play you sometime to test this

is Samus' uptilt stronger or better than CF's?

I believe it is faster but weaker.

What he said, and the two moves aren't really that similar in nature other than their animations.

 

[illinialex24]

Exactly, and I rarely ever use them. But on wifi its harder to punish the lag of these moves and by a result they are more effective.

 

[eRonin]

I was surprised at the number of stuff I managed to pull off on Wi-fi without being punished. I still always lose with Falcon in the end (I'm not a good player, full stop), but yeah, harder to punish on wi-fi...

 

[Player-3]

So how many of you guys realize how to win brawl matches :|


Hint: its not combos

hint2: its called hitting and running

hint3: read ayazes thread

hint4: sometimes its better to hit and run

hint5: melee was committing Grand Theft Auto

hint6: brawl is more of a driveby

 

[illinialex24]

Yeah its so true. You have to approach solidly a decent amount but you have to do a lot of mindgames and lag punishing as Falcon.

 

[Kishin]

On a sloped ledge:
Hang on ledge
Fast Fall
Jump towards the lope and Falcon Punch

The falcon punch lifts you back on the stage
You can control the distance by how much you DI

Known? useful?

 

[Player-3]

On a sloped ledge:
Hang on ledge
Fast Fall
Jump towards the lope and Falcon Punch

The falcon punch lifts you back on the stage
You can control the distance by how much you DI

Known? useful?

its called the forsaken recovery i believe

 

[Kishin]

its called the forsaken recovery i believe

It's actually not. This one works on on sloped ledges and it's a lot easier to do. Fast fall -> second jump toward the slope -> Falcon Punch.

 

[eRonin]

I don't see why it's easier on a sloped ledge. After all, when you're hanging, you're hanging at the BOTTOM of the ledge, so the distance to get to the stage is identical. The only advantage is that some projectiles might miss you if you're slightly lower...say if a Falco doesn't get his SH blaster right...

 

[t3h n00b]

Slopes are weird in brawl. I wouldn't be surprised if there is a reason for the edge being sloped. And is this for an upward or downward slope? I often use Falcon Punch if I'm far away and above the stage, but not in hitstun and it pretty much scares people away, and I hit with it more than you'd think.

 

[hdrevolution123]

I believe it is faster but weaker.

Out of the edge can Samus' uptilt act as a meteor smash?

 

[Prez08]

Which direction do you DI out of Zelda's Usmash and Fsmash? :|

 

[hdrevolution123]

Which direction do you DI out of Zelda's Usmash and Fsmash? :|

I think you mean SDI. You SDI down and away from Zelda during upsmash I think. For fsmash I'm not too sure

 

[Face124]

Which direction do you DI out of Zelda's Usmash and Fsmash? :|

U-smash, DI should be left or right, whichever is better for you. For u_smash SD it should be whichever direction will get you out fastest. F-smash should be DI up and SDI away.

 

[Prez08]

Ah, ok I see. Thanks Face and HD. :D

 

[Player-3]

by the way, dair is a very good move

 

[Roager]

Hey, sorry I've been gone. Things have been crazy over here. Anyways, I been doing some thinkin.

I've decided that the overwhelming majority of moveset discussion is useless.

We know all we're likely to learn about what our moves do. We need to discuss the matchups. Details. Strategies. Counters. Common things characters do. What we can do about them.

In-depth matchup discussions would, I think, get us to a point where we can actually compete on an almost equal level with most of the other characters in the game.

Anyways, I post this here to see what you think of it. I know we've had matchup threads, but we need something better. Something that doesn't just outline something simple like "spam uair, don't falcon punch, gimp if possible"

Agree? Disagree? Your input?

 

[Player-3]

Hey, sorry I've been gone. Things have been crazy over here. Anyways, I been doing some thinkin.

I've decided that the overwhelming majority of moveset discussion is useless.

We know all we're likely to learn about what our moves do. We need to discuss the matchups. Details. Strategies. Counters. Common things characters do. What we can do about them.

In-depth matchup discussions would, I think, get us to a point where we can actually compete on an almost equal level with most of the other characters in the game.

Anyways, I post this here to see what you think of it. I know we've had matchup threads, but we need something better. Something that doesn't just outline something simple like "spam uair, don't falcon punch, gimp if possible"

Agree? Disagree? Your input?

Dont play falcon

 

[PartyHatPikaChu]

Dont play falcon

Unfortunatly, This.^

 

[Krackatoa]

Hi thar. Falcon mainer here.

I have a friend. He's a bit better than me in terms of skillz. Plays a very defensive game. I'm currently having trouble fighting his Lucas. I usually manage to work my way up close when he's trying to space with projectiles, but he's really good at throwing out NAirs like no tomorrow at the best possible times...

Anyone have any experience on the Lucas matchup? I'm trying to figure out what to do when I know for sure that he's going to NAir or throw out a RAR'd Nair. It stops a lot of my approaches and I end up taking a lot of it on my shield.

 

[Winnar]

Hi thar. Falcon mainer here.

I have a friend. He's a bit better than me in terms of skillz. Plays a very defensive game. I'm currently having trouble fighting his Lucas. I usually manage to work my way up close when he's trying to space with projectiles, but he's really good at throwing out NAirs like no tomorrow at the best possible times...

Anyone have any experience on the Lucas matchup? I'm trying to figure out what to do when I know for sure that he's going to NAir or throw out a RAR'd Nair. It stops a lot of my approaches and I end up taking a lot of it on my shield.

Full jump over him, fast fall behind him with a b-air.

It's amazing, trust me.

Oh, and even though it's almost completely unpunishable make sure you run away as soon as you can to be safe. Or follow up with more shield pressure (very quickly turning around with a n-air if you think they'll jump out of shield or a dash grab if they like to hide in the shield or a turn around jab or if they roll just run after them with a dash attack or a grab because lucas rolls so slowly) because it's cool, too.

Edit - Roager: I don't pay attention to match up threads here anyway because I disagree with most of them. Actually, for a character like falcon match ups aren't really going to be something you can discuss in terms of how much one character has an advantage. The problem is that there 1) aren't enough Falcon players with legitimate and a wide base of tournament experience with the match ups, and 2) differing playstyles for Falcon make match up threads inconsistent. The problem is that the Falcon boards doesn't have a leader, someone who knows what they're talking about and whom people go to for advice on match ups and problems.

Well, TKONTK was kind of trying to fill that role, but he didn't really know what he was talking about. Also he drove off all of our good, experienced Falcon players. :\

 

[Prez08]

Anyways, I post this here to see what you think of it. I know we've had matchup threads, but we need something better. Something that doesn't just outline something simple like "spam uair, don't falcon punch, gimp if possible"

Agree? Disagree? Your input?

We have a new "Zone" thread : http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=7124094#post7124094

That's some improvement over the the "regular" match-up threads right?

 

[Player-3]

Full jump over him, fast fall behind him with a b-air.

It's amazing, trust me.

Oh, and even though it's almost completely unpunishable make sure you run away as soon as you can to be safe. Or follow up with more shield pressure (very quickly turning around with a n-air if you think they'll jump out of shield or a dash grab if they like to hide in the shield or a turn around jab or if they roll just run after them with a dash attack or a grab because lucas rolls so slowly) because it's cool, too.

Edit - Roager: I don't pay attention to match up threads here anyway because I disagree with most of them. Actually, for a character like falcon match ups aren't really going to be something you can discuss in terms of how much one character has an advantage. The problem is that there 1) aren't enough Falcon players with legitimate and a wide base of tournament experience with the match ups, and 2) differing playstyles for Falcon make match up threads inconsistent. The problem is that the Falcon boards doesn't have a leader, someone who knows what they're talking about and whom people go to for advice on match ups and problems.

Well, TKONTK was kind of trying to fill that role, but he didn't really know what he was talking about. Also he drove off all of our good, experienced Falcon players. :\

i take offense to that

im the only one on these boards (except for skip who never posts | who goes tot tournys consistently

but my playstyle makes everyone here go >:| so i dont even bother

 

[XtacyfalcoX]

i go to tournys in ohio a decent amount but i dont play falcon at them but im gonna start

 

[Player-3]

i go to tournys in ohio a decent amount but i dont play falcon at them but im gonna start

Gj, rep us plx

 

[XtacyfalcoX]

some one should put my friendlys in the falcon vids thread

 

[Roager]

So, I'm getting an overall "no" from this thread, so I guess we'll just let it go.

 

[Player-3]

So, I'm getting an overall "no" from this thread, so I guess we'll just let it go.

No, its a good idea actually

it was like 4 am and i was in a tired and sarcastic mood at the time

 

[Roager]

Even so, nobody seems to be going for it, or are arguing against it. maybe I'm wrong. If I get more response, maybe I'll try and start something about it.