Lucario Brainstorm Thread (Updating Soon.)

[Slido]

I would really like to pick up the FP grab release if that could be possible, although I wouldn't be able to update the stuff very often because I don't have anyone to play on a regular basis. But I did find find something recently that you all may be interested in. When you air release wario with FP you can get a free fair combo. I don't know if that was already known or not but it's the first I have seen/heard of it. Also FP ground release doesn't set up for anything on any character. (what a bummer)

I also need to test this more, but I THINK we could get a free AS or fsmash on him as well out of an air release

 

[phi1ny3]

I tried it on wario, you get a free AS for sure.
I tried bowser, D3, and MK, and so far it seems there isn't truly any release stuff (although air release -> Dash attack looked promising).

 

[Slido]

Ah, well that's disappointing to hear. At least we have something on wario though.

 

[Browny]

whats all this about FP grab release? Isnt it like, impossible to force? literally

 

[Slido]

We're just trying to find out what we can do out of a FP release just in case they decide to break out, and if they don't, more grabs for us. ^.^

 

[phi1ny3]

It's to make the FPCG a little more "reliable", because if they break late, they air release, and it was my attempt at saying "maybe we could make the "breakable" CG a mindgame for something nastier".
So far tho, it only works on wario, which is like the hardest character to grab in the game.

 

[Aurasmash14]

Phil can you show a vid on the es bounce ? ive been thinking about its usefullness.

 

[iRJi]

So about Dtilt being used for extreme pressure is true lol. I implimented the concept into my game against pierce and got nothing bu positive results. Personally I used it like how a Marth would use it. Dtilting your opponents shield seems to be reliably safe if u space it from the end 1/2. If they try to push in you can just simply Dtilt again, and if they choose to hold their shield get get pushed out of range. The ending lag on Dtilt is fast enough for me to react with a different move after also, which makes me to think that we might have interruptible frames on it.

Rookie is comming to my house today, so i will test it real fast and post results. seems like Dtilt is more then just a good setup move, its an amazing shield pressure move as well. Feedback later, TY for everyone who helped with the Dtilt earlier btw =P

 

[hough123]

Ugh, we're losing momentum in our searches D= I'll take up a project if possible to help move things along.

 

[LordoftheMorning]

Alright. I'm back, guys. I'm exhausted right now, but I'll be looking through the thread and updating sometime soon. Nice to be back.

 

[hough123]

Alright. I'm back, guys. I'm exhausted right now, but I'll be looking through the thread and updating sometime soon. Nice to be back.

It's nice to have you back (=

Also, I got another idea: If you SH Bair then fastfall, you get no lag on the bair. Could this be useful? Lucario's Bair is a large hitbox that does more damage and knockback than fair.

I'll probably edit in some more ideas in a bit.

 

[Loota]

I have been wondering if there is any more use of Aura Sphere Charge and came up with this:

You do the normal sh fair > fastfall nair string or sh fair > fastfall while your opponent is shielding and land directly behind your opponent and start charging his/her shield. I haven't tried this myself yet but has anyone even thought about this? I think that you have to charge it a little bit or preferably almost to full before doing this because the bigger the charge is the more likely your opponent will be caught in it. Also the more percents you have the better it will work.

At least it is a mindgame if nothing else Sorry also for my possible bad grammar, I'm finnish you see. I hope I made myself clear.

 

[D. Disciple]

I tried it on wario, you get a free AS for sure.
I tried bowser, D3, and MK, and so far it seems there isn't truly any release stuff (although air release -> Dash attack looked promising).

Hmm do you think you can get an usmash out of them. If they air release?

 

[phi1ny3]

Yeah, but you have to hypen smash to connect (with Wario)

 

[D. Disciple]

Well worth it at higher percents then.

 

[WakerofWinds]

I have been wondering if there is any more use of Aura Sphere Charge and came up with this:

You do the normal sh fair > fastfall nair string or sh fair > fastfall while your opponent is shielding and land directly behind your opponent and start charging his/her shield. I haven't tried this myself yet but has anyone even thought about this? I think that you have to charge it a little bit or preferably almost to full before doing this because the bigger the charge is the more likely your opponent will be caught in it. Also the more percents you have the better it will work.

At least it is a mindgame if nothing else Sorry also for my possible bad grammar, I'm finnish you see. I hope I made myself clear.

RARing a bair could be an interesting tactic against some of the longer ranged foes... good smart move bringing this up.

 

[D. Disciple]

I don't know if anyone has thought of doing this. But you know when Snake is off the stage and he's c4 hopping. Since Lucario's 2nd hop is pretty **** good, anyone ever thought of simply interrupting his c4 hopping with a bas?

There are some issues with it. Cause he gets his 3rd jump back obviously, but even so. We can still edgeguard him, and harass him with some falling bairs. Assuming you grabbed the edge again and jumping back to the edge.

 

[iRJi]

I don't know if anyone has thought of doing this. But you know when Snake is off the stage and he's c4 hopping. Since Lucario's 2nd hop is pretty **** good, anyone ever thought of simply interrupting his c4 hopping with a bas?

There are some issues with it. Cause he gets his 3rd jump back obviously, but even so. We can still edgeguard him, and harass him with some falling bairs. Assuming you grabbed the edge again and jumping back to the edge.

That would be too slow. Actually the best thing to do is to go down and Fair, since it knocks him away from the stage and he is forced to recover again, then you can just cycle and repeat. =]

 

[D. Disciple]

Yeah, but I'm talking about from afar. But fair could be the extremely better option in that case. IDK I was just brainstorming and practicing it out. From watching Ally and M2K go at it and saw how he was being very aggressive off stage against his snake and was trying to figure out what all we could do.

 

[hough123]

I just played Forged, and he stage spiked me with a BAS. It was sooooooo epic. It was like nervana for 2 seconds during my death.
In other words: Look into the AS stage spike NAOW!

EDIT: I sounded hyper because I was. =D
What I meant was that a BAS stage spike could aid our recovery and net a kill at the same time, so we should look into it. (If there's anything to look into.)

 

[phi1ny3]

I hear that snakes really hate it when you read their DI from the c4 and you footstool jump them.

 

[Aurasmash14]

I used to do that a lot to my old classmate. but then he started predicting my jumps.....

 

[Forged]

I just played Forged, and he stage spiked me with a BAS.

My face afterwards:
I'd actually like to help with the studying of this attack - if possible.

-you footstool jump them.

"Footstooling" actually leads to many combinations.
For example, one of my favorites, is after the "Footstool" connects....short-hop into "A-Down". The recoil should give you time to pull off one - if not two - "A-Air". At this point, your opponent will be rising to their feet as you charge a "Side-Smash".

 

[hough123]

"Footstooling" actually leads to many combinations.
For example, one of my favorites, is after the "Footstool" connects....short-hop into "A-Down". The recoil should give you time to pull of one - if not two - "A-Air". At this point, your opponent will be rising to their feet as you charge a "Side-Smash".

You need to learn some basic abbreviations before you help

For aerials:
Nair- Nuetral air.
Fair- Foward air.
Bair- Back air.
Dair- Down air.
Uair- Up air.

For smashes:
Fsmash- Foward smash.
Dsmash- Down smash.
Usmash- Up smash.

For throws:
Uthrow- Up throw.
Fthrow- Foward throw.
Bthrow- Back throw.
Dthrow- Down throw

For specials:
AS- Aura Sphere.
BAS- Baby Aura Sphere.
FP- Force Palm.
FPCG- Force Palm chain grab.
ES- Extreme Speed.
EA- Extreme Awesome.
DT- Double Team.
RDT- Reverse Double Team.

Tell me if I missed any =D

 

[tedward2000]

I see a trend popping up.

And I shall call it, "Ledge Excuses", way's to KO somebody off stage without entirely gimping them.

Cause footstooling and now BAS stuns have popped up, and Bair spikes have been known for a long time. Perhaps.... some looking into could occur.
-t2

 

[Forged]

You need to learn some basic abbreviations before you help

Thanks Hough.
Sorry about my inability to use abbreviations.

 

[hough123]

Thanks Hough.
Sorry about my inability to use abbreviations.

No problem, all it takes is one post and you can speak Lucario like a natural.

 

[Col. Stauffenberg]

On a related matter, does anyone know the frame data for footstooling? It's relevant to my interests.

 

[hough123]

I have yet another idea:
We should look into Lucario's grab release combos. Lucario may be tall enough to hold characters such as MK over the ground, forcing an aerial release. I need to check it, but this could help our game considerably.

Out of five ideas not even one has advanced further on yet? D= w\e, I'll get one eventually.

 

[LordoftheMorning]

Sorry, I've been lazy with my updating. I'll start combing through the thread tonight. ~_~

 

[iRJi]

I have yet another idea:
We should look into Lucario's grab release combos. Lucario may be tall enough to hold characters such as MK over the ground, forcing an aerial release. I need to check it, but this could help our game considerably.

Out of five ideas not even one has advanced further on yet? D= w\e, I'll get one eventually.

No grab release combos on MK, i tested that along time ago. Also for phil, I gave Pierce a run for his money. =D couldn't get the video though, took too long for every match.

 

[hough123]

No grab release combos on MK, i tested that along time ago. Also for phil, I gave Pierce a run for his money. =D couldn't get the video though, took too long for every match.

What about on anyone else? As you said, all it takes is one character.

 

[iRJi]

As far as I know the only character we have a grab release combo on is wario. Possible to have ness and lucus also, but I have not tested that. If you want, Test against all the short characters, and short characters only. Lucario has a mid-held grab, and most characters touch the floor, like MK for example.

 

[ckm]

wait, we have a grab release on wario?? this is news to me. I thought he ground-breaks when lucario releases him....

 

[phi1ny3]

lucario's air release is, in the least, interesting. I haven't been able to get it consistently (unless he does his double jump into my grab), but it's for the most part random as far as I've tested it, it obviously needs to release when you aren't grab jabbing him, but other than that, I'll occasionally get a ground release, a lot of the time, get an air release.
More testing soon, might have to do with specific animation or something.
Yeah, best candidates are ness, lucas, MK, wario, and squirtle for testing for things like this usually.

 

[hough123]

I'd like to bump this thread, there seem to be a few new players coming in that need to see this.

 

[SuperSmashKing009]

when you play against heavy characters lets say for instance Fox. you could string dash attack into a combo. you know how you hit a character with your dash attack they go backwards. Well I was in training and I tried to figure what moves could string well with dash attack. So I did this jab>grab>upthrow>dash attack>Fair>Nair. when use up throw and wait at the right moment your dash attack will knock him forward instead of the usual backwards, so then thats when Fair and Nair come in to string in. Oh yea another thing the combo I told you about only works in low percentages.

I will look more into this if it could be DI'd.


I will explain later on, with a Video attached to this. Ok here is the video guys:
http://www.youtube.com/user/SmashBern009#play/all/uploads-all/0/siP2ud3mffA

 

[phi1ny3]

Yes, let's get this up again.
I'm sure I'll post my "find" here before Genesis begins, which is...
Oh wow, tomorrow, time to get testing done faster ^_^
*Looks at old CG list to see which ones left to test*.

 

[iRJi]

Ok, I did post something here, but I realized it was not that smart too. I personally, am going to make a Backroom for Lucario, no matter what anyone else thinks of it. People who are worthy to join it will get an invite by me soon. Some people may think that it is not necessary to make one, but I think it is. If you do not wish to join, that is your own preference.

 

[SuperSmashKing009]

when you play against heavy characters lets say for instance Fox. you could string dash attack into a combo. you know how you hit a character with your dash attack they go backwards. Well I was in training and I tried to figure what moves could string well with dash attack. So I did this jab>grab>upthrow>dash attack>Fair>Nair. when use up throw and wait at the right moment your dash attack will knock him forward instead of the usual backwards, so then thats when Fair and Nair come in to string in. Oh yea another thing the combo I told you about only works in low percentages.

I will look more into this if it could be DI'd.


I will explain later on, with a Video attached to this. Ok here is the video guys:
http://www.youtube.com/user/SmashBern009#play/all/uploads-all/0/siP2ud3mffA

Ok I just tested it and here are the results this combo could work on:

Captain Falcon(100% sure)
Falco (If he doesn't use shine)
Fox(If he doesn't use shine)
Wolf(If he doesn't use shine)
King D3(possible but not 100% sure)
Ganon(100% sure)
DK(possible but not 100% sure)
Sheik(possible still testing)

Thats its for now. I need someone to help me on this to see if it works with Uptilt instead of Upthrow. I think how the Dash attack makes it knock forward is because the character you hit has to be in the air but almost touching the ground and thats what makes the dash attack knock the opponent forward instead of backwards.