All Characters Match-up Chart (9/07 update)

[Simna ibn Sind]

lolol i was joking....but i live in california...where you cant pick your own nose without picking the noses of 12 other people at the same time

 

[UTDZac]

Oh guys listen to him. Hes ranked in a CITY area....he must be really good. I didnt know they even ranked things by less than state.....im an a$$ forgive me.

Well there is no official ranking in dallas. But Its pretty obvious when you know everyone who plays competitively in the area and can beat them all, with the exception of one guy of course.

 

[NES n00b]

Guys. I think Skyler knows what he is talking about and **** whoever says that matchup is even. That is right. **** you. You have no idea how annoying this matchup is for either players. Peach can kill Link ok with her edgeguarding skills (it is harder to come back than you non Link mains think >_>) and it is not Link has an easy way to get a kill move in. The best way is to get a bomb and use a decent killing move, but that is harder than it sounds. Also, Link can't really edgeguard. The best thing that Link can hope for is that he throws a bomb and hits the Peach or that the Peach airdodges close enough so he can hit her. Usually, neither of those kill her in a decent size stage anyways.

She can't be grabbed and her FC and priority makes it hard for Link to fight back if Link is close. Her sheild pressure game is really good since she can't be grabbed and Link has a pretty slow ****ing roll.

I say Link gets 4-6 to Peach but a 5-5 in the annoying factor. Seriously, people should listen to a good Link main like Skyler. <_<

 

[Wave⁂]

cablepuff, I'm not saying Samus counters Link. I'm fine with a 5-5 matchup. I'm not saying she's better; she just not as horrible as a 7-3.

 

[Skler]

Can anybody give me a reason Link vs peach would be even? Bombs aren't enough to even the matchup and Peach ***** Link up close so hard it isn't even funny. Peach also gets random kills with the dsmash at mid %s because it ruins Link's hookshot recovery, forcing him to use the all too easy to edgeguard reverse upB.

Link can get kills at early %s with bomb -> bad DI -> dair. Otherwise Link has to work hard to get his finishers, Peach doesn't have easy kills either but she can land grabs and get Link off the edge pretty well.

 

[NES n00b]

cablepuff, I'm not saying Samus counters Link. I'm fine with a 5-5 matchup. I'm not saying she's better; she just not as horrible as a 7-3.

I would say that, too. At best, 6-4 for Link but it seems pretty even to me. Samus does very well when she gets close to Link.

 

[NJzFinest]

NES Noob, if it makes you happy, Link is one of my mains lol but anyways, I didn't say Link had an easy time at all nor as any of the other recent posters. I've played enough gay Peach players and spoke over this matchup with Mr. C and Trevyn a couple of times.
Despite the fact Skler brings up some pretty solid/good points (unlike yourself), could you hop of his **** alittle? Thanks.

 

[NES n00b]

NES Noob, if it makes you happy, Link is one of my mains lol but anyways, I didn't say Link had an easy time at all nor as any of the other recent posters. I've played enough gay Peach players and spoke over this matchup with Mr. C and Trevyn a couple of times.
Despite the fact Skler brings up some pretty solid/good points (unlike yourself), could you hop of his **** alittle? Thanks.

That does make me a little happier thanks.

I made a list awhile back why Link is not even with Peach. So yeah. And ok I will get off his ***, but his points are really valid. What does Link have in this matchup? He has bombs for start up combos, she has more troubles than most against projectiles, disjointed hitboxes to help against Peache's priority, upairs are good for low percent combos, can kill peach easier than other low tiers, and can avoid CCs with well spaced fairs. Does this sound like this is enough to make this an even matchup compared to what Skyler and I listed? IMO, no, but whatever.

Edi: I gave a much better list than to support my side of the arguement than "Spam does matter." >.>

2nd Edit: If you responded to me because of the "**** you" comment for those think it is even, that was a joke. Did you even read my whole post or did you just skim the top and the bottom with the Skyler comments? v_v

 

[NJzFinest]

Edi: I gave a much better list than to support my side of the arguement than "Spam does matter." >.>

First off, that's not all I said lol, I elaborated a little bit on it (enough actually). Second, I was merely commenting of what Skler said, not really trying to form/continue an argument.

2nd Edit: If you responded to me because of the "**** you" comment for those think it is even, that was a joke.

....what?

Did you even read my whole post or did you just skim the top and the bottom with the Skyler comments? v_v

Calm down lol, I read it.

 

[NES n00b]

First off, that's not all I said lol, I elaborated a little bit on it (enough actually). Second, I was merely commenting of what Skler said, not really trying to form/continue an argument.

....what?

Calm down lol, I read it.

Heh, it doesn't matter. I just don't believe the matchup is even mainly because of Peach's close game which is great sheild pressuring game, priority, and cannot be grabbed while giving grabs herself. No hard feelings.

 

[Winston]

An interesting observation is that mains who are good with their character tend to underrate their character in the matchup. (NJz and Skler say peach has the advantage, UTD Zac says it's hard for peach) etc. etc.

 

[NES n00b]

An interesting observation is that mains who are good with their character tend to underrate their character in the matchup. (NJz and Skler say peach has the advantage, UTD Zac says it's hard for peach) etc. etc.

Not true. I under rate my character because I am bad with him (Link).

Edit: Alot of the Mario matchups seem wrong to me, too. Especially the Luigi matchup. And Link has better matchups than this list shows. Samus and ICs in particular.

 

[Finn Macool]

The samus marth match up is more in favour of marth than this shows

 

[thesage]

Well I was going to debate about the matchups but, they're not there.... so w/e

 

[BigRick]

god****it link and peach move at the same speed

Link has the advantage from afar while Peach has it from up close.

5-5 matchup fools

 

[NES n00b]

god****it link and peach move at the same speed

Link has the advantage from afar while Peach has it from up close.

5-5 matchup fools

Melee game > far away game in terms of importance. Well, at least I would think so.

I wonder what the Peach boards think about this?

 

[Dark.Pch]

Peach is at her best when playing defensive. With Link, Its best she plays that way with all the weapons and his regular attaks coming at her. Link has some good Combos on Peach and makes it hard for Peach to close in on Link cause of the weapons and if the link knows how to spam well. You rush at a link like that with Peach, your getting own. Here link has the upper hand. And when she FC, Linl can shoot her down with bommerangs and bombs done right.

When Peach is up close, she can do much more damage than link. And cause of his weight, she can combo him well. And when Peach is in his face or not that far from him. Link wont be able to use his weapons. They come out slow and Peach can abuse that and bad too. And her air game is better than Link. a good turnip game against Link works well on him since he is not all that fast. turnips+ FC + combos= ended

I agree with big rick, fight is even in the right hands. watch vidjo fight aniki. (im sure it was vidjo who fought him, or was it mikael) I forgot but yea watch that and you'll see

 

[BigRick]

Melee game > far away game in terms of importance. Well, at least I would think so.

I wonder what the Peach boards think about this?

lol... if youre far away game is too good

then the melee game might never happen

 

[Skler]

Because peach has ANY trouble at all moving through boomerangs right? Hell no, every aerial peach has hits through it. The bomb is worse than the turnip (turnips can be recaught easily, bombs explode), so peach with a turnip can approach Link pretty easily. Also whats the problem with Peach at a distance? Peach can just avoid spam and throw turnips back. Turnip spam is faster than Link spam if Peach gets into a good position.

Peach players underestimate Peach so much it's not even funny. Link has more priority than her when she is above him, and that's it. The fair is too slow to prevent a careful Peach from approaching. Link can land a combo at low %s, that is all. He can't get kill moves off unless the Peach DIs towards him after getting bombed. Peach gets free grabs almost every time she hits Link's shield because Link has to roll.

Link's only projectile against Peach is the bomb, boomerangs can (sort of) limit movement and prevent turnip pulls, but only in a few situations. Peach with turnip > Link with bomb, Peach can FC and use aerials even with the turnip in hand. Link has to throw the bomb or drop it to fight. Link can't even use his CC game against Peach because of the dsmash.

Link has the advantage in pure spam and close combat range (hardly). He also has slightly earlier KOs and mid % KOs if the peach DIs poorly.

Peach has priority, a grab game, recovery, combos, edgeguarding and better close combat projectiles. Also stichface.

Personally I'd call it a 4-6 in Peach's favor. Peach has a slight advantage, not a big one but it's there all right.

Can we agree on this, or should we resume the debate?

 

[NES n00b]

Because peach has ANY trouble at all moving through boomerangs right? Hell no, every aerial peach has hits through it. The bomb is worse than the turnip (turnips can be recaught easily, bombs explode), so peach with a turnip can approach Link pretty easily. Also whats the problem with Peach at a distance? Peach can just avoid spam and throw turnips back. Turnip spam is faster than Link spam if Peach gets into a good position.

Personally I'd call it a 4-6 in Peach's favor. Peach has a slight advantage, not a big one but it's there all right.

QFT for these two paragraph things. Peach has an easier time avoiding spam than most of you are giving credit for. Believe me. I beat all the peaches here in the Midsouth (for what that is worth ) and it is not because of the "OMGZ they can't approach me" bombs and boomerangs. Most of my bombs avoided and most of boomerangs avoided or naired/baired (though having an awesome bomb/boomerang to dair combo is too cool when they actually freaken hit). Plus, if this is true that Link and Peach is even, then why does the chart not put up an even match up for ICs and Samus as well? Either way, some of these Link matchups are sort of screwy.

Edit: Just thought of something. Peach >> Link on Brinstar, Mute City, DK64, and Dreamland 64 definitely while Link should be more than Peach on Rainbow Cruise. This matchup seems pretty stage dependent, too.

 

[thesage]

Link and Y. Link are even. I'm tired of explaining it over and over again.

Jigglypuff is a 4 for Ness. People have learned how to fight against her (spam fair-chasing to bair).

 

[NJzFinest]

Y. Link has a slight advantage over Link in that matchup simply because of his spam + speed. Y. Link has a much easier time landing hits, and therefore gets damage off with more ease. Neither are efficient in killing each other however (Y. Link is too weak and Link has trouble landing critical hits), so that's why it comes down to who can throw more **** at another.

 

[Cort]

Jigglypuff is a 4 for Ness. People have learned how to fight against her (spam fair-chasing to bair).

Doesn't Jigg's bair have basically more range/priority than any of Ness' attacks? Whenever Ness leaves the stage he is dead, also.

Jigglypuff's favorite meal is PK thunder.

 

[squaminator]

ness's fair and smashes have more priority than jigg's bair. You are correct about the edgeguarding though.

 

[Cort]

Where exactly is Ness going with his fair, though? He can't spam it nearly as well as a Jiggs can spam bair. And it's not like Jiggs is going to be forward smashed constantly <_<

 

[TheManaLord]

C falcon is at least even with IC's, if not better.

 

[Binx]

C falcon is at least even with IC's, if not better.

I would say they are even, Captain Falcon is really easy to kill though. Both players have to try really hard not to be predictable or they die, but you dont need to be as technical with ICs to win the match as you do with Falcon. So although its even at a high level meta, I would say ICs have the advantage until then.

 

[GamerGuitarist7]

1) Marth v Fox (6-4) - Many people think that this matchup is 5-5, and it should be IMO if you list Marth v Falco at 5-5

2) Sheik v Falco (4-6) - I suggest a 5-5 rating because Falco is very gimpable.

3) Falcon v Falco (3-7) - A more conservative opinion should be taken here, 6-4 would be a better indication because Falco can also be killed in no time

1)I agree it shuold be 5-5, if not that then very close to 4-6 because fox has a slight advantage but marth still has his grab.

2) 5-5 if not 6-4 in sheik's favor, so i agree

3) i think its a pretty even fight, maybe slightly in falco's favor. falco wins on offense, but the second that he is put on defense he's pretty much dead.

 

[squaminator]

you guys have got to be kidding me with 1 and 2. marth v. fox is harder for the marth than marth v. falco. fox gets CGd 0-death on FD and mute city, and cg'ed to fsmash on everywhere else except dreamland(high platforms), where fox's usmash is gimped.

and sheik definitely has a disadvantage against falco and fox, due to there being relatively little comboability against space animals for sheik, while fox and falco keep ALL their control and combos (fox can even shine combo sheik). i think that those ratings are fine as they are.

 

[Wave⁂]

I think the Jigglypuff - Ness matchup need to be looked into more.

That is all.

 

[Endless Nightmares]

*Ness attempts to recover*

*Jigglypuff jumps into Ness' PK Thunder*

*Ness plummets to his death*

>,>

 

[Simna ibn Sind]

lol guess how many times that doesnt work


oh btw...a boil down on the ness-puff match ooks sort of like this: Ness has a better chance of knocking jigglypuff off the stage than puff has of knocking ness off the stage(more an better oportunities for ness to hit puff) while Jigglypuff has a better chance of killing Ness if he is knocked off the stage than Ness has of killing puff if she is knocked off the stage(because puff's recovery is just too good).

This does not take into account, however, how fast puff dies off the top.

 

[mood4food77]

jiggs is a really bad match-up for ness


ness has nothing that jiggs can't deal with, and fairs aren't good at all on jiggs....

 

[$hYne]

CF has an slight advantage over jiggz .
Though jiggz can edgeguard him very well he has insane combos + dthrow on her .
Knee kills jiggz at ridiculous low percentages on Yoshis story if your DI is messed up .

Jigglypuff has problems spamming nair because Falcon can Dashdance grab her
due to his speed . And every grab can lead to combo/death (dthrow uair uair, dthrow knee).

At least this is fact in pal but i think it´s in ntsc too .

 

[dashdancedan]

Mewtwo does better against falco than he does against fox, imo. What is your reasoning for saying that falco does better than fox does?

 

[D20]

D20 counters everyone.

 

[handsockpuppet]

i'd like to bring up Roy. Almost everything you said about Roy is completely incorrect. Roy has less then a 4 against Luigi, Luigi pawns him. Roy has an advantage over Ganon, being faster and longer reach and superior aerials and can cancel all his moves. Roy has a HUGE advantage over jigs. he can 1hit K.O. jigs with a reverse blazer. he can do it out of shield and jigs can't shield it. Second, Roys moves have so much knockback that at higher presentages his Fsmash immediately kills light jigs. He also has so damaging moves that can break jig's shield which immediately kills him/her (iunno what jiggly is). Roy has at least a 5 against Fox since he can chain throw and juggle to Fox's doom. Roy realy isn't that bad against IC's. His high knockback moves can easily split them up. down throw Fsmash works a little too well

 

[phish-it]

i'd like to bring up Roy. Almost everything you said about Roy is completely incorrect. Roy has less then a 4 against Luigi, Luigi pawns him. Roy has an disadvantage over Ganon, being faster and longer reach and patheticaerials and can cancel all his moves. Roy has a HUGE advantage over jigs if the jiggs can't avoid the reverse up B. he can 1hit K.O. jigs with a reverse blazer. he can do it out of shield and jigs can't shield it. Second, Roys Smasheshave so much knockback that at higher presentages his Fsmash immediately kills light jigs. He also has so damaging moves that can break jig's shield which immediately kills him/her (iunno what jiggly is): That can be said about anyone and is extrememly rare when it happnes. Roy has at least a 3 against Fox since he can chain throw and juggle to Fox's doom. Roy realy isn't that bad against IC's. His high knockback moves can easily split them up. down throw Fsmash works a little too well

Fixed a couple things.

 

[sagemoon]

meh roy does pretty decent against space animals. dtilt fsmash **** or dtilt uair fsmash ****.

This topic helps to a point. But in the end it doesnt do much. For example, take 2 equally skilled average players and 2 equally skilled pros. With the average player, theres a whole different game altogether. A lot of thought is put into the "idea" of a character. Assuming we are talking about if they were equally skilled at the fullest potential. In reality though, certain styles counter one another, and most moves that make certain characters counter another character arent used among the average player. See what i mean? This list constantly changes as a player grows in skill. Like as a noob, I would be even with a lets say mario of the same skill as me if i were to play marth. Then when i was average skill I would be greater than that mario player. But now, as things like wall techs and di were perfected, its average again. So I guess "counters" all depend on how you use the character... Which completely negates the effect of this list cause theres thousands of style out there.

 

[Progamer74]

wery nice but i just like to play and learn instead of hear someones opinion