Tales of Symphonia Mafia | Game Over - Town Wins Yayuhzz

There are like 6 people in this game playing with the exat same useless and scummy playstyle. Just makign everyones posts run together in my mind =/

what are you talking about riddle? chaco had the same attitude and i dont get it. this is actually one of the better games ive played

and real talk x1 is still the play today. just hammer him before he claims and everyone backs off and we do some lame halfassed deadline lynch

nah, i feel riddle, i just want half the game to die

meh

vote: X1

you are my hero

Riddle said:

There are like 6 people in this game playing with the exat same useless and scummy playstyle. Just makign everyones posts run together in my mind =/

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Cynical and spiteful are the main differences between you and the player majority it seems to me.

I mean that in the most objective and not-personal way possible. p:

Sworddancer. said:

@Vult: What is it about X1 that you find scummy?

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Good question! I don't think my specific reason's been brought up by anyone yet.

It's his questions. Two of them from earlier mainly They're scummy.

X1-12 said:

@Vult: Why only asking Marsh?

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Reads as fluffy. I don't think he has to gain anything or gets any kind of read by asking this. What was he expecting ["Because I felt like it", "Because he's my scumbuddy"]? I feels like he's just trying to slide into discussion to make it appear that he's scumhunting when he's not actually doing anything.

And this one:

X1-12 said:

why are half your posts one-liners?

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is similar to the above. What does he expect Mashy to say to this? He's not genuinely asking in search of information. He's trying to point it out to other players as though it's a scumtell and asking the question is just to place Marshy into a spot where it's really difficult to answer without looking scummy.

Should have let him claim first.

That was the hammer, right?

****ing glad hes dead i think hes scum

also i bought this game recently and its pretty baller. any suggestions for good parties?

wuz rlli gud

xiivi friended me =/

Crap. Time for a reread of Day 2.

vote: Rajam

Nothings changed, and the fact that swords was on him as well....yea =P Until I see something that convinces me otherwise, my vote is not moving.

um...what? not a good reason

vote rajam

bah, go town/scum

I am also down for a Rajam lynch. He doesn't post very ofent. When he does post , it is little more than fluff the whole game, which is scummy. And he's been really wishy-washy.

VOTE RAJAM

Noooooooooooooooooooo!

Now I have no mafia games play. effing scum. . .

Go town!

*dies*

ok, I need the pressure to post more; accepted, and sorry about that. I'll be really active from now on since I finally ended some other issues updating the SWF Ranking and in college, and stuff in general. Now, I did a quick re-check on Day 1 and Day 2, and I tried to analyze a little more Hilt's death (I guess Thinkaman was right that it should be analyzed even if it's only a little) + the last events...

I have two scummy candidates.

First one is Chaco. When people started to jump on him in Day 1, his reaction was childish to say the least. His AtE is pretty obvious, which I don't like.

Chaco said:

Yeah, this is why I don't play mafia anymore I remember now. Me dying is the best thing that can happen to this game.

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Chaco said:

Cause thats the only way you'll realize it obv.

Sword, nope. Im frustrated enough with this game.

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Chaco said:

Marshy is the only player here who is not falling into the wishy washy bull****. And that is a ****ing fact. The rest of you learn to stop waiting on ONE player to do your work for you, all this town has ****ing done besides a few people is exactly this:

"Swiss is scummy but so is zac, well chaco is now too. what should I do? Chaco tell me why swiss is scummy, someone else tell me why zac is scummy, im gonna sit here with my thumb up my *** and piss away scum because im playing to safely for myself to even attack anyone."

I will give this to Swiss, he'll at least bite back. The rest of you, jesus, you just sit there and stare.

X1, have you ever played a game with me? I ALWAYS get frustrated when I think people are playing stupidly which makes me get quite angry and rage post. When I rage post people get all like "AtE!", then I just want to rage harder. Pro-Meta tip, I have never raged as scum and never will because I get to manipulate town which is EXTRAORDINARILY easy with a town like this. I'd practically have to do nothing and let you piss away scum.

Rage post ever, here's the tl;dr:

I'm not scumhunting for you anymore, Ive handed him to you on a nice silver platter.
If you say AtE, I'm liable to bite your head off.
And this town needs to stop being wishy washy pieces of bull**** drifting down a stream in the wind.

This is my last post of the day, I will NOT respond to anything else. Im going to stop reading and reread over night if I make it until then. If I dont I can cancel the prescription for blood pressure medication. If Swiss doesn't die and Zac does...there will be a ****storm D2.

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All these posts are AtE and childish frustration. I've always considered AtE reactions scummy, since they stop people of playing an agressive game and pressuring even more the affected player. He was also pressured by Hilt before he died a lot, which is reflected in the final vote count:

Xiivi said:

Swiss - 7: Chaco, Dr. Riddler, Marshy, Tandora, UTDZac, Sworddancer, Thinkaman
Chaco - 3: Swiss, Hilt, Vult Redux
UTDZac - 2: X1-12, Nix2100
Not Voting - 1: Rajam

Takes 7 / 13 to lynch!

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Finally, this was Chaco's last post Day 2. Though these are legit johns, he hasn't posted since yet. Also, again I see people voting with no strong reasons; another thing which I don't like and which I find scummy. Chaco's position on X1-12 wagon was third, which is generally an scummy position for joining wagons, specially considering he voted showing not real reasons and considering he didn't post after that.

Chaco said:

I got school again, so expect lessened activity. I'm still due a reread but for now, I'm okay with doing this.

Vote: X1

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Chaco is my play for today.

vote: Chaco

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Another person I find scummy at the moment is Zac. He votes with no strong reasons (again, scummy). In day 1 he voted Swiss just to plain survive. He didn't present solid reasons to go against him, he just wanted to survive:

UTDZac said:

Between me and Swiss, I think I'm the only one who fully claimed, right?

In case you forgot: Regal Bryant (Vanilla Town)

Since I haven't voted yet and I'd much rather Swiss go down than me at this point, I think this is fair:

Vote: Swiss

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And his last two posts Day 2 were the next:

UTDZac said:

Can you explain what you meant by the "PM color thing?" If it has to do with marshy clearing himself Day 1 (what you said in an earlier post) I must have missed it. I don't have time right now to go back and look, it would probably take me 20 times longer than just asking. Thanks in advance =)

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I didn't notice it at first (I responded this question to Zac), but this shows he isn't even paying attention to what is said in the game. This mean one thing: Zac is skimming

UTDZac said:

Nix, you should totally use an inverted marshy avatar.... :O

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... totally unuseful post.

FoS: Zac

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About Sworddancer flip and his last words:
I really wonder who he investigated, though I think he detected N1 some townie or else he would have claimed if he detected scum. He was on my case, as well as Vult's and Zac's. Other people weren't of his trust, although nothing strong. Most likely, he was right about one of us, so that mean I need to work hard to clear my name because I know I'm town, and so need to do Vult and Zac as well. There is also the possibility scum NKilled him to make our cases just easier since he was pressuring us. It's a pseudo-wifom scenario, in which is very probable the people he was accusing are most likely scum, but it not unlikely at all that other people not suspected by SDancer used that chance to make our cases easier. Finally, I can't see a strong trend that connects Hilt's death+SDancer death, which means no one is "clean" by now, not even marshy with the PM color thing after what Nix said about the other past games of Gheb. If anyone, I'd say Zac is probably responsible or involved in those kills, but again this assumes scum kill people that is right about their perceptions of scum, instead of just killing people to make cases against other innocents easier.

So, at the end, it's hard to conclude anything from Hilt+Sdancer deaths at the moment, and it's always better to go just by the simplest option (scum kills people potentially dangerous for them), and go against people showing scummy behavior, which I think Chaco and Zac are presenting at the moment.

Rajam is dumb, that's pretty obv. Try this out for a change Rajam, literally know he's scum and have town flailing around like a bunch of idiots. Then tell me you would not get frustrated.

I can't tell if you're dumb for attacking me, or scum for attacking me.

Also Zac just did a tell in which I hate, can't tell if it's because he's new or not. I pinged Swords with it in Pikmaf. The "Crap" or "insert something about the NK here". Yeah, it's a pretty strong tell imho. So, for now FoS: Zac

I'll probably land my vote on Rajam, probably. Not sure yet, I still owe a reread.

Also, Rajam, is probably def dumb after reading that deeper. "Third on a wagon is a scummy position."

Explain to me why this is true, cause it's glaringly obvious that you do not know and are simply reaching. Especially due to your wording on that.

Dr. Riddler said:

wuz rlli gud

xiivi friended me =/

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What was the point of this post?

Thinkaman said:

I think this sort of post/criticism (pointing out a single useless post) is really scummy. It's just so safe and distracting, it's like the low-hanging fruit of scum moves. Why should town care that marshy made one useless post out of like fifty? It's only an issue when it's chronic, hence my vote.

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I made my post because Riddle's post literally was useless. He intentionally misspelled it so bad I still am not sure what he was saying and then says Xivii added him as a friend? Also, it was the first post of the day which drew my attention to it after Chaco's comment about scum making posts like Zac's.

I can see your point about Nix's fluff posts. I still want to stay on Rajam for reasons previously given. Also, the fact Sword was suspicious of him adds weight to his scumminess. Day2 would have been too early for a good cop to have claimed at that point, but putting pressure and a vote would have made lots of sense.

Not sure what I think about the QT comment. I originally read it as Rajam going along with Swiss' "trick question" and got almost a LOL vibe from it. After Swiss flipped, I would have thought maybe they were partners, but presumably all the Desnians are dead. This means either Rajam is scum who knows that he has a QT also or he's town and distracting everyone with pointless topics. Regardless, it lends to the dumb or scum mentality which leaves my vote pretty firmly where it is.

dancer would be an AWFUL cop to notve pushed rajam (or anyone) hardbody if he had a guilty on him. i dont think he investigated anyone guilty cuz i dont like to think a cop could be so bad

but rajam can still die

Chaco said:

Rajam is dumb, that's pretty obv. Try this out for a change Rajam, literally know he's scum and have town flailing around like a bunch of idiots. Then tell me you would not get frustrated.

I can't tell if you're dumb for attacking me, or scum for attacking me.

Also Zac just did a tell in which I hate, can't tell if it's because he's new or not. I pinged Swords with it in Pikmaf. The "Crap" or "insert something about the NK here". Yeah, it's a pretty strong tell imho. So, for now FoS: Zac

I'll probably land my vote on Rajam, probably. Not sure yet, I still owe a reread.

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The problem is not getting frustrated, but how you handle the frustration, and you handled it horribly and personally I think is scummy, mostly because I'm aware you are an experimented player here so I don't understand how you could've reacted like that.

Chaco said:

Also, Rajam, is probably def dumb after reading that deeper. "Third on a wagon is a scummy position."

Explain to me why this is true, cause it's glaringly obvious that you do not know and are simply reaching. Especially due to your wording on that.

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Third and four positions in every wagon must be specially analyzed. I read it some months ago in the mafiascum wikipedia or something like that; at first I didn't understand why those positions are scummy, but then after checking some games I've played or I've reviewed, I learned is true. Thinking about it, scum feels more confident about voting for a non-scum player when others are voting him, so the scum player can use the excuse that town is agreeding with that wagon and at the same time feels more confident about not being accused by the wagoned player (among other things). Those positions are scummy per se and people who jump in wagons in those positions must be analyzed and checked that their reasons are indeed strong and not just some "I'll do it because now I feel more confident about doing it and town is doing it so I don't see major problem"...

Thinkaman said:

Quad-post! I remembered this while taking a crap, so you know it has to be good:



Looks like the QT can of worms might be open again...

Also sorry for formatting fail in last post. Anyway I'm done now, combo over.

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QTs are the universal tool given to scum/masons to communicate outside the game thread; they are everywhere in mafiascum.net. idk which "servers" scum use to communicate here, but I don't see a problem assuming QTs or the likes, specially for a simple and fast scum-trap.

Thinkaman said:

On one hand I feel smart for lynching a second non-town in a row. On the other, apparently I was completely wrong in guessing that the Desians were already dead.

That said, I think the Desians really are dead now, thanks in part to X1-12's frustrated post from the grave.

Late two nights ago I reread the topic and remember thinking that nix was going to be by initial vote on Day 3. To be honest though, I can't remember why exactly... (It was really late!) His posts are so empty and he seems like such a minimal threat to scum that I see no disadvantage to having him claim.

What do you guys think? (Nix, don't claim until others discuss)

vote nix





I think this sort of post/criticism (pointing out a single useless post) is really scummy. It's just so safe and distracting, it's like the low-hanging fruit of scum moves. Why should town care that marshy made one useless post out of like fifty? It's only an issue when it's chronic, hence my vote.

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No; people use empty posts to look like they're being active when in reality they aren't doing anything. They don't scumhunt, fall in flavor conversations, unhelpful/dumb posts, etc. I could agree that only that maybe is not enought, but people doing that need to be noticed, and tell them not to do that. Also, in my accusations against Chaco and Zac they were support elements, not the only ones.

Thinkaman said:

I can see sword's death itself as a clue though. Why target him? I think this line of thought incriminates Vult more, since Vult had more reason to snip the lone voice against him in the bud.

Then again, I still am clueless as to why Hilt was killed N1. It makes less and less sense.

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Looked over Hilt's posts and Sworddancer's final post.

Hilt pushed really hard for Zac and a fair bit on Chaco. I could see both of these pushes because he was Swiss' partner and didn't want to have his buddy lynched, but there was no way to know that at the time. Post 238 goes against Blue Yoshi (and thus Nix) a bit.

Sword's final post is suspicious against a lot of people - Rajam, Zac, Nix, and Vult. Lots of Sword's pushes were for Zac. He pushed for Zac D1 and D2.

Leaning towards FOS ZAC at this time after these reads. Still feel Rajam is the better choice though.

If Swords had investigated me guilty he wouldn't have given up pressure on me halfway through D2. That applies to anyone really. He certainly got an Innocent result. Wonder if he breadcrumbed it. I'll take a look into his posts.

Vote: Rajam

Iz claim time yet?

Nix2100 said:

vote: Rajam

Nothings changed, and the fact that swords was on him as well....yea =P Until I see something that convinces me otherwise, my vote is not moving.

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1

marshy said:

um...what? not a good reason

vote rajam

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2

Tandora said:

I am also down for a Rajam lynch. He doesn't post very ofent. When he does post , it is little more than fluff the whole game, which is scummy. And he's been really wishy-washy.

VOTE RAJAM

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...3 (putting attention to Tandora...)

Vult Redux said:

If Swords had investigated me guilty he wouldn't have given up pressure on me halfway through D2. That applies to anyone really. He certainly got an Innocent result. Wonder if he breadcrumbed it. I'll take a look into his posts.

Vote: Rajam

Iz claim time yet?

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4 and no reason at all, when I just said...:

Rajam said:

Third and four positions in every wagon must be specially analyzed. I read it some months ago in the mafiascum wikipedia or something like that; at first I didn't understand why those positions are scummy, but then after checking some games I've played or I've reviewed, I learned is true. Thinking about it, scum feels more confident about voting for a non-scum player when others are voting him, so the scum player can use the excuse that town is agreeding with that wagon and at the same time feels more confident about not being accused by the wagoned player (among other things). Those positions are scummy per se and people who jump in wagons in those positions must be analyzed and checked that their reasons are indeed strong and not just some "I'll do it because now I feel more confident about doing it and town is doing it so I don't see major problem"...

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Vult, are you skimming? Solid reasons for your vote right now plz
FoS: Vult

btw I'm at L-1...

claim: Presea

uhgh nvm that last vote was insane, and Vult actually fits perfectly in Hilt+SWDancer's deaths... left alone he was highly pressured by sworddancer Day 2 as well; day 1 he was in a passive attitude ("please ask me questions" thing...) and I don't feel him as town really (yeah guts involved too), he has been scummy the whole game

unvote
vote: Vult

Vult if I'm scum, who else is? Who are your other candidates?
Tandora same question to you

Zac who is the play today ¿

Rajam said:

Vult if I'm scum, who else is? Who are your other candidates?

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Depends what exactly you flip. If Desian then there's probably only a SK left. If other scum then I'm not sure.

Zac. MAYBE Tandora or Chaco.

Rajam said:

Vult, are you skimming? Solid reasons for your vote right now plz

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Only long and boring posts.

Sure thing! Case incoming.

I'm kind of surprised that you're surprised at my vote. I was first to bring you up Day 2, iirc. You should've expected it.

Why does Vult [aka: Why should the Town] find Rajam scummy?!

I had some interactions with him early in the game that I noted were scummy and then forgot about until I reread him on D2. Such things include:

In post 35/45 he bes lame and doesn't want to take responsibility for his vote. While it's debatable whether this is explicitly scummy, blaming RVS for your vote DOES take the sting away from your vote and defeats the point of voting in the first place.

I'm aware that this point is weak and PROBABLY doesn't mean much other than a slight Swiss-Rajam connection but I decided it's worth a mention. You can ignore it if you want. There are better reasons to vote him.

In post 80 he tries really really hard to make a stretch and "catch" me in a contradiction that isn't there.

In post 89 he takes off his Swiss vote [just after a few others pile on their own Swiss votes, but not before he's at serious risk of lynch] and doesn't replace it. This post is sandwiched between massclaim talk [fluffy, NOT scumhunting stuff]. Where's the scum-hunting initiative?

In his next post returns to the scene after a little more than 100 pages and he unvotes again. Lawl. Again, indicates lack of scumhuting initiative, the best tell evar.

In post 254 he's all ready to go after Swiss. At least that's what it looks like. His first quote is lulzy; he "won't even comment" on that last part of Swiss' post but made extra sure to bring attention to it even though it doesn't really mean much about Swiss' alignment. His focus seems to be primarily on Swiss but he doesn't explicitly SAY SO and he doesn't put down a vote either.

In post 260/261 he forgoes scumhunting for more flavor talk.

Post 266 he targets lurkers. It's not much of an improvement. Still lazy. There's totally awesome stuff and totally lame stuff for him to jump/comment on with Zac and Swiss and Swords and all, but he takes a safe route with Tandora for "lurking".

In 418 he doesn't mention Tandora except as someone that he "need to check more on". The post is overall very agreeable with no clear scum/town opinions on ANYONE and it looks like he's trying to avoid stepping on anyone's toes.

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If anyone really has any doubt they can just read any post after that. To add it here would belabor his scumminess which should already be completely evident even without my having to post this. If anything this post is more to show that my vote isn't an easy bandwagon vote than it is to try to convince people to lynch him; a quick ISO read of him done by anyone should be enough to put him on a scumlist. Don't need my help.

Rajam, you just proved to me that you literally know nothing about wagon placements. My vote will go to you more than likely.

I'm feeling a bit of ambivalence towards Vult.