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[CRASHiC]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=192600
Here you will find all of that information.

 

[Admiral Pit]

Thank you, I will use some of the info to help, but the reason y I ask this is because I want the discussion to be "Recent" if possible. Also, I don't see a "Pit Discussion" thread, or maybe I'm not searching. But regardless, I would prefer to hear some individual knowledgeable D3 inputs with the Pit experience.
Also, in the link u gave me, it seems like "Foursaken" has quite some info on Pit. Perhaps I can get a hold of him somehow if that's fine?

 

[Gates]

Foursaken actually kinda quit smash afaik.

 

[CRASHiC]

You aren't going to get any 'recent' info from Foursaken. He's too busy with life, and has essentially quite brawl for the most part. Because I'm not sure who the top pit players are or what areas they are located, so I'm not sure who you would like to speak to.

New England: Buu
New Jersey: Atomsk
Alantic South: Co18, Seibrik, Hungrybox
Texas: Fogo
Cali: Commander Beef, CPU
Michigan: Lain

 

[LoganW]

You aren't going to get any 'recent' info from Foursaken. He's too busy with life, and has essentially quite brawl for the most part. Because I'm not sure who the top pit players are or what areas they are located, so I'm not sure who you would like to speak to.

New England: Buu
New Jersey: Atomsk
Alantic South: Co18, Seibrik, Hungrybox
Texas: Fogo
Cali: Commander Beef, CPU
Michigan: Lain

didn't atmosk just quit d3?

 

[stingers]

atomsk might play with rogue pit a bit? i have no honest idea but they're really close so

random q: how often do you use fsmash in tournament? i find I hit with it more then I think I should but maybe its because people aren't trying because its not tournament or what >.>

like when they're on the ledge I get fsmashes a lot because people normally come up the same way. or like I can roll back and they'll try to approach and I'll fsmash. its actually pretty funny. or if they're offstage and coming back trying to hit me (usually mk or marth falls for this) i just use fsmash and they run into it @.@

also does down b have any practical uses? I've used ddd in tournament in 2 sets ever, but since I killed with Down B at like 80 in one of those sets, I might think its more useful then it really is

 

[Gates]

You can never really quit Dedede, you just take extended sabbaticals.

@ Stingers - I almost never land fsmash in tourney. There are more consistent ways to edgeguard with Dedede and if people in your area are falling for that then, well, they're probably not that good lol.

@ Adm. Pit - Where exactly do you want us to post our opinions of the matchups?

 

[stingers]

i mean, the fact its friendlies is half the reason i'm thinking, but in the OTHER tourney set (funny enough, both against marths, lol) i landed an fsmash to net me the win, last stock on yoshis...he jumped off the ledge right into it >.>

what about down b? @.@

 

[Gates]

downB is even rarer than fsmash. They're both really situational mindgames but they definitely have huge payoffs if you can land them.

 

[Admiral Pit]

@ Adm. Pit - Where exactly do you want us to post our opinions of the matchups?

You contact me via PM or AIM, and if u have AIM, I can send u the document of which I will be holding the Pit matchups, and well, um, write a detailed summary using some of the previous discussions above (The Bowser one is just about the best example, information-wise), and yea.

 

[Sky Pirate]

Curious, what is the general opinion of Japes in Dedede v. Falco?
I recently had two separate experiences, one where I fell into a CG into a klaptrap death TWICE and another where I actually avoided his grabs and controlled the center with great success (jv2-stock against the same Falco), so I'm kind of confused.

 

[CRASHiC]

Japes is instant win for Falco in any matchup O_O
Maybe if you get the lead though it might work better.

 

[Gates]

Japes is generally a bad stage for Dedede. It has a high ceiling which makes it harder to kill off the top and many characters can maneuver around the stage more easily than he can which makes it harder to land grabs. Dthrowing into a Klaptrap is nice but very situational.

Falco is a terrible matchup for Dedede. Letting a Falco take you to Japes, his best stage, is a horrible idea since it basically guarantees that you'll lose that match. If it's legal at your tourney, ban Japes every time against Falco. It's better to play Falco on FD than this stage.

Look at the matchup thread export for more info on Falco.

 

[rPSIvysaur]

The Lucas boards are starting a MU discussion on DDD right now, all your input is wellcome. Here is a

 

[Commander_Beef]

didn't atmosk just quit d3?

Yes but he definitely would not have lost all of his King Dedede knowledge right away. At least I would think he has as much knowledge as I think he does, considering that he's a good player.

Thank you, I will use some of the info to help, but the reason y I ask this is because I want the discussion to be "Recent" if possible. Also, I don't see a "Pit Discussion" thread, or maybe I'm not searching. But regardless, I would prefer to hear some individual knowledgeable D3 inputs with the Pit experience.
Also, in the link u gave me, it seems like "Foursaken" has quite some info on Pit. Perhaps I can get a hold of him somehow if that's fine?

My screenname is CommanderBeef65 if you want me to discuss my thoughts about Pit. But I currently don't have internet at my own house right now, so I won't really get to you right away. It's better if you send me a private message with what you wish Admiral. But it's alrught if you want to talk to the others that were mentioned by Crashic, no prob.

random q: how often do you use fsmash in tournament? i find I hit with it more then I think I should but maybe its because people aren't trying because its not tournament or what >.>

like when they're on the ledge I get fsmashes a lot because people normally come up the same way. or like I can roll back and they'll try to approach and I'll fsmash. its actually pretty funny. or if they're offstage and coming back trying to hit me (usually mk or marth falls for this) i just use fsmash and they run into it @.@

also does down b have any practical uses? I've used ddd in tournament in 2 sets ever, but since I killed with Down B at like 80 in one of those sets, I might think its more useful then it really is

For your first concern...use forward smash in tournament in between the rare and middle range. Not too middle and not too rare. It's very large hitbox can cover almost anything incoming, only if you space it favorably. Never use it when they're close to you, always space it. This is how I view the move and my use frequencey of it. Like Gates said, the move is a mindgame...you can never treat the move as you would his back air. And whenever you succesfully land it...your opponent was just stupid to get caught in it, and therefore it's a mindgame.

Jet Hammer is all the same as forward smash, but it has so many more drawbacks. Never use the move.
A mindgame only...

@ Stingers - I almost never land fsmash in tourney. There are more consistent ways to edgeguard with Dedede and if people in your area are falling for that then, well, they're probably not that good lol.

Think again Gates. I have no video proof, but I'll admit that I landed a forward smash on DEHF to end our set. It's really how I beat him...when I announced it in the social thread.
It's all mindgames...of course.

Gates clearly covered the question regarding Jungle Japes.

 

[AtotheZ]

Japes is not bad for Dedede.... Its defititely not a map I would counterpick but he lives forever there and I do fine when people take me there. I don't see what the problem is.

 

[Commander_Beef]

Japes is not bad for Dedede.... Its defititely not a map I would counterpick but he lives forever there and I do fine when people take me there. I don't see what the problem is.

Well....to restate what the problem is on there...Gates exclaimed that the ceiling is the highest out of any other stage, so our up tilt/down smash won't kill until later in somebody's stock, and it may be hard to kill somebody off the sides because of the weird stage layout...we can be lucky enough to land our forward air for the kill. And our weakness of us being slow combined with the slowest aerial movement in the game, we can be outcamped too easily by those who camp us in the middle. It's hard for us to settle there. Another small flaw is the lack of space to support our grab game, in general.

 

[stingers]

aight...i won an mk-banned tourney yesterday, used all ddd in gfs...except for one match anyway

so you wont see any vids of me against a meta but i want what i have looked at...so you guys can tell me if im on the right track

he's a pretty simple character but just making sure I'm doing it right you know?

 

[Commander_Beef]

aight...i won an mk-banned tourney yesterday, used all ddd in gfs...except for one match anyway

so you wont see any vids of me against a meta but i want what i have looked at...so you guys can tell me if im on the right track

he's a pretty simple character but just making sure I'm doing it right you know?

Sounds good. Unless if it's a critique, post in the social thread Stingies.

 

[AtotheZ]

Well....to restate what the problem is on there...Gates exclaimed that the ceiling is the highest out of any other stage, so our up tilt/down smash won't kill until later in somebody's stock, and it may be hard to kill somebody off the sides because of the weird stage layout...we can be lucky enough to land our forward air for the kill. And our weakness of us being slow combined with the slowest aerial movement in the game, we can be outcamped too easily by those who camp us in the middle. It's hard for us to settle there. Another small flaw is the lack of space to support our grab game, in general.

Those things are true, I know its one of dedede's worst stages but he does fine there and can pull off some shenanigans. If a character tries to camp on one of the sides, we basically pressure him to death with bairs and can easily throw him in the water. Also you can watch the time occasionally for the klap trap, it comes at repeated times each minute... You can use that to try to time a throw into it from a chaingrab. We also live forever and ever there.

 

[OBT]

hey i have a video that i would like some critique on.

i can post it when i get home from school today (my school didnt block smashboards )

 

[Sensei Seibrik]

no schools do, it's great. it's literally too underground to be blocked.

 

[OBT]

lol, isnt it great?

btw here's my video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gZWO3uK2K4

and i know i missed a lot of opportunities to gimp falco, but i still got that sweet kill at the beginning

i also figured out in that game that i need to use all my jumps before my up-b, and to try not to always land on the stage when doing it

 

[CRASHiC]

My school did And so I used Smashbrawl.com instead, and then I got suspended from computers until graduation.
Heavy Garbage, your match confused me.
Don't go for the grab so much. Instead, approach, then counter their advancment on you with Down air.
Down smash is good but don't do silly moments like at 1:08. When they are that close, uptilt. Uptilt is your best kill move.
When he spams rolls, then you can go for a grab or downsmash.

 

[OBT]

ok, thanks CRASHiC :D i'll keep that in mind, and i know that the uptilt is a very handy move

i know i have a lot to work on, so thats what im doing

 

[CRASHiC]

It wasn't you that confused me, it was your Falco that you were fighting :/ I've never seen a Falco kill itself like that before.

 

[Jupz]

My school doesn't block it :D

Hardly get a time to use it anymore.

Also yeah nice work, against Falco you mainly wanna be spacing with Ftilt and Dtilt and punish moves with grabs. If he runs at you spotdodge because hes likely gonna Usmash.

 

[o-Serin-o]

My school blocked EVERYTHING! EVEN SWF!

._. They even blocked all the proxies as well...

 

[AtotheZ]

My school blocked EVERYTHING! EVEN SWF!

._. They even blocked all the proxies as well...

Find more proxies before its too late. Also try changing the homepage to said website you want, that can work.

They started blocking things for me 4 years ago, and now they got just about everything.

 

[OBT]

my school is mainly blocking games, proxies, and chatrooms like forumotion and stuff... friggin school

and about ddd, i gotta use my tilts more often than i do currently im not saying spam, just use them more, i heard that DDD's ftilt is the longest reaching melee attack in brawl, that true?

 

[Commander_Beef]

lol, isnt it great?

btw here's my video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gZWO3uK2K4

and i know i missed a lot of opportunities to gimp falco, but i still got that sweet kill at the beginning

i also figured out in that game that i need to use all my jumps before my up-b, and to try not to always land on the stage when doing it

You made your first mistake in the dead beginning of the match. Do not do your sideB while somebody is approaching you.... Even if it hits him, you can still be punished because of the horrible lag of the move.
And in general, while your opponent is at percents from 0-40, don't pummel. That Falco wasn't smart but at low percents like that, they can break out before you do a throw much easier. Do a back throw or tech chase down throws [if you're good at it] until they're at higher percents. You need to utilize more of your moveset like others were saying [except downB]. Don't always go for the grab...rather mix up your options. Each move has its own special properties. And do less dodge-rolling/spotdodging, and more jumping in the air to evade what Falco does. There wasn't much to point out that you did well to be honest, and try to get a longer match or more matches so I can give a better description of what more you need to work on too.

 

[OBT]

You made your first mistake in the dead beginning of the match. Do not do your sideB while somebody is approaching you.... Even if it hits him, you can still be punished because of the horrible lag of the move.
And in general, while your opponent is at percents from 0-40, don't pummel. That Falco wasn't smart but at low percents like that, they can break out before you do a throw much easier. Do a back throw or tech chase down throws [if you're good at it] until they're at higher percents. You need to utilize more of your moveset like others were saying [except downB]. Don't always go for the grab...rather mix up your options. Each move has its own special properties. And do less dodge-rolling/spotdodging, and more jumping in the air to evade what Falco does. There wasn't much to point out that you did well to be honest, and try to get a longer match or more matches so I can give a better description of what more you need to work on too.

thanks for the details :D i'll work on that

btw, since you asked for a longer game, here's one

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dYW_TGbC_Jg

i know i have to have made mistakes here, like how i tried inhale from 0:33-0:36 and got punished for it, and i'll always be willing to work on what you tell me, because you sound like you really know your stuff

 

[Commander_Beef]

thanks for the details :D i'll work on that

btw, since you asked for a longer game, here's one

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dYW_TGbC_Jg

i know i have to have made mistakes here, like how i tried inhale from 0:33-0:36 and got punished for it, and i'll always be willing to work on what you tell me, because you sound like you really know your stuff

Oh okay thanks. Wow three forward smashes on first stock lol, that Pit is vulnerable to mindgames!

Watch where your waddle dees/doos are...because as you could tell, a waddle doo was on the right platform and it interrupted your aerial. If you watch where they are, never do a move that involves "A" or an airdodge while your near them, unless if you intend to pick-up throw one with less lag.
And you had good DI with forward air on your first stock. One way to make your DI better is to momentum cancel more of your trajectory by holding down the control stick while doing forward air when you receive that horizontal knockback. You can survive at higher percentages if you go by that explanation.
At aroun 1:40 of the video, Pit was in center of the stage and you decided to upB trying to do the doby slam on him...The Pit was smart there to shield because every player will do that. Especially if your opponent is in the center of stage, always just puff to the ledge, don't bother trying to hit him with your approaching upB.
You were doing Inhale..now that's a start. Using inhale to best as it gets is to shorthop it after approaching. It seems more lagless because you're coming down on your opponent, and it's hard for them to notice the shorthop inhale, so do it that way more rather than just standing inhale. Never forget to try to swallowcide when there's an opportunity too.
I will now add on to the do's and don'ts of our laggy sideB. Additionally to never doing it when your opponent is approaching you, never do sideB when that close in range. You have many better options, and it seemed like a habitual thing, so notice when you do that and correct it.
And you really do forward smash too much. Limit your use in it and use it slightly more in doubles or free-for-all matches. It's too predictable and laggy, but don't remove it from your game, just use it a lot less.
Just to let you know if you haven't looked at Page 1 of this thread yet, I run this thread lol. If you're amazed by my advice [which you should be], there's plenty more of critiques and answered questions on Page 1.
I'm not trying to flatter myself here at all, just telling the truth and facts. I also recommend to search on youtube for players such as CO18, Seibrik, Atomsk, Lain. Even myself too http://www.youtube.com/user/CommanderBeef101#p/a, and try to replicate what we do into your game and you'll become better with King Dedede.

 

[OBT]

here's another one

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6F02bcRW74I

also, that pit player wasnt doing his best that day, i guess he was just off his game

because last night, when i fought him with ZSS, he was at over 250% when he lost his first stock -.- but that doesnt matter (i just wanted to try ZSS :<)

but after, i played with another friend, unfortunately, i wasnt able to get a replay for 2 reasone

1. over 3 mins
2. i lost my SD with infinite replay time on it :<

so, yeah, story of my life...

also, thanks for giving me a link to ur YT channel :D i appreciate it

 

[Commander_Beef]

Your welcome.
I tell this in almost every critique because it's true and people need to work on it. It was quite noticeable that you thre a waddle dee every time after you did a throw without even thinking. Forward smash has diagonal knockback and throwing a waddle dee instead of pressuring your opponent more after the throw is not smart. What I'm saying is...undo those habits and realize what you're doing throughout every moment of the match.
And you know that King Dedede has a chaingrab right? lol
Pretty much the same mistakes as the other videos, but I understand since they were uploaded near the same time period. So get another video uploaded with your improved King Dedede [of course you should practice doing whatever means].

 

[OBT]

ok, thanks commander beef :D

and yes, i am aware that DDD has a chaingrab lol

also, i am watching your vids and vids of atomsk and ppl

 

[Pr0phetic]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bclsPf1IAuM&feature=related Critique please!

Hey guys =]

 

[Zip.]

Hey! =]
- moar b air
- dont ever use u smash(imo anyways)
- work on the timing on your cg(i swear i saw you get up b'd like 100 times lol)
- work on killing(mario lived till like 200% two stocks from what i saw)

other than that from what i saw, nice job =]
(im sure everyone else here are alot better at critiquing then i)

 

[Pr0phetic]

It's ok, multiple viewpoints bring out the most obvious problems =]

I'm still you guys' DL, so my D3 can't be terrible now can it?

 

[Commander_Beef]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bclsPf1IAuM&feature=related Critique please!

Hey guys =]

Please don't worry about competition in critiquing...that's of less importance Zip. The more information and viewpoints the better.

The times where Mario interrupted your chaingrab were when you did it on that bump/incline in the middle of stage. It's clear that Mario has an open frame where he can upB you only there. So the best solution is to shieldgrab during every regrab. You won't get punished even if your timing of the shieldgrab messes up if you have the correct spacing of it.
And to corect Zip on some things, Rukkiko actually had the intention of killing Mario with down smash and up tilt during a stock, but it was just the Mario knowing the matchup, so good for him. And I'd say that he used back air sparingly and when he only needed to, instead of it being predictable for Mario, I could see that Hippy was a good player for that.
Not much else to say for critique, you played decent enough to where there weren't that many flaws. Keep it up and just keep working on your matchups!

Alrught then... I need somebody to give me some tips on what else can work for this team in general, myself and this Wario. Mainly think of what combos or just anything that sparks your mind for this team. Sorry for the cameraman in rounds 2 & 3, he failed a little bit, but the video position will get better.

Round 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMDrTRDOvJg
Round 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RExrkE5iN50
Round 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrZLvfaar3o