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Ganondorf Board's Question & Answer Thread.
- Thread starter Ray_Kalm
- Start date
:034:
Smash Hero
If you're going to do that, give us ALL of Ganon's framerate data. That's right, every single piece of it, how much lag it has, when the attack comes out and when it ends, if there IASA frames, landing lag and if it has possible IASA frames (nair, mostly)... Test EVERYTHING while you're at it.I have three closely related questions.
1) I recently hacked my Wii for Brawl+, which is pretty disappointing. The point is, I found a hack that slows the game speed however you want. I know that one-twentieth is possible, and I'm pretty sure one-sixtieth is possible (one frame per second). Will using this and a stopwatch yield accurate frame data?
2) Would anyone be interested in seeing the frame data and range of every getup attack? It would be useful for following the Choke. Even if the frame data idea isn't good, I could still test range. The point is, I don't want to spend hours compiling this data if nobody will care.
3) Is there anything else you really want frame data for? If my method works, I'll certainly go through the whole moveset, but what else do you want?
EDIT: Actually, I think a better code is currently in the works which will allow me to get precise frame data, so the method mentioned in #1 may be unnecessary.
ALL OF IT.
Edit: If you do it, I will crown you sir Twilight, Knight of the Order of Murder.
TP
Smash Master
I have found yet another way for me to record frame data, which I will start doing tonight (probably). I'm going to start with the moveset, and I mean the whole thing. Facing up getup attack, facing down getup attack (both kicks), ledge getup attack, >100% ledge getup attack, tripping getup attack (both kicks), Quake, iDA and regular DA, how many frames the Utilt wind needs to start, and of course the regular moveset. Are there any other subtle moves I may forget?
Ray_Kalm
Smash Master
Yeah find out which one of these two aerials comes out faster, UAir and NAir. Along with the speed of tipman. I'm also curious about DSmash, if it's fast enough to attack OoS, as it's our fastest smash.
:034:
Smash Hero
Don't forget to check the differences between up and down angled forward smash.
TP
Smash Master
I'll check all that, but it will be hard to accurately test tipman. Anything that requires my opponent to be in the air will be hard to test, and I won't be sure if I hit with the very beginning of the tipman or not, but I'll try. I'm at work right now, though. 
:034:
Smash Hero
You can test Tipman on a large character on the ground, just do it backwards :D
TP
Smash Master
Things currently aren't looking great for this. One of my methods fell through entirely. Playing at 1/60 the normal speed looks awesome seems to yield imperfect data. My jab was one frame too fast and my Fsmash was one frame too slow. Are we 100% sure of the accuracy of the frame data in Swoops' guide? My final method, asking the hackers to make me a code, may work and may not. We will see.
SaltyKracka
Smash Lord
One frame off may either be human error, either yours or Swoop's. Still, it's not exactly a big deal.
:034:
Smash Hero
No, Swoops' data isn't fully correct, since he used a program that ran it at 30 frames per second, and he just multiplied it. Swoops' data would be the incorrect one, where yours would be the correct one.
They should be ABOUT the same, but don't worry if the frames are a bit different. Now, when you're going from 10 frames to 20 frames, you might wanna try again. XD
TP
Smash Master
It's going to be extremely hard for me to test aerials with this method, since you can't jump while in 1/60. When you leave the ground, you are still so close to it (because the game now has 60 times as many frames to work with) that you immediately land. Also, for some reason, our special moves no longer cover any distance. I may speed up to 1/20 and test there.
Dr. Hyde
Smash Ace
I didn't see this mentioned but if you are about to die and it's your last life going SD is pretty fair game for Ganon. I did some testing, sure others have too and probably posted it but I didn't see it so...
Here's the list of all the characters that can be Ganoncided and the result will be Sudden Death
Bowser
Peach
Yoshi
Zelda
Sheik
Ganondorf (the king of evil would be proud of it)
ZSS
Samus
Pit
Metaknight
Olimar
Captain Falcon
Ivysaur
Jigglypuff
Ike
Ness
Lucas
Game & Watch
Snake
Sonic
just in case anyone asked the question
"Who can Ganon bring to Sudden Death from Forward+B?"
or something similar
Here's the list of all the characters that can be Ganoncided and the result will be Sudden Death
Bowser
Peach
Yoshi
Zelda
Sheik
Ganondorf (the king of evil would be proud of it)
ZSS
Samus
Pit
Metaknight
Olimar
Captain Falcon
Ivysaur
Jigglypuff
Ike
Ness
Lucas
Game & Watch
Snake
Sonic
just in case anyone asked the question
"Who can Ganon bring to Sudden Death from Forward+B?"
or something similar
:034:
Smash Hero
Useless in tourney since if the game goes to Sudden Death, the player with the least damage percent will win.
:034:
Smash Hero
If you are hit to the left:
SDI right, DI up/right, and use either nair or uair to cancel your monumentum.
SDI right, DI up/right, and use either nair or uair to cancel your monumentum.
Well, all the info I got was off that japanese site or whatever and through my own testing, so it's pretty accurate.
Oh and Kalm, 5 options out of Gerudo with dash attack and all.
TP
Smash Master
I've pretty much given up on the frame data thing. It wasn't meant to be.
As a consolation for getting your hopes up as well as mine, I will find the range of every getup attack after a choke. I should have it in a few days.
Teronist09
Smash Journeyman
Is there some trick/way to tell how far down to be when doing a ledge drop > uair > up B and grabbing the ledge instead of landing? I keep doing that lately and getting pawned for it.
Ray_Kalm
Smash Master
That's actually quite simple to learn.
hyperstation
Smash Lord
yeah, that's effed up. I think Kalm, the OP of that thread, should challenge that decision. I read rule 7, the rule cited for the thread's closure, and I don't think it was a fair choice. I was gonna PM the mod who closed it, but it wasn't my thread, and I figure it'd be better if the OP made the challenge.
Rule 7: Topics concerning members of Smash World will be closed
Technically it did involve us ranking the Ganon players, which is why it was closed.
I thought it was also a bad desicion, as nobody's feelings got hurt, right? It was all in good fun.
I think that you should PM Buzz anyway, as Ray_Kalm probably got the 1 week suspension for violating the rule.
Technically it did involve us ranking the Ganon players, which is why it was closed.
I thought it was also a bad desicion, as nobody's feelings got hurt, right? It was all in good fun.
I think that you should PM Buzz anyway, as Ray_Kalm probably got the 1 week suspension for violating the rule.
qerkdtx
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2008
- Messages
- 292
I don't think he did get suspened. Maybe a point or two but not suspened
If all of these are true...
- Murder quake would be the most viable, as it's quick
- Utilt they would pull out of the shield and attack before you were finished
- Midair WP would only be possible with FOG>WP
Murder Quake is actually slower than d-tilt, and has the most horrible lag ever. D-tilt is probably your best shield stabber, and f-air can do the job for tops of shields. Dunno, Ganon doesn't really shield stab. He shield *****.
:034:
Smash Hero
Keep him up in the air. Snake is weak from below, use uair, usmash, the works, so long as you keep him in the air. If he uses Cypher to stretch for time, you can try use a FoG and star KO him...
Ray_Kalm
Smash Master
Who actually goes to tournaments here? Just wondering. I've heard a couple of you say so. Even if you do, do you use Ganon?
TP
Smash Master
I do not. I live in the Midwest of the US. There are approximately zero other people in this region of the country who play Brawl.
hyperstation
Smash Lord
Yes. I haven't been to one since one of BUM's Bronx weeklies in November, but MOM and I plan on checking out another one soon. I've never placed in the top 10 though. Competition is nasty in NYC: BUM, D1, NinjaLink, and mannnnny more.
If I'm still quarantined in PA at the end of this month, there's a $1500 tournament in Harrisburg that I plan on cleaning up. My boy Heavy and I are working on getting a gross team together by then too. If anyone knows any MK/Ganon teams stuff I should know about, hook me up.
Dr. Hyde
Smash Ace
I think if you are 2 v 1 you can have Ganon flame choke and meta d_tilt once the opponent hits the ground to force a auto stand up and repeat for the win.
I know Link can just jab wake up from flame choke so I was wondering if that applies for all characters that can jab lock.
I also was having trouble against a friend's Snake, DBS. He was bringing a Jab, cancel, Jab, Cancel, Jab, Cancel and F_tilt and it was ruining me. I also was having trouble getting close and pressing him. I just couldn't keep pressure on him.
How do we get close to Snake and avoid getting Tilted to death?
I know the answer may involve shielding but I just need to know.
PS I went to a Low Tier tournament and got 4th, losing just barely to a Ness. Fair is a ***** to deal with.
I know Link can just jab wake up from flame choke so I was wondering if that applies for all characters that can jab lock.
I also was having trouble against a friend's Snake, DBS. He was bringing a Jab, cancel, Jab, Cancel, Jab, Cancel and F_tilt and it was ruining me. I also was having trouble getting close and pressing him. I just couldn't keep pressure on him.
How do we get close to Snake and avoid getting Tilted to death?
I know the answer may involve shielding but I just need to know.
PS I went to a Low Tier tournament and got 4th, losing just barely to a Ness. Fair is a ***** to deal with.
TP
Smash Master
Currently, we try to survive vertical hits by fastfalling a Dair or Nair. Could we live to a higher percent by using airdodge or Uair, followed by a Wizkick?