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You zap jump BY b-sticking (but you probably know this), and by the way is it even possible to zapjump without the b-stick? I will admit that I don't know if it is. And when I say spammable I mean repeatedly doing it faster, which is good in case you miss/feel you can follow up with another PKfire. In addition I bet that at 0 buffer you do not do it as fast as someone b-sticking. Having 10 buffer on Lucas is a setback, and it is easily avoidable by b-sticking.
Still doesn't mean you should modify the upair. That really isn't even gonna fix the issue...you(the person being planked) won't get hit as much but Metaknight will still be able to regrab the ledge... There are plenty of other moves that MK will be able to use to replace upair (although it's the best one for the situation) It really isn't gonna help if you look at what makes planking actually work and it is a situational tactic. The player will react accordingly so upair isn't gonna always be the best move. All you'll be doing is making upair a crappier move by limiting it's range. Upair isn't even really supposed to hit when planking it's just a threat tactic that makes the person scared to approach.
Ninjalink never killed himself while attempting a Zap jump..What does that tell you?
You don't do it by zapjumping.......Ninjalink never killed himself while attempting a Zap jump..What does that tell you?
No freefall after B is a change only you want because it caters to fixing your mistake. It's not gonna help the character at all, nor does Lucas even need it. He's crazy already. Just get better with it and you won't kill yourself as much.
Ok well according to your previous post you sometimes mess up Psi Magnet and PK fire and accidentally use the PK freeze instead...both of those are wayyy easier than doing a Zap jump. For you to mess those simple commands up shows a huge lack of technical competence on your part. To mess up those on bstick and have a neutral b come out is quite sad...
Actually I don't b-stick and I zap jump all the time (I changed R to attack so I don't have to claw).
I just hit y and b at the same time to zapjump. I use default controls, and I can still bstick everything just as well, I'm telling you its not that hard.
Its not that its hard to do them, its that if you press the b-stick at a certain angle, (right near the corner, which is where you need to press the c-stick to psidash) its possible that you will do a PK Freeze. It has nothing to do with having bad technical skill because you can't even really do PKfreeze with he b-stick reliably if you WANTED to. You almost never do PKfreeze when zapjumping (which I do) because you press the stick to the side in order to do PK fire. If you don't play Lucas I think you shouldn't even be saying these things. So what I sometimes (IE rarely) press the c-stick into the corner and do a PKfreeze instead of a psidash, I fail to see how this means I have no technical skill.Ok well according to your previous post you sometimes mess up Psi Magnet and PK fire and accidentally use the PK freeze instead...both of those are wayyy easier than doing a Zap jump. For you to mess those simple commands up shows a huge lack of technical competence on your part. To mess up those on bstick and have a neutral b come out is quite sad...
GET BETTER.
You're not understanding what I'm talking about. When you b-stick, and you hit it at a 45% angle down, you SOMETIMES do a PK freeze. Not every time, only if your moving in certain directions and sometimes randomly. Me hitting the c-stick into the exact same place I hit it a couple seconds ago could make me do an entirely different move, which then makes me die if I'm offstage.
Blend them? He took the plussery code set and warped it. There is a reason our codeset doesn't have a ton of downgrav, there is a reason why Captain Falcon doesn't have a ridiculous amounts of buffs. There is no need to blend, and if he was concerned about Brawl+ then he would be pushing for buffs normally like everyone else is on the team. Instead he circumvents us, uses our code as a base, and then tries to push for everyone to use his ****. It's BS.
No. The whole point of this entire thread was supposed to be for some people to make their own nightly builds to experiment and steal from each other's thread to add to the plussery. I am NOT pushing my set for the "standard" set but its there so that I can actually SHOW you my ideas because its clear to me that words enough don't cut it. I see it as Plussery set v2 which is a different perspective so that hopefully, some things can get incorporated into the official set. I should have claimed my set as official a long time ago before the plussery came out of nowhere to do it but I missed my chance.
You are yet another person who apparently doesn't know the intent of this thread either. This thread isn't for plussery nightly builds only. Its for several nightly builds so we can build off of each other to add to the official set. People wanted several sets like pre plussery and in fact, this thread was delay for about a week coming from the broom because we were waiting on Alopex to add his nightly builds code set as well.
I buff everyone thank you very much. Falcon is not god in my set like you claim or overbuffed. You have been away for several months so maybe you don't know everything about the why's and how's about this thread to point fingers. I still make contributions to the plussery set and I do credit the plussery in my set as well.
So you want to add universal down grav, readjusted hitstun, increased running speeds and all that? Well that's great for fun stuff, but if your goal is to get it incorporated into the plussery set then why aren't you debating it? If you feel it has merit, you are a WBR member so you can post your findings and we can talk it out. From reading your stuff it seems that you haven't let this go because you feel it has merit, so why don't you bring the topic back up?
Really now? Your words don't cut it? Maybe there is a reason why they don't. Maybe it's because some of your ideas aren't quite as sound as you think they are. Hell, I JUST showed up, pushed for a reasonable Link buff, and it's going to come to fruition soon. It's not like it's hard to get the WBR to do something if you have good logic and reasoning to back up what you say.
If you claimed it official you wouldn't have had legitimacy anyways. It's not as if the Plussery took that away from you, as the Plussery was simply a group that the site formed to make an official set. From what I have been told, they did indeed look over and even incorporated some of your ideas, but other things were tossed out as well.
Two things to say to this quote. One, Falcon doesn't really need that much in the ways of buffs. He's already a really good character. We haven't buffed him much because of that.
It really doesn't take me that long to get caught up with stuff.
Glad you figured it out I was about to tell you this myself as I just tested it myself and found the same results.Ok guys, I figured out exactly how to b-stick PKfreeze. If you hit 45% down on the c-stick softly you do PKFreeze. But you have to hit EXACTLY in the same spot. I guess I withdraw my change request(even though I would still be happy if it was added) as because of this it IS based in technical skill. The only problem I have is that you do it so rarely since you have to be precise about it that you do not expect it. Most of the time when you suicide from PKfreeze it is while edgeguarding with Psimagnet.
I would request a buff to PK freeze but I know Lucas is already a very good character and Silven would flame me to no end
I still stand by my opinions of B-sticking though.
dear kupo, we are somewhat having an issue here.
this is not true. if you actually wanted something go into the official set, come to the IRC for once and talk about things, like even non-WBR members do. instead you put thing you want into your own set. if you wanted us to work together to get the best of both sets you know that this isn't the way.
Ok guys, I figured out exactly how to b-stick PKfreeze. If you hit 45% down on the c-stick softly you do PKFreeze. But you have to hit EXACTLY in the same spot. I guess I withdraw my change request(even though I would still be happy if it was added) as because of this it IS based in technical skill. The only problem I have is that you do it so rarely since you have to be precise about it that you do not expect it. Most of the time when you suicide from PKfreeze it is while edgeguarding with Psimagnet.
I would request a buff to PK freeze but I know Lucas is already a very good character and ANYONE WITH HALF A MIND would HEAVILY DISAGREE WITH me to no end
I still stand by my opinions of B-sticking though.
B-sticking makes you jump sometimes too, even when you aren't RARing
Yeah when I dash and C-stick in the opposite direction I get a jump everytime.
Weee!!
What?! Elaborate please.
You have tap jump off? If so, that was a glitch in vBrawl too. It may get fixed sometime in the future, IDK. It's just a Brawl quirk atm, turn tap jump on I guess.
Tap jump off is really beneficial for him though. When recovering, you can choose to save his midair jump for after you use extreme speed, which is pretty hard or impossible with tap jump.
Haha yeah, I couldnt give TL a good young link-esque downsmash cuz of sakurai making it a stupid unmodifiable set knockback. At least I fixed the old one though.
-Fox utilt hitbox 1 Previous - 10 damage, 110 growth, 22 base, 110 angle, New - 7 damage, 135 growth, 47 base, 84 angle
-Fox utilt hitbox 2 Previous - 8 damage, 110 growth, 18 base, 84 angle, New - 7 damage, 135 growth, 47 base, 84 angle
-Fox utilt hitbox 3 Previous - 8 damage, 110 growth, 18 base, 80 angle, New - 7 damage, 137 growth, 47 base, 80 angleActually I do have tap jump off. I didn't know this happened in vbrawl too but thats probably cause I almost never play as lucario.
Unfortunately, until there is a code for it. He's just going to have to grin and bare it. :/
Pretty much nailed it on the head. Damage is intertwined with knockback growth and slightly with the base knockback. So generally if we nerf a moves damage, but want it to behave identically with how it did before, we boost up its KBG and add a little base and it acts identically to before.
I thought I have debated about it before and no bite. I tried to explain that higher dgrav, increased run speeds will in turn produce a lower needed hitstun which will help out the games flow, pace, and be better for the game but no one wanted it for whatever reason. In fact, there is a lot of things I debated over and felt that my side had better arguments but it was decided not to be incorporated unless it was dumbed down. I am of course talking about no air dodging during tumble and fast fall during tumble. Maybe I will make a thread to discuss this but I doubt that universal gravity will be in seeing how I have had several debates but people don't want it just because. At least, that was the impression I got.
See, the problem is this. I really dissect this game with a fine toothed comb and most of my scrutinizing is deemed "unnecessary" or "things are fine" even with a good argument. Yes things are "fine" but I want better but it seems like I am the only one who thinks this way. This is what I mean by me feeling as though my words are not enough.
Seeing what I heard about BtL, I'm inclined to disagree.
Then why didn't you know what this thread was about and the point of my set in this thread?
I believe most if not all of whats in my set was at one point in time discussed in the WBR. You most likely were not here to see it.
I do suggest ideas to help the plussery thread as my primary action. Any ideas rejected is what goes into my set.
Yes I am quite aware. But then why was this thread even made with me allowed to have my set on post 2? You are unhappy for me to have a set that was "allowed?" It seems to me as though the true intention behind this thread was to pounce on those who actually did what the idea of the thread is supposed to do which really makes no sense to me.
Yea. This should indicate that a lot of things at the base level I support of what the plussery is doing but there is more I think could be done with the set in which I have debated without luck.
I wasn't aware until recently how much discussion goes on in there over the broom which is the place I solely look for furthering development.
I only put things in my set once they are rejected by the broom.
From the looks of it, it is based on what the majority wants over the project's needs. I felt that the Pro NADT did a great job with showing you why its needed but the "wants" of the majority is why it wasn't put in. The same thing goes with universal dgrav. I think I showed why universal is better and you have been experiencing the problems first hand with CGs on falcon in which the proposed solution is to make a new code or do some workaround to fix it leaving the core problem unaddressed based on wants?
The main differences that my set focuses on are the pace of play and movement and also game mechanics that the plussery leaves out. Those are the most important things I want the plussery to include because as you can see, our frame and hitbox changes aren't too different from one another.
So I am allowed this set to be public as is but people are upset with the fact I took up the offer? Wasn't Alopex also supposed to have one below me?
IIRC, the whole purpose of this thread was to exchange ideas and I may be isolated because it appears that no one is willing to even look this way. So what am I supposed to do? On the surface, my set's values seems to be quite radical but once adjusted, there really isn't anything bad. It has a nice flow and pace. Why wouldn't you want this?
A fine tooth comb doesn't do too much to a video game disk :-(
What did you hear about falcon at BtL? I don't remember hearing that he was a bad character, and I was there! Also, AndyG and I did some pimp falcon playing.
No, you act almost solely on your own. For a while you participated occasionally (i.e. like 2 months ago), nowadays, zilch.
See above.
Because Almas has quite a softspot for you. After all, why do you think our BtL team name was Almas Loves Trouser Snakes? He's waiting on you to invite him to dinner. Show some gratitude!
I think the only majority decision we followed is the falco shine. Given that you also shamelessly use our hitbox and framespeed codes, I think your "majority" conspiracy theory is a bit hilarious.
Your welcome. I'm glad the fruits of our labor go towards your attempts to split up the B+ community. Seriously, you aren't helping at all. It's your set, you aren't advocating anything to anyone besides your own agenda like a broken record. For example, changes to lag after zairs (toon link & link mains really must love you for that one) and more are clearly unnecessary and far from required. Personal preference must be abandoned and the community voice cannot be ignored.
Alopex is the man. However, I bribed him with a hot date over some poutine and he decided against it. (Actually I think we have almost all the changes he wanted in here anyway, I think he just has a few more frame speed changes)
Not liking it is a pretty big reason for a lot of people. I played it and hated it. It attempts to play as a melee engine but comes short in all regards. Some aspects just don't translate, and high gravity just doesn't fly well in brawl.
I'm fine with it too. Its hard to keep up with the entirety of the forums haha, especially when about to graduate.
ah ok completely understandable.