Official BBR Tier List v5

[Javon89]

Snake not moving down is weird, Bowser got roflpwned.

Mario moving up (if that is up) I didn't see coming.

 

[Deleted member]

because he gets gayed by possibly any infinite in this game.

Not if you play smart and don't put yourself in those positions. Fox get's gayed by some of those infinites as well. In fact, Wolf has the overall better MU ratio. Wolf has tools to fight his bad MU's. Wolf has better tournament results. Kain even WON a tournament recently.

But yeah, go Fox. Countering MK like a pro.

And I agree that snake shouldn't be #2 anymore.

 

[Goldenadept]

the only infinate wolf has to look out for is DDD's sheik isnt used enough to be considered a threat and sheik sucks just as much as wolf does anyways.
wolf has the ability to outspace and out manoeuver DDD all he wants in the matchup and even though its incredibly tough he can still pull out a win.
pika is dangerous too but i really dont feel like getting into it cause i'm tired of arguing with people who wont let 2008 go and realize that all characters change, look at fox, he gets gayed just as much, but "potential" matters i guess.

like i said, wolf is where he should be, but it seems like at this point his results (which are good, not amazing) are getting ignored

 

[PieDisliker]

I like this list, but Falco definately should've gone up to 2nd or 3rd.

Otherwise, good job, BBR. Good job.

 

[Juushichi]

ITT: Wolf mains they be mad.

 

[Browny]

I thought people would transform to zelda if they got knocked really far offstage in melee to recover. Seems that they used zelda only a bit less than sheik mains do in brawl (ie; almost never).

 

[Zigsta]

Bowser with that HARD tumble.

All good, though. He'll get more rep in time.

 

[typh]

there seems to be an arbitrary change in definition of a "tier list" in between tier list versions 1 and 2, which set of rules are you guys using to vote?

 

[Deleted member]

the only infinate wolf has to look out for is DDD's sheik isnt used enough to be considered a threat and sheik sucks just as much as wolf does anyways.
wolf has the ability to outspace and out manoeuver DDD all he wants in the matchup and even though its incredibly tough he can still pull out a win.
pika is dangerous too but i really dont feel like getting into it cause i'm tired of arguing with people who wont let 2008 go and realize that all characters change, look at fox, he gets gayed just as much, but "potential" matters i guess.

like i said, wolf is where he should be, but it seems like at this point his results (which are good, not amazing) are getting ignored

Crow even posted a mid-tier results post, so the BBR is aware that Wolf is getting good results. It's just like you said. They don't care enough to acknowledge him.

Edit: results "post", not thread.

 

[Red Arremer]

I thought people would transform to zelda if they got knocked really far offstage in melee to recover. Seems that they used zelda just as much as sheik mains do in brawl (ie; almost never).

Brawl Tier List 6.0:
TOP
Fox/Falco/Puff

HIGH
Sheik
Marth

UPPER
Peach
Falcon

MIDDLE
Ice Climbers
Samus/Ganon
Doc Mario

LOW
Mario/Pikachu
Luigi/DK
Link

BOTTOM
Zelda
Mewtwo
Roy/Young Link
Game and Watch

NEGLIGIBLE
Yoshi/Pichu/Bowser/Ness/Kirby

GENGAR
Gengar (Master Hand and other glitches)

 

[Teh Brettster]

No more LT tourneys. =[

 

[Spelt]

I thought people would transform to zelda if they got knocked really far offstage in melee to recover. Seems that they used zelda only a bit less than sheik mains do in brawl (ie; almost never).

Oh god i hope you're joking.
please, please be joking.
please.

 

[Goldenadept]

no wolf in tier 6?!



i guess he got too old to fight and just bought a nice beach house to live out the rest of his days, god bless

 

[AyatoK26]

This has got to be the most predictable tier list yet (after the second one that is) with the exception of Fox, who everyone on SWF has hyped up for a while.

GW moved up,

Zelda moved down

And there's no H tier anymore. I guess BBR got tired of that joke since April.

 

[Moozle]

Based on results, I think Peach should be 1-3 places higher than where she is now, but other than that, I actually really like this list. The only change in high tier that I can see is Pikachu moving 1 or 2 places down and Lucario moving 1 or 2 places up. In the lower tiers I would have expected Yoshi to rise.

 

[Javon89]

No more LT tourneys. =[

Wynaut?

Well, yea since we all know who wins and Ganon is just Ganon.

 

[T-block]

... You're apparently too good to read the write-up about Zelda/Sheik?

And what does Melee have to do with Brawl? The Melee tier list has NOTHING to do with the Brawl tier list. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. Care to tell me WHY we should take the Melee tierlist into consideration when making a tierlist for Brawl?

But if you're already bringing in Melee:
In Melee, Sheik is Top Tier. Zelda is Bottom Tier. There is no real advantage if you switch from Sheik to Zelda.
Both are handled as separate characters with no Down B because there is no reason to switch to Zelda. Zelda doesn't benefit Sheik at all in Melee.
In Brawl, Sheik is Mid Tier and Zelda is Low Tier. However, there are certain matchups in which Zelda actually is beneficial to Sheik. For instance, against chaingrabbers, who have more trouble chaingrabbing Zelda.

Valueing Zelda and Sheik as own characters but also as combination does make sense in this game.

Brawl is NOT Melee.

I actually disagree slightly with what was said about Melee in this post. They SHOULD be ranked as one character as well in Melee - the option to switch is there, should the player wish to use it. However, it's basically implicit that Zelda/Sheik would go just above Sheik in Melee, since Zelda is so much worse than Sheik in that game. Melee doesn't omit the combination because Zelda isn't beneficial for Sheik per se... it's because the combination's position is already captured in Sheik's position.

Browny, we're not factoring in arbitrary percents. Zelda/Sheik does not represent the character played 50% Zelda/50% Sheik, or such percent. It represents a character with the option of switching. It would actually be inaccurate to omit the combination, since the combination comes closest to describing the character's full potential. Being a Zelda/Sheik player does not imply that you even use Transform in every matchup. We're ranking the combination assuming the player uses Transform whenever it's beneficial - in certain matchups, it may never be beneficial, but that doesn't mean we have to label it as an individual character now.

 

[Silly Kyle]

Peach should definitely be 2-3 spots higher. Wtf

 

[Mr. Escalator]

Pretty good list, IMO. Nice to see G&W pop ahead of Lucario, at least, and that ZSS didn't pass them. I sort of think ZSS is better than Lucario, but it's not a big deal.

Ike rising was obvious, he shouldn't have been that low in the first place. Ness not rising is weird, seeing all the talk of him deserving more in his character discussion.

I'm probably okay with Bowser dropping. Now he can do LT tournaments, at least!

 

[Kewkky]

It's weird how peeple have been saying in previous lists that Snake is #2 no questions asked, and now they're all surprised that he's at #2.

The only difference between the past Snake and the present Snake is that people know how to fight against him more, because of the many Snakes around. That is literally the only difference. He's not worse nor better, it's just simply a side effect of everyone having lots of experience against that character, but that character's mainers not having the same amount of experience against other people.

Think about it... For the purposes of presenting my example by using popularity, let's say there's a total of 1000 MK's, 500 Snakes, 300 Diddies, 200 falcos, and ranges from 100-50 of all other character mainers. There would be a total of 2000 + (+/-)3800 maximum range // 2000 + (+/-)1900 minimum range players total... The most likely scenario here is that due to the large number of Snakes, people are going to fight Snakes quite often, it is the second most popular character after all... However, Snakes will not be fighting everyone else at an equal rate! Everyone would just need to learn the Snake MU to do well versus him, but Snake will have to learn EVERY MU to keep up with the other characters' mainers. Isn't the idea of "Snake not seeming as good as before", just an effect of everyone having more experience against Snake in the MU, instead of Snakes having more experience against everyone else?

It really is an effect of Snake's popularity... Really, the fact that we know how to beat Snake doesn't make him a worse character. I personally believe he deserves to be second (we all know how I will just repeat what we always say when talking about Snake, so I'll just skip it), he's shown it, and been showing it consistently, since Brawl was released.

 

[Kinzer]

just because alot of peope agree on something does not make it right, the ruleset will change new players coming in blah blah blah this is far from finalised they thought melee's tier list was going to be the last and then they released another

There's no way to be right or wrong when the topic at hand is entirely subjective. When I said accurate, I meant to say "closest representation of the evidence given." The evidence being matchups, tourney performance, stats, etc. Sorry for the confusion.

Also, link to MAY-LAY! tier list pl0x? Last time I remember, Puff was still a High/Mid-tier character.

Lol@bowser ****** low tier, he doesnt even beat a lot of low tier characters, and isnt even good

i like the list though

No.

We have failed Captain Falcon.

These.

More on-topic: Could somebody tell me why Sheik dropped below Sonic? I'm not saying I'm not happy with this, but last I checked, Sheik was riding that hype train and people seem to be hellbent on believing she had a positive future. This drop does not say otherwise, especially below Ike (though Ike's rise was overdue).

 

[Rickerdy-doo-da-day]

Brawl Tier List 6.0:

:embarrass


Lol poor Ike mains are going to have to rethink who they use in LT tourneys now. PT is definitly in mid tier and not borderline like Ness and Bowser were last time right?

 

[Xebenkeck]

Honestly, i think a big thank you is in order for the bbr for putting up with all the crap they had to to release this, it is a very good list.

The only thing i'll comment is that i still believe falco is the 2nd best character

 

[Aibou]

lmfao Fox.

 

[Kole]

Nothing surprising.

 

[Teh Future]

wtf how is bowser not the worst character in the game

*gets banned*

rly tho doesnt gannon have better results than like 5 characters above him. why is he in his own tire thats ********

 

[etecoon]

The sprite for Zelda/Sheik is really creepy btw.. Reminds me of some kind of Cyborg.

I like it, I want them to add it to the character icon list under user cp details!

 

[Red Arremer]

[big post which I don't wanna quote because it's so big, just click the arrow icon and it will lead you to that post, although it's pretty obvious which one I mean]

That was kinda how it was explained to me. Granted, I don't know jack about Melee, so if I am wrong, I'm sorry.

rly tho doesnt gannon have better results than like 5 characters above him. why is he in his own tire thats ********

Tier list =/= Tournament results

Also, low tier results should be taken with a grain of salt because only a single win or high placing can put a character up by several places.

I like it, I want them to add it to the character icon list under user cp details!

Thank you, I'm glad you like it, I tried my best, although it's been a while since I made it.
I tried to get that icon to be added there back then, but SWF administration didn't add it even as a smiley.

 

[JNB328522]

omg fox for 16 really?!!

let the other people hate

 

[Attila_]

snake is still 2? back it up with national tourney results, please.

 

[Aibou]

I like it, I want them to add it to the character icon list under user cp details!

I like this idea.

 

[typh]

do i have to have a huge flashy sig for someone to respond to me or should i PM a bbr member?

 

[DTK.L]

Only direction us Ike mains are going is up.

 

[Deleted member]

Tier list =/= Tournament results

They should definitely be taken into account, though. They are proof that players are able to do well with their character.

What was taken into account when making this list? MU ratios? A single good players performance of a character? Ugh...."Potential"?

 

[Scabe]

I like this tier list.

 

[typh]

They should definitely be taken into account, though. They are proof that players are able to do well with their character.

What was taken into account when making this list? MU ratios? A single good players performance of a character? Ugh...."Potential"?

i don't want this just to be answered (like i wanted to the last 2 pages), i want someone to answer it AND tell me how clearly it was stated in the original BBR voting thread for this tier list

 

[Steam]

pretty good list.

 

[Kewkky]

They should definitely be taken into account, though. They are proof that players are able to do well with their character.

What was taken into account when making this list? MU ratios? A single good players performance of a character? Ugh...."Potential"?

You know what's just as important as tourney results? Popularity. The more popular a character, the more people that use him in different ways, thus the more people learn how to get around his stuff and beat him, which brings us to his not-as-amazing-as-before tourney results. More people have played against Snakes, than Snakes have played against any other single character, excluding MK of course... That's how I saw it anyway.

 

[Raziek]

Good list, I agree with pretty much everything. No need for voicing complaints right now though.

 

[Dumbfire]

You know what's just as important as tourney results? Popularity. The more popular a character, the more people that use him in different ways,

I see were Bowsers failing now LOL.