[Left 4 Scum] Game Over: Scum Win

[Ronike]

Ff, I'm waitin on mayling. I really would like to wait til I hear from her. Although cell, I guess if you know that would work

 

[mentosman8]

First and foremost, Un-uncap Marsh

Even if he hadn't asked, it had been made clear he was town's choice to survive and he still hasn't contributed anything. I think Mac and Hando should be trying to prove their cases right about now. By this point I'm more than willing to switch to uncapping one of them, and it simultaneously gives us info from them AND coaxes Marsh into actually pushing for his ability to survive. Let's go guys

I'm interested to hear if Ronike's argument is good. He's put a lot of argument into getting this case made, and if it's some BS it may land a vote on him from me, and if it's good it may be highly helpful.

 

[Chaco]

I'm not caught up in myself, Marshy. I'm simply making a point, if he's going to act dumb and make comments like "Oh, then you haven't been scum." I'm going to give him a refresher. It was in no way meant in the way you two took it. And quite frankly, I find it hilarious that you did.

Ronike, your argument right now I can already tell will be utter ****. Your looking at scumbuddies, therefore I have no need in linking the other 3 as they are mafiascum games.

I have been Mafia in FFVII, Spidey, and Newbie 1.

Scum partners were in FFVII:

Macman replaced by FrozenFlame
and Mentos

Spidey:

Kiki
Iggy

Newb 1:

SkylerOcon

Are you happy? If it's ****, I really hope you die instantly because you reek of scum as is.

 

[Ronike]

well no, I'm not seeing as how you told me to die instantly if my case was bad...

Seriously, how is that not being caught up in yourself?

 

[Chaco]

Seriously, how is that not being caught up in yourself?

Saying I won that game so you should remember? I don't see the self praise. I in no way belittled you. You immediately got offended and spouted that Marshy and you did all the work. Now which seems more caught up in itself:

"I just won that game you should remember."

"WE DID ALL THE WORK!!!111!!!ONE!!!ELEVEN!!! lolxd gaiz"

 

[Chaco]

And seriously, before this continues on...I was immature for trying to get the last words. Let's just move on. I gave you what you wanted to know.

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

Here how about this. I get the last word.

In FFVII Mafia, Mafia and Indies both roflstomped all over the town. Mafia just roflstomped a tad harder. It was a fun game. Woo.

Don't let Chaco distract you from preparing that case Ronike. I wanna see it.

Plus Chaco was a ****ty asspartner anyway.

j/k <3 Chaco

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

Wow I can't believe I really just forgot the space between *** and partner. Like that just happened. That looks really bad. Feel free to laugh at my horrendous typos today. XP

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Ronike, ignoring my post directed at you will not make me unvote you.

 

[Xiivi]

What's the purpose of showing us that now?

I wasn't going to point it out yesterday because I'd rather have seen if the kills lined up based on that. However, Vyse flipped survivor anyway, so it turned out to be nothing. I felt like explaining when I picked Kataefi/Vyse out of the two I'd prefer to lynch when it came to Frozen's utility lynch, I did have reason for picking them over others.

Looking back on it, I'd like to know why Ronike's choices were Kataefi/Vyse over the others listed as well.

un-uncap: The Marsh King

uncap: Handorin

Ronike's meta-check has the game stalling since we're waiting on a V/LA player for anything to happen. Let's discuss me and why you think I'm scum Hando. You think I'm scum, you want to live, you should try to push my lynch and prove you can be helpful instead of just saying you're fine voting me because my playstyle is odd/giving you bad vibes.

vote: Kataefi

I'm sad to see Macman get incapped - don't know much about Handorin sadly. I find mac is often curious and instinctive, which is always good. But my uncap vote goes to you marshy because I feel you can make some really nice calculated observations when prompted to do so. It's interesting because when I first starting playing with you I thought you were just a bunch of one liners.

"I don't really want to uncap Marsh King, I want to uncap Macman. But I'm going to blend in with the crowd I think. PS: I'm sad they got incapped cause they are good!"

 

[Kataefi]

Fyi Xiivi I'm sad to see him bleed to death because I find him pretty light-hearted and I feel like he thinks out loud through his posts... it's fun to read (in a good way Mac). I mentioned this in Phoenix Wright mafia. Brain-wise I have totally stereotyped Marshy to be the better player so yeah... I uncapped Marshy.

I'm sad to see Mac incapped... maybe you could reword this for me Xiivi!

_


Last minute christmas stuff for me tomorrow... I'll make a post in the evening and be attentive to everyone's points then!

 

[Ronike]

Gheb, I promse when I make my case I'll address your points.

Xiivi: I chose vyse and katae over the other inactive and noninfo givers because I don't know their playstyles and thus it's hard for me to get a definitive read on them if they aren't incapped.

 

[Cello_Marl]

Maymoo doesn't really talk about her Mafia games with me. Sometimes she *****es about how stupid so-and-so is being, but that's about it. I only know she was town once in an Allisbrawl mafia game. I'm pretty sure she hasn't been scum with anyone in this game, at least as far as games in which both roles haven't flipped are concerned. If you want to be sure, you'll have to wait for her.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

What do other people think about the mentos / Circus connection I pointed out 94387594334 times? Nobody got an opinion on that?

 

[Handorin]

Xiivi: My only case is that I have bad vibes from you and think you have been playing odd. The only reason this might amount to something is that I'm clear.

 

[Mayling]

post incoming later tonight. i have 16 pages to read.

ps i came in last both tournaments i entered. </3

 

[Ronike]

Mayling, first answer this: Have you ever been mafia before?

Marshy, still need you to answer who on my list of people haven't you played with.

 

[Mayling]

Mayling, first answer this: Have you ever been mafia before?

The one game of forum mafia that has completed, I was not mafia.

All other games are ongoing.

 

[The Marsh King]

sorry for lack of contribution. holiday/finals/shenanigans johns

im annoyed at the uncap wagon at the beginning of the day. as said i think the ideal situation wouldve been to judge off what hando/macman/me said THEN uncap. also hate being buttered up so much. remember this tomorrow town. kat un-uncap me already and keep the un-uncap wagon going. think hando and macman should get back into this game since town's shown that they're willing to consider them as well

medi again seriously consider requesting replacement this is awful. if youre bored then replace out now because in star fox your lack of contribution killed us near endgame

cello and mayling are the only players here who i havent played with before

v/la til 26th. more substance then or 27th at latest

 

[Mayling]

I'm back, baby.

[/LIST]
uncap: The Marsh King

The possibility the The Marsh King was incapped twice is better than macman or hando getting incapped twice I think; so scum will have to risk losing another incap to finish off marshy by not knowing who should target him and multiple people targeting him or none of them target him at all resulting in a clear townie for a longer period of time. Both seem win-win to me.

If we're assuming there is four scum, then wouldn't we want to un-incap someone other than Marsh king? I mean, I see what you're saying, but if we un-incap Macman or Hando, assuming Marshy has two incaps on him, then they have to incap Macman/Hando twice. They have more of a "buffer zone" than Marsh King does if there's four scum and Marshy got hit twice.

I'm feeling very uncomfortable with Mayling. More to come on this later but I want to hear some thoughts from Mayling about the Night events. I understand you're busy =( but even if it's just a small post, that's fine with me!

Yeah, Mac and Marshy are two obvious choices. Trying to rid two strong players, and Hando, well to be honest I'm not sure. So I'm going to say scum has a sense of humor.

This may seem strange, but I think that scum was trying to set me up. Why I think that I'm getting set up? Well, I did say that I thought s2/hando was innocent. Hando in response said he had uneasy feelings about me. But seeing as Hando came up capped, I was obviously right. This is where my thoughts start getting complicated and a little weird.

Kat, I like how you're all interested in "knowing what I think about the night's events" even though... did you say you were uneasy about me at all before day ended? I don't think so. So are you trying to set me up as a scum who incapped Hando to "prove" that he was innocent, and that I was right? It just seems that's what it was like to me.

vote: kataefi

Have any of you ever been scum before? Could you link me to the game if you have?

Reiterating, I was town in the game that's completed.

 

[Tom]

Uncap Count:
[6] The Marsh King (Xiivi, Handorin, Pythag, KevinM, Chaco, Kataefi)
[1] Handorin (Xiivi)
[0] Macman ()

[10] Not Uncapping (Mayling, The Marsh King, frozenflame751 Cello_Marl, Mediocre, McFox, Macman, Ronike, Gheb_01, Circus, Mentosman8)

Vote Count:
[8] Not Voting (mentosman8, The Marsh King, Pythag, Kataefi, frozenflame751, KevinM, Cello_Marl, Mediocre)
[4] Ronike (McFox, Chaco, Gheb_01, Macman)
[2] Xiivi (Handorin, Circus)
[2] Kataefi (Xiivi, Mayling)
[1] Chaco (Ronike)
[0] mentosman8 ()
[0] Mediocre ()
[0] Circus ()
[0] frozenflame751 ()
[0] KevinM ()
[0] Cello_Marl ()
[0] Gheb_01 ()
[0] McFox ()
[0] Handorin ()
[0] Macman ()
[0] Pythag ()
[0] Mayling ()

Happy holidays, everyone!
Circus, KevinM, McFox, Mediocre, Pythag have been prodded for inactivity.
A deadline has been set for Sunday, January 3rd, Noon EST!

Get your **** together! Don't expect a deadline extension!

 

[#HBC | FrozeηFlame]

Mayling, I think you're misunderstanding how Incapping, and Un-incapping works.

You have 3 "incap credits" so to speak. This means, you can be targeted by the infected a maximum of 2 times before dying. The third time you get incapped you die no matter what. If you are incapped at night and you aren't at the limit, you will come up as "incapped" during the day. If this is your status, the majority of players must vote to "uncap" you to keep you from bleeding out. That is all that the "Uncapping" does, it simply prevents you from dying from less than three incaps. It doesn't give you back an incap credit. So hypothetically, if Marshy was targeted by two infected, and Hando and Mac were both only targeted by one, uncapping Marshy would not put him back down to only one incap, and targeting Hando or Mac would not reduce their incap count to zero. Their counts would all stay the same, it's just that they won't bleed out and die.

At least that's the impression I got from what the rules say. People feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

Just thought I'd clear that up with my sliver of spare time today. Happy holidays everyone! =D

 

[Mayling]

Mayling, I think you're misunderstanding how Incapping, and Un-incapping works.

You have 3 "incap credits" so to speak. This means, you can be targeted by the infected a maximum of 2 times before dying. The third time you get incapped you die no matter what. If you are incapped at night and you aren't at the limit, you will come up as "incapped" during the day. If this is your status, the majority of players must vote to "uncap" you to keep you from bleeding out. That is all that the "Uncapping" does, it simply prevents you from dying from less than three incaps. It doesn't give you back an incap credit. So hypothetically, if Marshy was targeted by two infected, and Hando and Mac were both only targeted by one, uncapping Marshy would not put him back down to only one incap, and targeting Hando or Mac would not reduce their incap count to zero. Their counts would all stay the same, it's just that they won't bleed out and die.

At least that's the impression I got from what the rules say. People feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

Just thought I'd clear that up with my sliver of spare time today. Happy holidays everyone! =D

Yeah, I know.

 

[Mayling]

Wait, this is what I meant:

This is what I was thinking:

Marshy: 2 Caps.
Hando: 1 Cap.
Mac: 1 Cap.

If we uncap Marshy, only one infected would have to hit him to kill him off. If we uncap the other two, at least two others would have to hit them to finish them off. It all depends on how coordinated the scum have become at this point. If we uncap Marshy, one scum would have to hit him, but there's the chance that two scum might try and hit him. Or we can uncap one of the others to ensure that two of them must hit them. Make sense? :O

 

[McFox]

I've been prodded. Christmas and such. I've made my opinions about the day so far abundantly clear. Ronike badly needs to be lynched. And I think Mayling is right, it may be more advantageous for us to not uncap Marshy.

 

[KevinM]

I would much rather lynch Ronike then anyone.

Re-reading more however.

 

[Chaco]

I would much rather lynch Ronike then anyone.

Re-reading more however.

T his.

 

[Pythag]

Why is there such movement for a ronike lynch?
is it just because he was a rabble rouser day 1?

...answer to a prod...

 

[Ronike]

Because the only person in the mafia that decided to be smart and not just follow their team mates is circus.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

And you still have not responded to my questions, Ronike. And you have yet to reveal the purpose of these questions. Stalling much?

 

[KevinM]

Exactly, he's stalling for the purpose of his questions, I haven't seen him make a case about anything that makes a bit of sense.

 

[Ronike]

Its the holiday season guys, of course I haven't posted my case, I haven't had time.

I'll try to get my case up sometime the weekend, but no guaruntees, Im still busy. At the very least though, I can answer your questions gheb:

OK. Does the fact that somebody hopped the wagon compound to suspicions you already had on that player or is it null?

Well, sure its slightly scummy, I mean people lynched a wagon in a day. But the fact that no one likes bandwagons and we were so close to a deadline and so many vets were on it at the start, it really is quite close to a null tell. I'd have to go back and read quick to make sure of that, but no, I'm not immediately suspicious of people on that wagon.

It's not like I haven't voiced suspicions against you D1 already. If I wanted an easy target I'd just hop Mediocre for not playing. That's an easy target (or other rather inactive players). I don't see an experienced player, who actively posts a lot as an overly easy target.

Except a lot of people see me as the play today, making it easy for mafia to sneak in and and throw more suspicion at me, thus making me an easy target. Its true that medi wouldn't fight back, but its too early for people to advocate an inactive lynch, so he's not really an easy target. No worries though, you aren't on my scum list.

Circus "breadcrumbing" and mentos "coaching" him to not do so has been an issue most of D1 (to me at least) and put mentos up high on my scumlist. Now Circus tried to give credit to mentos for not voting the confirmed survivor. What do you think about that connection?

That particular connection is interesting, and mentos is definetely high up on my possible scum list, but not as high as 4 other people: kevin, mcfox, chaco, and circus.

What do you think about Kevin's contributions? You Fosed him D1 for those question and like me you had him high up on your scumlist. What happened to that? Do you think the discussion Kevin introduced proved to be fruitful? Did it even had the potential to be fruitful?

Kevin's "contributions" were ****. It was just an attempt to coordinate with a few of his buddies (especially mcfox) while framing certain other people (me) with incriminating questions. He's highest on my scum list, I just didn't mention it because it is imperative to my case, and I didn't want mafia to realize I was on their tracks. Discussion that Kevin introduced was fruitful? Don't make me laugh. It took the pressure of his mafia mate McFox because he forced me to answer/argue with him (which is generally seen as a null tell because we often don't see eye to eye) instead of argue with a floundering mcfox.

Haven't been mafia yet. Only been indy once but it was the Simpsons pre-game aka Macmans epic troll.

Thank you.

 

[Chaco]

Why is there such movement for a ronike lynch?

Presenting a meta case to divert attention.

I'm pretty sure it's all that is.

 

[mentosman8]

Well, I'm withholding my vote till Ronike's case goes up, but I'll be re-reading this in addition to Monster Island tonight and seeing if I come up with anything. Other than that, as I said I want to see what Ronike has to say, especially since I kind of agree with his argument about KevMo.

 

[Circus]

****, guys. Sorry for letting this game get so far away from me. Christmas johns, my own general laziness, and dwindling enthusiasm in this game are to blame. I'll make a concerted effort to catch up on the goings-on tonight.

 

[Pythag]

Wait, this is what I meant:

This is what I was thinking:

Marshy: 2 Caps.
Hando: 1 Cap.
Mac: 1 Cap.

If we uncap Marshy, only one infected would have to hit him to kill him off. If we uncap the other two, at least two others would have to hit them to finish them off. It all depends on how coordinated the scum have become at this point. If we uncap Marshy, one scum would have to hit him, but there's the chance that two scum might try and hit him. Or we can uncap one of the others to ensure that two of them must hit them. Make sense? :O

The deal is, I think we are banking on scum not knowing who is going for who.
We might get 2 people going for marsh again, which would leave is with only one person being incapped the next day.


Man, Ronike, I want to vote for you, yet at the same time, Chaco's really lame last two posts have me suspicious.

He seemed all enthusiastic about your lynch, yet when I asked why, he gave barely a sentence. That bothers me.

 

[Handorin]

The deal is, I think we are banking on scum not knowing who is going for who.
We might get 2 people going for marsh again, which would leave is with only one person being incapped the next day.


Man, Ronike, I want to vote for you, yet at the same time, Chaco's really lame last two posts have me suspicious.

He seemed all enthusiastic about your lynch, yet when I asked why, he gave barely a sentence. That bothers me.

Could still be 2 incaps.

2 on marshy, 1 on X, one on Y

 

[KevinM]

You guys are still fiddling with the crazy idea of me coordinating my attacks through questions?

Have fun chasing ghosts.

 

[Cello_Marl]

And I think Mayling is right, it may be more advantageous for us to not uncap Marshy.

If we let this rule how we go about uncapping then we'll be letting the scum rule our actions. What happened to letting them go about proving their own worth?


My gut reaction to Ronike on Day 1 was survivor after I saw the way he approached the game thinking about town and scum in normal terms instead of thinking of us as survivors. Frankly, I didn't even think he actually had a meta-plan; I thought he was just gauging reactions to what he's doing. Since he's still saying that he does though, I do want to hear it. Just, soon enough that we can properly react to it rather than scramble again.

KevinM, what have you learned from your questions that you feel comfortable telling us?

Also, belated happy holidays to all~
(Sweet swag is sweet and time-consuming)

 

[Ronike]

Kevin, how exactly is it crazy?

I'll give you a small teaser of my case: Marshy being incapped was a mistake in my opinion. A noobie mistake. For two reasons:

A) Marshy often plays like the ideal incap victim until he finds something, then goes full blast. In fact, last couple of games he hasn't even gone full blast. Which leads me to believe certain people didn't know that he was good or how good it would be to have him confirmed. Which leads me to suspect Mayling and Cello.

B) Marshy was going after Kevin, who is the person I am most certain is scum. Newbie scum, without outside assistance, tend to go after those who suspect them, and by extension in this rare case, those aligned with themselves to cover their tracks. A highly circumstancial case I realize, but then again, my main suspect of this (Circus) has plenty of other stuff against him, such as the breadcrumbing.

Also, everyone should keep in mind, the scum are stuck guessing as to who got incapped multiple times to (right tom?) so in this case they will be even further confused as to who to go after, and thus more likely to either slip up trying to communicate, not manage to get someone to 3 incaps, or all focus on one person. I think we're alright.