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Q&A -Fox Advice/Questions Topic-

voorhese

voorhese

Smash Master
Joined
Dec 22, 2007
Messages
3,389
Location
Decatur, IN
i just started practicing tech, and found something kool out, grab fox vs fox on DL, get under a platform with him at 0% upthrow him up at the platform, as he lands you should be hitting him with the up air, then do a ff up air while hes in the air, and fall through the platform, after you fall through, jump again and nair, if the nair connects you land on the platform instantly (kinda like falling through it with falcos bair)

i guess theres a specific timing, i did it 2 times in a row b4 i posted, but i cant replicate it now =/

i think you have to connect right as you are coming through
 
R

ruhtraeel

Smash Ace
Joined
May 30, 2010
Messages
707
Location
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Diakonos said:
Click to expand...
Us Canadians are so awesome.


And that video I posted, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScYElXWKY-k
3:00-3:34 = Chilean edgeguarding at it's finest.

3:00 Dark jump off b-air edgeguard
3:02 Zant attempt to grab firefox edgeguard
3:04 Zant phantom u-air edgeguard
3:08 Dark ledge hop single laser in the wrong direction edgeguard
3:10 Zant standard shine edgeguard
3:16 Dark getting hit by side-B recovery edgeguard
3:18 Zant ledge hop suicide soft b-air edgeguard
3:19 Dark up-B recovery edgeguard
3:21 Dark getting hit by recovery up-B edgeguard
3:22 Zant SH suicide offstage attempt to drill kick a firefox edgeguard
3:23 Dark below stage hopethatZantdoesn'ttech b-air edgeguard
3:26 Zant nice reflexes shine edgeguard
3:27 Zant offstage save Dark to extend tech skill time soft b-air edgeguard
3:29 Zant + Dark hope to outprioritize each others' firefox recovery edgeguard
3:31 Zant smart shine edgeguard

Zant wins
 
FoxLisk

FoxLisk

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 18, 2007
Messages
1,851
ruhtraeel said:
Us Canadians are so awesome.


And that video I posted, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScYElXWKY-k
3:00-3:34 = Chilean edgeguarding at it's finest.

3:00 Dark jump off b-air edgeguard
3:02 Zant attempt to grab firefox edgeguard
3:04 Zant phantom u-air edgeguard
3:08 Dark ledge hop single laser in the wrong direction edgeguard
3:10 Zant standard shine edgeguard
3:16 Dark getting hit by side-B recovery edgeguard
3:18 Zant ledge hop suicide soft b-air edgeguard
3:19 Dark up-B recovery edgeguard
3:21 Dark getting hit by recovery up-B edgeguard
3:22 Zant SH suicide offstage attempt to drill kick a firefox edgeguard
3:23 Dark below stage hopethatZantdoesn'ttech b-air edgeguard
3:26 Zant nice reflexes shine edgeguard
3:27 Zant offstage save Dark to extend tech skill time soft b-air edgeguard
3:29 Zant + Dark hope to outprioritize each others' firefox recovery edgeguard
3:31 Zant smart shine edgeguard

Zant wins
Click to expand...
this post rules
 
Mr Wizzrobe

Mr Wizzrobe

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 3, 2011
Messages
438
Location
Moncton, New Brunswick
Fried Ice Cream said:
I saw them shield like 6 times per match :|...

And do a lot of predictable stuff, despite being fast.
Click to expand...
Despite the fact that this is a friendly and they're obviously not playing seriously at all. Based on how they were playing it merely looked like they were trying to pull of the craziest **** ever. Shielding would kind of defeat the purpose.
 
JPOBS

JPOBS

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 26, 2007
Messages
5,821
Location
Mos Eisley
i don't get people who get all riled up over the chilean vids. They are obviously just trying to pull the most ridic combos and shenanigans and not at all giving a **** about winning/losing/reading/whatever.

I prefer to revel in the ridiculousness.
 
JPOBS

JPOBS

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 26, 2007
Messages
5,821
Location
Mos Eisley
i don't really see SW sd'ing much at all from the matches i've seen?

But I was thinking the other day, there isn't really a "best fox." There are a ton of really really great foxes all around the same level and all of them have their own strengths and weaknesses.

I guess people will say jman but I don't think he's much ahead of other ppl, if at all
 
Sinji

Sinji

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 27, 2010
Messages
3,370
Location
Brooklyn New York
NNID
Sinjis
3DS FC
0361-6602-9839
sup fox boards. It's been a while.

loving the falco match up.


Buffered rolls and sidesteps, shine oos, and usmash oos are Fox's only options to beat space animal shield pressure. Buffered anything is great, as long as you perform it after your opponent's shine hits your shield. If you block a dair/nair and try to do anything afterwards, you lose.The most rewarding option would be usmash oos and the easiest to perform, buffer roll. Shine oos is that rare combination of both highly effective and not technically demanding. Learn it, love it.


SHINE OOS:

Even the best foxes have trouble doing shine oos (grounded) consistently. There are a few things you can do to sidestep this technical barrier, and continue chasing your opponent after the knockdown to resume pressure. If there are platforms directly above you, waveland in the direction you knocked your opponent and give chase. This is MUCH easier than trying to waveshine oos(hield) on a punish.

Sometimes platforms aren't always available for you to use though, so if you're on flatland you'll have to settle for SH shine oos -> DJ -> fastfall -> chase.

But be careful! If Marth blocks the shine, for example, he can SH fair out of shield and clip your DJ on the way down. Whenever you are unsure about whether the shine will hit or not, DJ backwards out of your shine to avoid retaliation. Again, if platforms are nearby use them to your advantage! The shine oos is less about getting a hit and more about getting you out of really bad situations. If Falco's shine hits during shield pressure, you are taking 50-60% damage off either good or bad combos. That's just how Falco works.

If you manage to shine oos and escape the pressure, don't ALWAYS dive back into the fray immediately. Use that space you've created to distance yourself from the 1 frame combo starter and formulate a plan of attack. This goes for all match-ups IMO. The breathing room really helps stabilize the match, and hands you back a few seconds of control. We all know how vital control is, especially against Falco.

Oh, and shine oos is great near the edge. It punishes everything and knocks your opponent off. **** grab lol.

Originated from RaynEX.
 
EWC

EWC

Smash Ace
Joined
Feb 25, 2008
Messages
651
Location
norcal
After seeing some of his recent stuff I'm almost inclined to say that Chillin is the best fox right now; He has that old school mental game on top of some fairly up-to-date tech skill and metagame knowledge, and is just so creative with his stuff.
 
JPOBS

JPOBS

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 26, 2007
Messages
5,821
Location
Mos Eisley
Sinji droppin dat knowledge? word. WD oos vs falco pressure is where its at tho.

I haven't seen chillin's new vids so i cant comment.
 
ShroudedOne

ShroudedOne

Smash Hero
Premium
Joined
Mar 14, 2011
Messages
5,493
PC is looking really fresh right now. I'm more hyped for his fox than Mango's, but Mango's is probably better. Jman hasn't been practicing, apparently, and got pwned by Chris, so perhaps we're seeing the title of "best Fox" slipping away from him?

My favorites are still Lucky and M2K, though.
 
PK Webb

PK Webb

Smash Champion
Joined
Dec 24, 2007
Messages
2,753
Location
the lab
ShroudedOne said:
PC is looking really fresh right now. I'm more hyped for his fox than Mango's, but Mango's is probably better. Jman hasn't been practicing, apparently, and got pwned by Chris, so perhaps we're seeing the title of "best Fox" slipping away from him?

My favorites are still Lucky and M2K, though.
Click to expand...
i was at that tourney and i play with pc alot......pc believes jman is a LITTLE bit better but not by much. Jman and pc kinda drank a little bit before there matches and maybe smoked a lil. it took a bigger toll on jman than pc since jman is mad small lol. but yea pc is beast and so is jman
 
R

ruhtraeel

Smash Ace
Joined
May 30, 2010
Messages
707
Location
Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Wow I've missed a lot apparently

I thought it was obviously just between Jman and Mango

I thought PC Chris was washed up

I thought Lucky sometimes got off but other times wasn't as consistent

I thought SW didn't really ever place that well

I thought Lovage was also just tech skill until I saw him a bunch of times in regional finals

Been watching too many Dark vids
 
RaynEX

RaynEX

Colonel RTSD
Joined
Aug 14, 2005
Messages
6,454
Location
Corneria, Lylat System
Sinji said:
sup fox boards. It's been a while.

loving the falco match up.


Buffered rolls and sidesteps, shine oos, and usmash oos are Fox's only options to beat space animal shield pressure. Buffered anything is great, as long as you perform it after your opponent's shine hits your shield. If you block a dair/nair and try to do anything afterwards, you lose.The most rewarding option would be usmash oos and the easiest to perform, buffer roll. Shine oos is that rare combination of both highly effective and not technically demanding. Learn it, love it.


SHINE OOS:

Even the best foxes have trouble doing shine oos (grounded) consistently. There are a few things you can do to sidestep this technical barrier, and continue chasing your opponent after the knockdown to resume pressure. If there are platforms directly above you, waveland in the direction you knocked your opponent and give chase. This is MUCH easier than trying to waveshine oos(hield) on a punish.

Sometimes platforms aren't always available for you to use though, so if you're on flatland you'll have to settle for SH shine oos -> DJ -> fastfall -> chase.

But be careful! If Marth blocks the shine, for example, he can SH fair out of shield and clip your DJ on the way down. Whenever you are unsure about whether the shine will hit or not, DJ backwards out of your shine to avoid retaliation. Again, if platforms are nearby use them to your advantage! The shine oos is less about getting a hit and more about getting you out of really bad situations. If Falco's shine hits during shield pressure, you are taking 50-60% damage off either good or bad combos. That's just how Falco works.

If you manage to shine oos and escape the pressure, don't ALWAYS dive back into the fray immediately. Use that space you've created to distance yourself from the 1 frame combo starter and formulate a plan of attack. This goes for all match-ups IMO. The breathing room really helps stabilize the match, and hands you back a few seconds of control. We all know how vital control is, especially against Falco.

Oh, and shine oos is great near the edge. It punishes everything and knocks your opponent off. **** grab lol.
Click to expand...
What the ****? That's advice I wrote for the boards, word for word...lol

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=12443242

edit: Whats up guys! I'm playing again, so you'll be seeing alot more of me. I plan on doing a little Fox boards clean-up in the following weeks. We're one of the most active character spefs, but I think it could be more organized. We should toss around ideas so we can collectively figure out how to make this board the ultimate resource for learning and playing Fox.
 
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