Got a question? We've got answers! Check out the OP for FAQs!

[CRASHiC]

My bad, I thought this was the social thread. >_>

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=229337

Here you go.
Go ahead an introduce yourself.
We don't bite.

 

[tehflash]

Thanks for advice on the teams match guys. Very helpful! I have another question that I couldn't find the answer to:

I play a GaW that likes to dAir ... a lot. I always end up either getting a key in the head or getting pushed by the knock back. I've tried using uAir against it, but that only works 50% of the time. Any advice?

 

[o-Serin-o]

Pivot grab it. Otherwise bait it and punish it with Bair when he comes down towards you.

/waits for Beefy's output

 

[Commander_Beef]

Pivot grab it. Otherwise bait it and punish it with Bair when he comes down towards you.

/waits for Beefy's output

You're funny Serin lol.

Thanks for advice on the teams match guys. Very helpful! I have another question that I couldn't find the answer to:

I play a GaW that likes to dAir ... a lot. I always end up either getting a key in the head or getting pushed by the knock back. I've tried using uAir against it, but that only works 50% of the time. Any advice?

You are very welcome. I actually didn't think you'd come back here and respond, and thank you for saying it was helpful.

So when we're dealing with somebody that uses a move excessively...wouldn't you think it would be best to watch for it or to predict it in some way? I believe so....and yet, it's so easy to avoid repetitive moves if you're actually thinking about what's happening or what's going to happen. You should try to get use to predicting what your opponent does or just simply watch what they do for a second, and then react to punish ongoing moves.

I'm actually surprised that up air is only working 50% of the time for you. It should work more times than not. But I think you're not using it correctly. The up air will beat his down air every time if you properly space it (meaning doing a move beforehand while ensuring you won't get hit either). So if we see that down air coming, or you can predict it well, then that's when you do your up air immediately before he does his down air. That is usually the best way to handle Mr. Game & watch's down air.
If we're on the ground and you see it coming, it's best to simply shield it, because we can grab him right after. (Pivot grab is not as necessary for this Serin, it's more risky and shielding it is safer.) Airdodge if you're already in the air if you want also. It's all about the correct timing from which you predict it. Watch for the extra 6% hit when the key hits the ground too.

 

[Technodeath]

you know too much o_o

 

[tehflash]

Cool, thanks Commander! I guess I was trying to get my throw in too fast, the second part of that key stays out for longer than I thought. I worked it out tonight and I just have to wait a little bit longer. He also gives me trouble with his upB parachute when I'm above him. I can never seem to pull out the dAir fast enough. Should I go bAir when I'm above, or will fAir or nAir be my saviors? He can do an upB into my upB too, but that's really a spacing and mindgames problem isn't it?

 

[Commander_Beef]

Cool, thanks Commander! I guess I was trying to get my throw in too fast, the second part of that key stays out for longer than I thought. I worked it out tonight and I just have to wait a little bit longer. He also gives me trouble with his upB parachute when I'm above him. I can never seem to pull out the dAir fast enough. Should I go bAir when I'm above, or will fAir or nAir be my saviors? He can do an upB into my upB too, but that's really a spacing and mindgames problem isn't it?

Yeah just watch for the second part. It's all about patience . And yes I sometimes the upB surprises me too, I don't blame you. But you'll see it coming eventually and you'll get the down air on him eventually! That's your only savior, no other aerial is better for this situation.
And no.. with your butt coming down.. his upB will clash with yours. UpB's like this isn't a spacing or mindgame problem .

 

[tehflash]

And yes I sometimes the upB surprises me too, I don't blame you.

Well this makes me feel about 10 times better, but no more confident. Thanks for the advice though! Any other pro tips on the GaW match-up besides the stuff in the match-up thread (I really want to beat this guy in an upcomming tournament)?

 

[Commander_Beef]

Well this makes me feel about 10 times better, but no more confident. Thanks for the advice though! Any other pro tips on the GaW match-up besides the stuff in the match-up thread (I really want to beat this guy in an upcomming tournament)?

Yeah man no worries. We all make mistakes, but it's just you have to work on making less mistakes like falling for predictable characters like Mr. Game & Watch.
My personal advice disregarding the matchup thread information is as follows:
1.) If you ever see him doing his usual back-air spacing...just know that our back air will beat it if we back air him while he's doing his. We will take the 3% and he'll take our whole back air.
2.) All of Mr. Game & Watch's smashes are ridiculously powerful, but are also predictable at the same time. If you're over 100%, expect at least a forward smash from him (the torch). So you must do what it takes to avoid it when you already know it's coming. It's all about knowing what he'll do at the right time.
3.) Tech chasing him with down throw is very effective if you're good at it. I suggest practicing that. If you time a down smash after you tech chased, you can kill him immensely early. (Known as the Buuman Trap. It's in the Gran United Royal Guide.)
4.) Never try to edgeguard him while below the stage because his upB will beat you everytime, as possibly stagespike you. You can edgeguard him anywhere else and you'll be fine.
5.) Up tilt kills him near 90%, so try to set it up nicely and don't fall for an airdodge or spotdodge when you know it's coming.

That's about all for my advice on the matchup, good luck!

 

[MidnightAsaph]

Hi, how are ya guys?

I'm a Wolf mainer, but I do some DDD as another main. Point in case, I know the MU between them both, and I'm always looking out for **** combos, advantages DDD has, but something I don't understand is that Wolf is not on the CG > dtilt offstage list in the main guides.

I had thought it was a legit combo. Was this proven wrong recently, or was it never a combo to begin with and I day-dreamed of it?

 

[Commander_Beef]

Hi, how are ya guys?

I'm a Wolf mainer, but I do some DDD as another main. Point in case, I know the MU between them both, and I'm always looking out for **** combos, advantages DDD has, but something I don't understand is that Wolf is not on the CG > dtilt offstage list in the main guides.

I had thought it was a legit combo. Was this proven wrong recently, or was it never a combo to begin with and I day-dreamed of it?

Hi! I'm quite well today, thank you.
I agree with you in how I don't understand why he and R.O.B. are not on that list. The author of the guide needs to edit that. But I can assure you that it is possible to get a down tilt combo after a down throw off the ledge.
I'm going to say that both Wolf and Yoshi are the hardest to down tilt after a chaingrab because it's hard to get the right placing and timing of the down tilt after chaingrabbing to the other side of the stage.
It's the way it is because of Wolf's and Yoshi's bodies. They are on the border of almost not being able to be down tilted. These "middle-bodied" characters can ONLY be specifically down tilted literally "on top" of the ledge (or the cliff) where they are still in stun from the last down throw. That's how hard it is to get a down tilt successfuly on those two.
It's much easier to do it on "big-bodied" characters like Bowser and Donkey Kong. Yourself can literally be at cliff of the ledge while grabbing them and you can down tilt them in thin-air after a down throw.

 

[Jupz]

You have to buffer it on wolf and yoshi.

 

[Commander_Beef]

You have to buffer it on wolf and yoshi.

You should actually be buffering it everytime you want to do the combo. It sometimes won't work if you don't buffer it on Donkey Kong or Bowser.

 

[Jupz]

I can always land it on DK and Bowser even without buffering, theres a wide error margin.

 

[Commander_Beef]

I can always land it on DK and Bowser even without buffering, theres a wide error margin.

Mmk I'll believe you .

I think the doubles info that I wrote up would go to waste....so would any of you care or would be stupified if I added a "Doubles Section" of the questions?

 

[Jupz]

A doubles section would be great

 

[Countcocofang]

I know this question has been asked before, but I want to make sure matchups havent changed since last time. What would you say is/are the best secondaries for Dedede? I've heard that MK, G&W and Marth are his best secondaries, in that order, but G&W doesn't have a very good match with Olimar while Marth does, and they both are 60:40 with Falco. What sets G&W apart from Marth?

I'd prefer not to secondary MK, so whos the next best and why? Also, who are some notable other secondaries, I've heard good things about Kirby...

 

[Jupz]

Marth is a great secondary because he covers olimar, pikachu, falco and ice climbers fairly well.

 

[o-Serin-o]

Go with ICs because he ***** all of them.

 

[Commander_Beef]

I think Marth is his next best secondary behind Meta Knight also for the same reason Jupz said. There's no harm in going Ice Climbers either though, you'll just have to spend a while trying to learn them. Not Kirby because Olimar counters him.

 

[T3h Albino]

Ice Climbers are probably 3rd behind marth and mk *the characters with the best matchups in the game*. IC's take care of Olimar,PIkachu,Kirby,They go even with mk *apparently*, and punishing bad mistakes with a 0-death is just so fun.

 

[Commander_Beef]

Ice Climbers are probably 3rd behind marth and mk *the characters with the best matchups in the game*. IC's take care of Olimar,PIkachu,Kirby,They go even with mk *apparently*, and punishing bad mistakes with a 0-death is just so fun.

Yes I agree with you here except for one thing. Kirby isn't considered a bad matchup for us when the matchup is Even. Unless if it's 45:55 / 40:60 for you only Albino.

 

[T3h Albino]

Eh, I've never played a good kirby. I mean I'm not really frightened by the matchup since I have seen the worst kirby can do *played chu dat and watched co18 get *****, and **** Chu*, but the lack of playing the character
may cause me to be caught off guard.

I mean i'd probably go D3 against kirby anyway since my IC's only have MK + Pikachu experience and a little falco.

 

[Gates]

G&W is better than Marth in teams and is easier to learn than Marth. That's really the only reason to secondary him. Secondarying Marth is harder but has a bigger payoff in the end.

 

[GreenFox]

I'd go with marth most of his matchups are 60:40 in his favor. Falco is one of them I do agree though G&W is better in teams so it depends on if your doing 1v1 or 2v2. plus I never like G&W because he looks dumb atleast imo marth has a tiara thats badass

 

[Gates]

Marth is the least attractive woman I have ever seen.

G&W looks like a black man. Are you saying he's dumb because he looks like a black man? That's racist.

 

[o-Serin-o]

I'm tempted to sig that.

 

[CRASHiC]

Do the waddle throws stale?

 

[Gates]

Yes .

 

[T3h Albino]

I still don't know how to do that =[
and
Did we ever discover anything about yoshi infinite?
Does anyone actually use pummel/air release mixups?
If so when?

 

[CRASHiC]

I love pummel releases at the edge, though I must say, it takes a while to get the timing down, even more so when the opponent knows when to mash out. You have a lot of follow up options afterwards, fast fall forward air, ledge hog, footstool, dddcide.

 

[T3h Albino]

Dededecide is becoming a more prevalent part of my game.

 

[CRASHiC]

Guys, can we cancel are b moves at the ledge? Chock said we could, just the timing is very hard, I can never get it though :/

 

[o-Serin-o]

Continue this in the Metagame discussion please?

 

[Sesshomuronay]

The wolf boards are rediscussing the dedede matchup so I'm like asking for you guys to come give some input. It would be nice.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=237768

 

[Commander_Beef]

Do the waddle throws stale?

They stale just like any other move in the game. They are put in the attack queue just like any other move in the game.

Did we ever discover anything about yoshi infinite?
Does anyone actually use pummel/air release mixups?
If so when?

Yes it was confirmed not too long ago that we cannot standing grab infinite Yoshi. The man with that video only grabbed Yoshi again because of a hitbox Yoshi pulled out extremely fast. I think it was his jab. Our grab had priority at that moment when the King Dedede pressed "Z" blindly.
It's hardly useful to air release somebody unless if you're doing it at a ledge. It's hard to mindgame somebody when you air release them on stage because we're too slow-running to pull off a mindgame. I'd say the best is a dash attack but they would have quite a bit of time to react even if they were mindgamed for a second.
Air release off a ledge on a Fox, Sheik, Falco because they have fast-falls. Do it on characters like Link or Snake or Wolf because they're recoveries are feeble or are easy to punish.

Guys, can we cancel are b moves at the ledge? Chock said we could, just the timing is very hard, I can never get it though :/

The timing is only hard when we do a special attack where we are falling and that's when we have to time where the auto-ledgegrab comes in. I don't recommend doing this for our sideB though...it's not worth a waddle dee thrown and you can mess up...allowing your opponent to possibly stagespike you or just punish while you're under the ledge.

 

[choknater]

Guys, can we cancel are b moves at the ledge? Chock said we could, just the timing is very hard, I can never get it though :/

lol yeah but i dont think any of them would be useful for ddd anyway O_o

i mostly only do that for sheiks vanish and peachs turnip pull

i know mario players do it a lot with cape

 

[Commander_Beef]

lol yeah but i dont think any of them would be useful for ddd anyway O_o

i mostly only do that for sheiks vanish and peachs turnip pull

i know mario players do it a lot with cape

Well... if we put it that way...if we could...we shouldn't because all four of our special attacks are laggy anyways.

 

[CRASHiC]

But that's why we should.
A free waddle dee toss
If its off stage, we can go straight from there to grabbing the ledge, and prepare to edge hog.
imagine a lagless jet hammer.
Imagine a lagless mindgame inhale.

 

[excent]

Hello everyone, i have a problem against my friend who mains wolf. We are by no means experts at this game or claim to be, we play maybe once a week if that.

Basically my problem is i enjoy playing ddd and as i've read here ddd vs wolf should be an easy fight, my problem is my friend plays like a total jerk and just b spam lasers all match (we play on final destination 98% of the time), it's incredibly annoying and its his only character he can beat my ddd with, but i want to be able to destroy his wolf and stop his ******** spamming.

Any tips for a simple noob? thanks everyone