Alright guys, we've got **** to do

DtJ Hilt · Aug 10, 2010

Huh for some reason I can't get it to work anymore .-. I'm able to get it about 10% of the time but the spacing and timing is really hard, and yeah like Vocal said, it's character dependent.

So nevermind. Jab is still bad.

Btw I woke back up, lol. Gonna get back to testing stuff. If anyone else is awake you should hop in the chat.

-Vocal- · Aug 10, 2010

Dangit, I was hoping I was just wrong. I had a thought that maybe move staling could play into it, but even if it did how could we stale it in the first place? Oh well. At least we have other things to console us ^_^

I woke up as well lol, but I've really gotta get back to sleep because my eyes are tired as heck. Nighty night

Asa · Aug 10, 2010

I think the move oli's need to use more is nair

I'm a wario main/oli secondary, so some of my wario habits transfer to my oli, namely my use of nair

nair oos is great. I use it for poking and interrupting approahces, covering landings, or as a panic button when the opponent gets in your bubble.

and of course spinny thing to usmash is beautiful lol

Zori · Aug 10, 2010

lol spinney thing

+1

IcyLight · Aug 10, 2010

here is an old video from when i actually played that has a few good examples of buffering an attack out of shield, in which i did a fair/dair at separate times during the video. this is what it should look like for people who don't know what the hell we are talking about, someone hits your shield and you instantly drop shield and attack for a free move.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ihDjCKvGJ8&playnext=1&videos=Ikt2aJEm7BU

oh, instant tether is that thing me and llumys were making a big deal out of like a year ago in SGC Chat xD

DtJ Hilt · Aug 10, 2010

Well just a heads up on the frame data thread, it's going to take me a bit longer than expected. I had a bit of a.. umm.. set back. I'm still going to make the shell of the thread and organize better what I have and what I've gotten since then, but some of what I've recently gathered I'm going to have to redo. Again.

Noa. · Aug 10, 2010

You guys posted a hell of a lot.

Usmash OoS? I've been doing that ever since I knew how to play as Oli. How else can you kill Peach reliably? Heck I even mentioned it in my Peach matchup guide. I remember the other day that Grew and I were talking about the Peach matchup in the social thread and we both mentioned usmash OoS. HOW DID YOU GUYS NOT REALIZE IT?

Albeit I must admit that I didn't know that you could usmash oos between Snake's jab.

Jab thing sounded promising but I'm sad it didn't work out.

Dtilt is awesome yes. I have been using it.

And Asa we have been using nair since forever.

Latias · Aug 10, 2010

i had to go through 3 pages -.-'

But Vocal and ???, you shouldn't be criticizing Brood of all people, if he doesnt whistle and it works dont complain.

DtJ Hilt · Aug 10, 2010

Draconoa44 said:
And Asa we have been using nair since forever.

Not like Asa we haven't XD

Latias said:
But Vocal and ???, you shouldn't be criticizing Brood of all people, if he doesnt whistle and it works dont complain.

Everyone has things they can improve on. Just because he's the best doesn't mean he can't get better.

Tin Man · Aug 10, 2010

Looks like Hilt + Vocal got like 2-3 hours of sleep (at least vocal is asleep now :chuckle:

)

Hilt said:
Down Tilt is an incredible move, I've been using it like crazy lately.

Oh! Oh oh oh oh! One more thing before I go to bed! This is mainly to Dabuz (name search this), but important for everyone else too. Jab is safe on hit, I just tested it today. However, it's a bit weird. Like Down Tilt, Jab1 has two separate hitboxes. Olimar's helmet and the antenna. The helmet itself has enough hitstun to combo into Jab2, however the antenna barely has any hitstun at all (if any), and cancels the hitstun that the helmet caused! So this is why it was thought to not be safe on hit.

However, Jab also has IASA frames, meaning that during a certain point of the attack, you're able to cancel the Jab1 into Jab2 and skip the lag that would have been on the Jab1. Most jabs have this option. But! If you do this, it goes into Jab 2 before the antenna hitbox connects! Meaning that the hitstun is not canceled and the attack will combo into Jab2. It can be a bit difficult to do, but you'll want to practice it. It does, however, decrease the damage output, because the antenna deals 2 damage. And I'm not sure, but if you input the jab commands separately, they may count as two separate moves, similar to MK's ftilt. Meaning that the second hit would be one move stale, but it would also refresh two moves on hit. I'm not sure about this though, and I have a bit of testing to do on Jab, considering that I don't know how big the IASA window is either. I'll take care of that tomorrow after I check out dtilt.

Was gonna comment on this about how my jab always gets PShielded but no need anymore.

RichBrown said:
Hilt, does that mean that there's no way people can powershield our jab if done right? Because my jab ALWAYS gets powershielded =(

Also, I wanna bring something else to everyone's attention regarding getting back from the ledge

Instant return is great, but there's also something really simple

So you know how we can stall on the ledge and Uair a bunch n stuff?

Well what I just started doing is doing the uair but then autocanceling it perfectly onto the stage and into a grab

It's really effective because most of the time you'll have the room because people don't wanna get hit by Uair

That's a concept a learned a while back: You don't have to force yourself back onto the stage.

This is just another tool to help us get back.

Also, in regards to buffering: I'm pretty sure I buffer just about, if not everything I do. I've been beating up lvl 3s and I realized that any time I'm not landing an attack I airdodge into the ground, and I do a lot of things out of sideB myself. So I'm not gonna concern myself personally too much with buffers, though I'm gonna keep my ears open in case there's something I'm missing.

Also... I think Marth-Oli might be even.

Oh and Usmash OoS is amazing and I feel like such a noob that I haven't been using it sooner. Personal thanks to Fino for calling me to tell me about how amazing Usmash OoS is XD

I was playing m!keh@ze yesterday and at times I'd just walk up to him and shield, and he'd fair my shield, and I scored an easy KO with Usmash OoS. As of now I still have to consciously think about using the move, but I'm working on making it natural. I can't wait to see just how many situations this move is usable under...

so because of Usmash OoS, MK, Peach, Luigi, and Marth are all of a sudden even o.O? And now Falco is our only bad matchup. I wanna know the tings yall found was most difficult to handle with these characters and how Usmash OoS helps that. I know Olimar can Usmash OoS the Glide attack of MK and use a yellow if they space it (saw Brood do it in doubles). It would probably help with Ftilt from MK also. Tell me more.

Asa said:
I think the move oli's need to use more is nair

I'm a wario main/oli secondary, so some of my wario habits transfer to my oli, namely my use of nair

nair oos is great. I use it for poking and interrupting approahces, covering landings, or as a panic button when the opponent gets in your bubble.

and of course spinny thing to usmash is beautiful lol

Zori said:
lol spinney thing

+1

Yeah lol those commentators know nothing about Olimar. "Spinney thing to Usmash, thats MLG right there", Man that was so old =/.

IcyLight said:
here is an old video from when i actually played that has a few good examples of buffering an attack out of shield, in which i did a fair/dair at separate times during the video. this is what it should look like for people who don't know what the hell we are talking about, someone hits your shield and you instantly drop shield and attack for a free move.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ihDjCKvGJ8&playnext=1&videos=Ikt2aJEm7BU

oh, instant tether is that thing me and llumys were making a big deal out of like a year ago in SGC Chat xD

If you Jump, it automatically cancels your shield lag correct, so its hardly possible to mess up. Smashing OoS is a different story though, however I think only Usmash can cancel these 7 frames of shield drop lag because u jump cancel it. The other smashes probably have the shield drop lag.

Hilt said:
Not like Asa we haven't XDEveryone has things they can improve on. Just because he's the best doesn't mean he can't get better.

I've been Using Nair quite a bit like Asa has...

Nairing OoS is great.

Gadiel_VaStar · Aug 10, 2010

Up-smash OOS is easy, all you do is hold shield, then hold up on the control stick & c-stick @ the same time. It's good w/ a lot of chars. People need to stick to the basics, lol.

ToferTheHuman · Aug 10, 2010

I talked to Espy about the things you can do with stutter stepping and he said that you can run in one direction and fsmash in the opposite you're going in.

Maybe this is what Vocal is trying to do, yes?

Gadiel_VaStar · Aug 10, 2010

tofer_booboo said:
I talked to Espy about the things you can do with stutter stepping and he said that you can run in one direction and fsmash in the opposite you're going in.

Maybe this is what Vocal is trying to do, yes?

You can probably do that by running in a direction, then pressing down on the control stick, then pressing the direction you wish to smash w/ the c-stick...@ least I think this is how you do it. Lol, people need to learn their brawl game & stick w/ the basics. You can do that w/ projectiles as well, so that allows Olimar to run and cancel his dash w/ a side-b.

Tin Man · Aug 10, 2010

you can't crouch cancel in brawl.

seeing as I have tap jump on...

Gadiel_VaStar said:
Up-smash OOS is easy, all you do is hold shield, then hold up on the control stick & c-stick @ the same time. It's good w/ a lot of chars. People need to stick to the basics, lol.

...might actually be easier. Just shield then tap up on Control stick & Cstick simultaneously. Its better than using Z for me cause the Z button is in an awkward place imo, and when I switch my controls so that R is jump and Z is attack, it solves that problem but then makes so many others (mainly with other characters cause I use the shoulder attack button to help me boost smash, and attack while grabbing with the ICs)

Dabuz · Aug 10, 2010

ok, finally got to reading this thread

first off, i know how to upsmash OOS, but, i need step by step directions on JC upsmash OOS

secondly, ok, with that frame data, nair is the better option for punishing people in the air, by far

third off, yes, you can upair from the ledge and land on the stage safely, i've been implementing that for a while but a word of warning, upair won't beat an almost full shield, and some players will stay at the edge after an upair, so try not to overuse it

fourth, pivot fsmash (boost fsmash?) someone give a write up of hoq=w to do it

fifth: i'm pretty sure we cannot buffer out of whistle (BUT NOT POSITIVE) which would explain why brood chooses to almost never use it

six: dtilt->uptilt at mid-percents is legit combo

seventh: boost pivot grab, we must be taught that

eight: at 0% on every non very floaty character, dthrow->fsmash-> (buffered) standing grab is good (maybe guaranteed, but i haven't had anyone to help me test it)

Dnyce · Aug 10, 2010

dabuz said:
ok, finally got to reading this thread

first off, i know how to upsmash OOS, but, i need step by step directions on JC upsmash OOS

secondly, ok, with that frame data, nair is the better option for punishing people in the air, by far

third off, yes, you can upair from the ledge and land on the stage safely, i've been implementing that for a while but a word of warning, upair won't beat an almost full shield, and some players will stay at the edge after an upair, so try not to overuse it

fourth, pivot fsmash (boost fsmash?) someone give a write up of hoq=w to do it

fifth: i'm pretty sure we cannot buffer out of whistle (BUT NOT POSITIVE) which would explain why brood chooses to almost never use it

six: dtilt->uptilt at mid-percents is legit combo

seventh: boost pivot grab, we must be taught that

eight: at 0% on every non very floaty character, dthrow->fsmash-> (buffered) standing grab is good (maybe guaranteed, but i haven't had anyone to help me test it)

first: shield and hold up
as soon as your shield is his by an attack you hit jump and then immediately tap A (like almost roll your finger from x/y to A as fast as you can). Logic uses custom controls for it, but it's not necessary (like L to jump or something, I forget).

fifth: yeah, we can buffer out of a whistle.

seventh: boost pivot grab is
run left
input dash attack
hit right IMMEDIATELY
hit grab IMMEDIATELY

It's like the JC usmash backwards with the extra input of changing direction for me because I have Y set to grab. This way I can roll my finger from A to Y for the boost grab (also using z for grab hurts when practicing CGs forever ago when I picked up ICs, lololol).

eigth: it MAY be guaranteed on some chars with specific pikmin (like snake or MK) or specific DI inputs. I know what you're talking about though, love that combo... but it doesn't always seem to work out.

Asa · Aug 10, 2010

question: is this another input for boos pivot grabbing?

run left
hit right on cstick then z in quick succession

Tin Man · Aug 10, 2010

vVv Fino said:
first: shield and hold up
as soon as your shield is his by an attack you hit jump and then immediately tap A (like almost roll your finger from x/y to A as fast as you can). Logic uses custom controls for it, but it's not necessary (like L to jump or something, I forget).

I like to tap up on control stick & Cstick at the same time now. I have tap jump so holding up isn't the most effective for me lol

vVv Fino said:
It's like the JC usmash backwards with the extra input of changing direction for me because I have Y set to grab. This way I can roll my finger from A to Y for the boost grab (also using z for grab hurts when practicing CGs forever ago when I picked up ICs, lololol).

Yeah, thats also why my X is set to grab.

Asa said:
question: is this another input for boos pivot grabbing?

run left
hit right(or down or left) on cstick then hit left immediately then press z in quick succession

fixed

-Vocal- · Aug 10, 2010

Hilt said:
Well just a heads up on the frame data thread, it's going to take me a bit longer than expected. I had a bit of a.. umm.. set back. I'm still going to make the shell of the thread and organize better what I have and what I've gotten since then, but some of what I've recently gathered I'm going to have to redo. Again.

I'm sure whatever you've got so far will be a help as it is

Latias said:
i had to go through 3 pages -.-'

But Vocal and ???, you shouldn't be criticizing Brood of all people, if he doesnt whistle and it works dont complain.

Latias, no one was criticizing. I simply noticed and commented. I don't know if I said it here, but I'm not the amazing player he is so I could never criticize him for not using more whistle. Apparently he doesn't need it :laugh:

Gadiel_VaStar said:
Up-smash OOS is easy, all you do is hold shield, then hold up on the control stick & c-stick @ the same time. It's good w/ a lot of chars. People need to stick to the basics, lol.

With tap jump on.

tofer_booboo said:
I talked to Espy about the things you can do with stutter stepping and he said that you can run in one direction and fsmash in the opposite you're going in.

Maybe this is what Vocal is trying to do, yes?

Tried this, it only work in the very beginning of a dash animation. It's not possible to do this while dashing (unless Espy knows something I don't). Ask him what the inputs and window of input time are.

Gadiel_VaStar said:
You can probably do that by running in a direction, then pressing down on the control stick, then pressing the direction you wish to smash w/ the c-stick...@ least I think this is how you do it. Lol, people need to learn their brawl game & stick w/ the basics. You can do that w/ projectiles as well, so that allows Olimar to run and cancel his dash w/ a side-b.

Tried it, didn't work. Best I could do was wait for the pivot window to pass (it's pretty small) and then Fsmash.

dabuz said:
ok, finally got to reading this thread

first off, i know how to upsmash OOS, but, i need step by step directions on JC upsmash OOS

secondly, ok, with that frame data, nair is the better option for punishing people in the air, by far

third off, yes, you can upair from the ledge and land on the stage safely, i've been implementing that for a while but a word of warning, upair won't beat an almost full shield, and some players will stay at the edge after an upair, so try not to overuse it

fourth, pivot fsmash (boost fsmash?) someone give a write up of hoq=w to do it

fifth: i'm pretty sure we cannot buffer out of whistle (BUT NOT POSITIVE) which would explain why brood chooses to almost never use it

six: dtilt->uptilt at mid-percents is legit combo

seventh: boost pivot grab, we must be taught that

eight: at 0% on every non very floaty character, dthrow->fsmash-> (buffered) standing grab is good (maybe guaranteed, but i haven't had anyone to help me test it)

I don't think we can boost fsmash, though going from a dash > Fsmash the other direction is still pretty fast. Just dash, release the control stick, wait for Oli's heels to slide (you'll notice the timing), and then Fsmash. Nothing complicated, but fairly fast. Sure would be awesome to figure out an instant Fsmash though.

That dtilt > utilt looks sexy

LOL we finally have a tactical thread :laugh:

Weruop · Aug 10, 2010

does yellow f smash beat falcos reflector/lasers?

DtJ Hilt · Aug 10, 2010

Yup, goes right through them.

Weruop · Aug 10, 2010

:O that could be useful.
and i still dont think oli vs falco is that bad. a lot of the time brood got hit by dumb aerials ( bair) near the edge that he coulda whistled. and if he knew a little bit better how to get around falcos lasering i think it coulda been much closer. maybe 45-55? : /

Cook · Aug 10, 2010

All this up-smash out of shield stuff is pretty funny because for some reason I JUST started doing it a couple weeks ago, too. I've mostly only gotten to practice it against Peach (you can do it between her d-airs on shield, or even between d-air>n-air on shield, which basically means she can't d-air your shield, unless she backs off during the d-air). I noticed Brood doing it to MK's glide attack, so I'll def be doing that all the time now. I dunno, I've just been kind of trying to figure out what I can punish with it. Oh, punishing Peach's d-air with up-smash oos also leads to a lot of de-synched up-smashes! :psycho:

I THINk up-smash oos causes more de-synchs in general because the pikmin is often getting hit by whatever move you are punishing, but that's just me guessing, it could only be a Peach thing.

It's funny, because when I play MK or Marth my game mostly revolves around running up to people and shielding, then punishing with up-b or n-air, and this whole time Olimar has had a similar tactic I could use (though not AS good) but had not really messed around with until recently.

Btw, Fino, why would people complain about the Falco matchup? I think it's at least slightly in Olimar's favor. ICs are def harder.

Also, I haven't actually read through this thread yet, so I'm probably saying dumb things.

*_Echo_* · Aug 10, 2010

@weruop- i must agree :/

also JC upsmash OOS is too good >.>

i use L for jump for this >.> (i have x as shield)

also why did the commentators think that each hit of upair refreshes our moves?? They knew absoultly nothing >.> they needed logic and fino on that stream! (or L)

Cook · Aug 10, 2010

Also, for peeps talking about pivot f-smash, can't you just pluck cancel f-smash?

*_Echo_* · Aug 10, 2010

Cook said:
Also, for peeps talking about pivot f-smash, can't you just pluck cancel f-smash?

if u have 6 pikmin u cant pluck cancel tho ^^;

-Vocal- · Aug 10, 2010

Cook said:
Also, for peeps talking about pivot f-smash, can't you just pluck cancel f-smash?

But that would mean I don't have 6 pikmin, and I don't think I'd like to make a habit of running around with just five ^_^

Ninja'd by Echo - I THOUGHT WE HAD SOMETHING SPECIAL AND YOU RUINED IT BY STEALING MY POST FROM ME.

It's over, and I'm taking the Brood Tin Man signature with me. You can have the cat and the toaster.

*_Echo_* · Aug 10, 2010

-Vocal- said:
But that would mean I don't have 6 pikmin, and I don't think I'd like to make a habit of running around with just five ^_^

Ninja'd by Echo - I THOUGHT WE HAD SOMETHING SPECIAL AND YOU RUINED IT BY STEALING MY POST FROM ME.

It's over, and I'm taking the Brood Tin Man signature with me. You can have the cat and the toaster.

;-;... but i get custody of the pikmin >.>

RichBrown · Aug 10, 2010

I've been talking for months about stutterstep fsmash. That extra half inch it gives you is amazing.

Fino told me that we can also usmash OoS luigi's nair. I tried it against a cpu luigi, and like Fino said it would pikmin rocket every time.

We are seriously the biggest group of noobs for not utilizing this sooner hahaha.

For me it's not a matter of learning when to usmashoos or shieldgrab. There are some moves that are just better to shieldgrab, or are not usmashoos-able (my vocabulary *****).

Also, a lot of the time people will try to shieldgrab you if they block your usmash, but it will usually hit them juuust outside of range, and if you grab immediately after dsmashing you'll get them.

I'm also gonna make a long post on how I handle Falco's sideB in a bit, we can **** the ***** out of that move...

*_Echo_* · Aug 10, 2010

yes we are total noobs T_T i even practiced JC upsmash Oos along time ago and never put it to use >_<

also i wonder if rish browns addvise will change finos mind.. i guess we'll find out on the next episode of "olimar is just too good for m2k" >.>

-Vocal- · Aug 10, 2010

*_Echo_* said:
;-;... but i get custody of the pikmin >.>

You know they love me more than they will ever love you.

RichBrown said:
I've been talking for months about stutterstep fsmash. That extra half inch it gives you is amazing.

Fino told me that we can also usmash OoS luigi's nair. I tried it against a cpu luigi, and like Fino said it would pikmin rocket every time.

We are seriously the biggest group of noobs for not utilizing this sooner hahaha.

For me it's not a matter of learning when to usmashoos or shieldgrab. There are some moves that are just better to shieldgrab, or are not usmashoos-able (my vocabulary *****).

Also, a lot of the time people will try to shieldgrab you if they block your usmash, but it will usually hit them juuust outside of range, and if you grab immediately after dsmashing you'll get them.

I'm also gonna make a long post on how I handle Falco's sideB in a bit, we can **** the ***** out of that move...

I've always thought you were touting backwards stutter, which is an amazing tactic that works when I use it (but I don't use it consistently), but do you also stutter forward at times?

Usmash...OoS...Luigi's nair? FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF
Ok, Fino's right. Every hard MU just flew out the window.

Nice tip about blockes smashes, and I await your Illusion info

iFudge · Aug 10, 2010

You guys should also input more rar with your aerials.

-Vocal- · Aug 10, 2010

iFudge said:
You guys should also input more rar with your aerials.

No. Just no. The only RAR that is useful is if we are running away and we RAR to Fair in the direction we came from. Useful for matchups like Peach who ordinarily are in the air to avoid a pivot grab, but it's not going to be a staple of usual Olimar play.

*_Echo_* · Aug 10, 2010

u know kairi and bobby mcfay love me WAY more than u XP tho leroy and mcjagger probly love u more ;-;

-Vocal- · Aug 10, 2010

*_Echo_* said:
u know kairi and bobby mcfay love me WAY more than u XP tho leroy and mcjagger probly love u more ;-;

WHO TOLD YOU TO NAME THE PIKMIN!! :@

I kinda feel bad because I don't have anything tactical to tack on to the end of this one ^_^

*_Echo_* · Aug 10, 2010

-Vocal- said:
WHO TOLD YOU TO NAME THE PIKMIN!! :@

I kinda feel bad because I don't have anything tactical to tack on to the end of this one ^_^

well i thought it got a bit confuzling so i named them ;-; <3 "BABY COME BACK!!"

also... upsmash Oos is too good >.> oli will be top tier very soon

also can we upsmash Oos marths dancing blade??

RichBrown · Aug 10, 2010

Ok I'm on a computer now

=^.^=Falco's sideB=^.^=

Just some stuff off the top of my head

-Our utilt, dtilt, and nair beat the move most of the time. I haven't tested ftilt, but I'd imagine that works too.

-All our smashes will beat it sometimes, the timing and spacing are hard.

It's a quick move, and it's hard to react to. The key though is not to try to time the move. The moment you see the sideB coming, just do one of the tilts. They like to sideB out of laser, and also when they are seemingly in a bad position.

Now when it comes to Falco being offstage, I think he have a lot of options. A trick I like to use is I'll stand sorta close to the ledge to make it look like I'm gonna try to edge hog, but I'll face AWAY from the ledge and shield. Then, when Falco sideBs to the stage, I'm already in a position to shieldgrab him.

This one I haven't really been able to put to work, but I'd imagine this would work amazingly. Since our dtilt beats his sideB as well as reaches over the ledge slightly, it'd probably be a good idea to wait at the very ledge to make it look like you're going to edge guard, then just dtilt the illusion. This also puts Falco a little above you so you can fair him, or even spike him if possible.

If he decides to recover really high to avoid all of this, just upB.

If he decides to just start recovering to the ledge, then you can edgehog him.

Super Rich Brown special: When they are coming back, do that thing where you run off the stage and tether, except you immediately land back on the stage, it practically ensures that he's gonna recover to the stage. (I'm NOT referring to instant return. I think there's a video of this somewhere from like 2008, I'll try to find it in case any of you are confused).

Messing up Falco's sideB requires some very quick reactions/smart decisions/prediction, so just work on it. Avoid just sitting there and waiting for the sideB too because the falco will catch on and stop doing it as much, plus he has plenty of other options anyways. Maintain your mobility and react quickly to the move.

OH also, if you utilt sideB, it will interrupt your utilt, and Falco will land right next to you, allowing for a free move of your choice.

Other Falco stuff since I'm here:

-We can probably usmash OoS between Falco's 2nd and 1st jab (I'm referring to when he cancels it).

-There's NO REASON to fight him when you're at chaingrab percent. Just hop around on platforms, dair, maybe try to pivot grab, or dsmash him through the platform (holy **** that's so ****) or even usmash OoS. You can be a little more loose when you're not at CG percents, but still avoid getting grabbed by Falco because it can lead to some serious damage.

-Just keep Falco at Fsmash range at all times. Don't close the gap for any reason, even if he seems open.

I'm also digging Brood's mixup where he starts to jump at you, then DIs back ever so slightly and grabs. That's really good.

Yeah that's all for now.

Rust · Aug 10, 2010

Didn't realize this was our tactical discussion thread because I'm too dense x.x
Anyways, reposting since I was told this would be better for it D=

Rust said:
Some things about double Usmash strings:

Following up is hard to do correctly with anything other than Pikmin Chain

Yellow Usmash can combo from any color Usmash, even Purple, assuming that the said character was grounded and DI has been read. This includes Jigglypuff (lightest character and slowest faller).

Anything can combo from a White Usmash, including Purple. However, on characters lighter than Metaknight (Kirby, Squirtle, GnW, Jigglypuff), you will likely have to chase.

You will also have to chase characters who are less floaty than Ivysaur (Toon Link, Marth, Zelda, Peach, Lucario, Kirby, Samus). ROB and Ivysaur are exceptions because of how wide they are compared to the human characters. I hit Ness with White Usmash to Purple 7 out of 10 times without moving, one of them being whiffed; he seems to be the middle ground

The trajectory of Usmash's knockback is behind Olimar. It sends the opponents backwards. If the opponent struck with Usmash is in front of him, he'll be drawn into the next one. If he is behind Olimar, then you will have to account for DI + the trajectory away from Olimar.

However, if the character is close enough to be touching, say, Olimar's nose, it will send them slightly forward into the area that the Second Pikmin in the Pikmin Chain would hit.

The weight and falling speed list can be found here: http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=4300535&postcount=1

*_Echo_* · Aug 10, 2010

^yay!

also rich i did not understand the rich brown special. help pease

-Vocal- · Aug 10, 2010

RichBrown said:
Falco Things

Some of this I knew, but quite a few things I did not; good **** Rich. Who needs a Falco matchup discussion when we've got you :laugh:

I wanna see you beat Larry now

Alright guys, we've got **** to do

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