Your Thoughts on The Characters

[Battlecow]

Ok so hold on here, I kinda typed a lot but bear with me because I've played lots with my friends and I think I have some opinions to weigh in on.

You claim to have to created an open and honest thread, yet you deny others when they Ness is the best, or that Link is the best? Are they not also characters we can discuss? SheerMadness posted in a very respectful way about Ness and Link being the best in his opinion, and I think you need to respect what he says. It is the general consensus of good players in this forum that Ness and Link are top 2 (I main Link because I just feel he wins really easily against some characters like Kirby, and he has probably the best matchup against Ness and Yoshi (underrated much???), some of the other top characters). Some argue that you really need to know how to use Ness before his full potential is revealed, but I think that we have to consider full potential and nothing less when discussing characters.

Pikachu is ok but some of his moves are really bad, like his Upwards-Aerial, it doesn't do very much damage and it doesn't cause strong knockback like his Down-Aerial and Down-Smash (which I think is his most underrated move, everyone talks about Side-Smash but people sometimes forget something very basic about Down-Smash, IT HITS DOWNWARDS which I think is really strong in edgeguarding). All in all he is a solid mid-high tier character, especially in free-for-alls where his mobility with Upwards-B is unlimited and he can easily hit multiple people with both Thunderbolt and Side-Smash.

Captain Falcon is ok and I have a friend who uses him really really well, like one time he got me from 8% to 79% and off the edge and I couldn't do anything, but his signature moves Falcon Punch and Falcon Jumping Grab are really hard to land - the huge damage is really good and maybe in the hands of a robotic player with perfect reflexes and mindgames you would be able to take advantage of that crazy 25% you get from one hit, but in my extensive testing with friends I just don't see much use out of the B button except for Down-B AKA Falcon Kick, which is so fast and everyone forgets about it.

I don't like Fox, even if other people say he is really strong I think that he has a really hard time getting actual kills. When you just discuss Fox you talk about him just shooting lots of lasers and using Down-Aerial to stop anyone who runs at him. I think Sakurai balanced him really well, the combination of long-ranged power with his Laser, strong middle range game with Firing Fox (you have to predict sometimes but I think this is a really good move, the CPU sometimes suicides with it but I find that if you space it right it's a really good damaging attack), and good close-range game with his Down-Aerial and more importantly, his normal A-button jab attack, which is actually really good and follows Fox's theme of lots and lots of weak hits for good damage. In the end though I think that he is really hurt by the lack of a finishing move, his Firing Fox charge just isn't strong enough sometimes and his Side-Smash, the only one of his smash attacks with good ranged ability, just doesn't kill opponents early enough on Hyrule (where you go because his Lasers are really strong there).

SO yeah I think that the top two are Link and Ness for sure, then Yoshi and Mario (I think Yoshi might be a bit better). We should talk more about whether Yoshi or Mario is actually better.

You spent a lot of time on this

 

[Yobolight]

Hey guys I don't know if this has been discovered yet, but Ness's spike kick is a FREAKING INFINITE!!!! A lot of people don't know this technique but me and my friends call it stomping the yard and it works really good because Ness can actually shorten his jump if you press the jump twice before the spike. It is REALLY tough to do, so I don't know if any of you guys will be able to do it on your first try.

I think there should be a serious discussion about banning Ness cause his tactics are too good if you know how to use him.

 

[B-Town]

This thread is so trolly. I actually think those tournament rules are pretty good for casual. Banning Kirby is pretty fair when you're playing without teching or DI. Really there's always gonna be one guy going to a tournament like that who actually knows how to play the game and that's why you need 4 player free for all so they can team up on him.

This thread does bring up a good point, I think for casual players the tier list is completely different. By casual I mean items on, no DI, no z-canceling or techniques of any sort. I think Ness would come out on top when nobody even knows what a gimp is or how to get out of d-air juggles.

Overall DK is the best because he can just throw you off the stage and then you fall to your death everytime.

 

[asianaussie]

You spent a lot of time on this

I was waiting for my friends to get to my house for our bi-weekly 20-man console-only smashfest, of course I had time?

 

[The Hooded Informant]

Hello. I am terribly sorry for not respecting prior messages concerning Ness, Link, etc.

They are good characters, in fact, they are really amazing at that. SheerMadness and all the other people are correct, Link and Ness are really great to play as, asianaussie.

My apologies to anyone I have angered in this thread.

 

[Yobolight]

Apology not accepted.

I think you should think long and hard about your statements in this thread and reflect on how to make things right. Your ignorance on the greatness of certain characters in this game is highly offensive and I suggest posting a formal apology thread in the main discussion section in order to heal the deep wounds you have inflicted on certain members.

The process will be long and hard, but I think with great effort you will be able to reverse the terror you have wrought on this community.

 

[The Hooded Informant]

Please allow me to explain. I do respect everyone's very own opinion in this thread, I really do. I might know a lot about Smash, but I need to know everyone else's opinions about the characters, so I can get a feel of what characters they like.

I know I may have been "mean", but I really respect everyone's opinions. They are really amazing opinions, and the people do have a right to speak their minds about characters. I am fine with them saying Link and Ness are the best, and I do say they are the best, too. Every person can say anything about characters, and I know that they speak the truth, and I can respect that. Everyone's right, Link and Ness can be the best, but not everyone is perfect with every character.

I'm not perfect at Super Smash Bros.

 

[Battlecow]

I lost it a little

 

[The Hooded Informant]

It basically means that I respect anyone's opinion on the characters, and haven't said it yet.

 

[SheerMadness]

Awww man this kid is too nice and innocent to keep ****ing around with him.

It was pretty annoying to see yet another tier list thread by a newbie. But we've had our fun at this point I think.

Informant, go look for the official tier list thread.

 

[Yobolight]

Yeah lol I was just messing around with you, Informant.

The 64 section of Smashboards, due to its relatively small size, the Smash 64 tends to promote hazing characteristic more of a fraternity than an online competitive community of retro-gaming enthusiasts.

You are far from the worse newbie to post here (examples):
http://smashboards.com/threads/the-secret-tier-list-and-match-ups-explanations-included.329032/

http://smashboards.com/threads/isai.309977/

http://smashboards.com/threads/isai-the-king.310116/

 

[Zenyore]

well lweegee is a preddy versitile character tbqmfh XD

 

[Tom Bombadil]

Yobo, that was noble of you to put your own mistake at the top of the list. Also, thanks for changing. Gives me hope in this world, you seem like a great guy now

 

[clubbadubba]

oh man those kero/diablo threads are too much lol.

 

[The Hooded Informant]

This is not a tier list thread at all, just to let you know. This is a way for me to know you guys as Smashers, and who you like the most. I want to know how you guys like the characters or not. I, in no way, want to make a tier list.
And I guess thanks, Yobo.

I don't like being called newbie, because I am more of a secretive player rather than wanting to reveal myself. But I know that characters, all of them, have the best potential.

 

[B Link]

The hooded informant, the mysterious z, a Yoshi from Florida...

So many mysterious people on this website

 

[The Hooded Informant]

I can see the obvious trollface there. I assure that I am the furthest from a troll than you would think.

We've discussed characters (and hurt my feelings a little, but not a lot), and I think that these statistics you people gave me are wonderful.

Anyways, I have to pop up the big "Q":
Does anyone want to vote (ON A SEPARATE THREAD) for a new tier list for 64? It seems outdated, don't you think? If yes, like, if no, explain why not.

 

[asianaussie]

the secret backroom is currently working on an epic doubles tier list, please wait until that tier list concludes before attempting to start a new tier list of any kind

 

[The Hooded Informant]

the secret backroom is currently working on an epic doubles tier list, please wait until that tier list concludes before attempting to start a new tier list of any kind

I see. Well, if the secret BR is working on a "Doubles Tier List", would they mind if I take over the regular tier list and do the regular tier list voting?

 

[asianaussie]

actually, im done screwing with this guy

you can do whatever you want, though i think clubba is supposed to be doing something? idk seems like the same reason the backroom died, nobody is really interested in the exact placings when we have a general idea of where every character is

and yoshi = mario

 

[The Hooded Informant]

Well, I actually knew you were trying to play with me.

2nd, I don't think clubba is going well with his plan, so...yeah, I may just put in a voting thread myself and see what we can get.

3rd, agreeable. Also, Link = Ness at higher places.

 

[Battlecow]

Please don't make any more threads dude, this one will do quite nicely.

 

[The Hooded Informant]

Well, what do you suppose we do then? NOT make a tier list voting? Or do we just make this thread a Tier List thread now? I really don't want this to end up as a tier list thread.

 

[asianaussie]

link is a better pick than ness at high level play if hyrule is legal, and arguably just as good a pick even if hyrule isn't allowed

why do you need a new tier list, the current one is reasonable apart from a few nitpicks that various individuals have

it's not like ness is suddenly going to spring into high-tier or anything

 

[The Hooded Informant]

link is a better pick than ness at high level play if hyrule is legal, and arguably just as good a pick even if hyrule isn't allowed

why do you need a new tier list, the current one is reasonable apart from a few nitpicks that various individuals have

it's not like ness is suddenly going to spring into high-tier or anything

1. Link is good. In fact, I think he does need higher tier.
2. We need an updated Tier List so we can get this done and over with.
3. Umm...Ness might actually have a giant spring to high tier.

 

[asianaussie]

1. no he doesn't, low tier is fine because he will never play on hyrule more than once per set
2. get what over and done with? your personal dissatisfaction with the tier list?
3. i dunno how to put this to you nicely, but for now ill just say that nobody in the world actually knows how to use ness, hence low tier

 

[Battlecow]

Well, what do you suppose we do then? NOT make a tier list voting? Or do we just make this thread a Tier List thread now? I really don't want this to end up as a tier list thread.

This thread can become whatever you want it to and people may continue to post for a couple of days because you're amusing to them. If you do make a tier list thread you'll be cluttering up the forum which would be a little annoying. Please don't. People aren't interested, they're just posting because they enjoy making fun of you and you're obtuse enough to respond seriously.

 

[The Hooded Informant]

You don't think I have not figured it out before your inquiry? Well, I knew about it far before you did. I am a sadistic ass, for the love of ***. I know when people make fun of me. I make fun of them by making them believe that I am actually responding seriously.

I am making a tier list thread...just like someone made one for Melee.

 

[KeroKeroppi]

Lol jeez tone it down battlecow.

Informant, you have a great attitude. I love your eagerness to change the community . This game needs more people like you. Newbie to newbie, you have my full support with whatever you end up doing.

 

[Battlecow]

There's being nice to new guys and then there's abetting obnoxiousness

you get to make one thread, you get one polite post out of me

 

[B-Town]

There's being nice to new guys and then there's abetting obnoxiousness

you get to make one thread, you get one polite post out of me

Sorry I'm new here. Do you make the rules on this forum Battlecow? As a noob I need to know these things because there's no Mod title next to your name but you seem to act like you own the place...

 

[asianaussie]

MLG was owned by an Italian company which went bankrupt, Battlecow graciously bought the company and keeps the site running out of the goodness of his heart

he doesn't need a fancy user title or any recognition

(the incredibly dull new forum layout is also his fault, as well as the lack of quickedit)

 

[KeroKeroppi]

There is no room for change if rules and regulations, expectations and wishes, prevent it from happening.

 

[asianaussie]

wait, isn't everyone in this forum here because they hate change?

and by change i mean brawl

 

[Yobolight]

Informant, a new tier list is unnecessary. The current one reflects the smash 64 meta-game quite well, a few characters (like Yoshi) could arguably move up a single space, but the tier list is really accurate. I can tell you just from the way your posts reflect your understanding of the game that you don't have any access to any knowledge that anyone else on here doesn't have.

When I first came on these boards I though my pet character deserved to move up the tier list, I was wrong. It is natural to think that your knowledge of the way that the game is played is reflective of the truth because you have no way to know otherwise.

No one expects you to know better, imagine a child trying to convince an experienced hunter that an airsoft gun is more effective at killing dear than a top of the line rifle, it would absurd. You, in this scenario would be the child, but with time and practice you could eventually be the experienced hunter, at which point you would have given up on the illusion that the airsoft gun is the superior instrument.

 

[KeroKeroppi]

A weapon is simply an extension of one's body. The medium is meaningless, the person behind that trigger is what matters most. An airsoft gun could easily be more efficient than a rifle if the person using it is proficient enough.

 

[Battlecow]

I mean I'm just saying that that would be (is) an obnoxious thread, lol

No one gets to make two bad threads, no matter how nice we're being

 

[KeroKeroppi]

No one gets to make two bad threads, no matter how nice we're being

Sometimes it takes two, maybe even three, bad threads before one gets the picture.

http://smashboards.com/threads/isai.309977/
http://smashboards.com/threads/smash-tournement.310035/
http://smashboards.com/threads/ban-pika.314451/

Informant seems like a pretty alright guy. He'll come around. Don't worry.

 

[Yobolight]

A weapon is simply an extension of one's body. The medium is meaningless, the person behind that trigger is what matters most. An airsoft gun could easily be more efficient than a rifle if the person using it is proficient enough.

The medium is far from meaningless, and I don't think you truly believe the contrary.

If you believed the medium didn't matter, you wouldn't be playing the characters you do at smash tournaments.

You can say what you want, but I know that you know that it is irresponsible to show up to a gunfight armed with a knife.

 

[The Hooded Informant]

Noob, you guys say...well, I don't know why you say this when I played in higher ranked tournaments and won some. I am a teacher of Smash, to teach people how to play the game right.

The games are for fun, not making fun of people (I'm looking at Call of Duty here). Sometimes they may be serious, but all in all, they are fun.