should the wavedashing code be allowed in tournaments?

[HolyCrusader]

Did some of you guys read the topic....because people are starting to post completely irrelevant comments.

 

[Cerozero]

Yea but i dont wanna have to use a hack to play a game. Plus I would need the hack to properly practice too which would be annoying meaning I couldnt play competitive like for anything other than the tourney. Seriously if they changed all tournaments to this thing i would quit brawl and go play guilty gear.

You really don't get it. Your ignorance is without bounds. Brawl sucks its just that simple. No it is not good. You obviously don't know what true fun is. You are in a cage built around you by Sakurai's restrictive fighting system. The only way to unlock the cage is to want to try something different. No one else can do it for you. It is something you have to educate YOURSELF about.

 

[wazgood]

08 joiners only hate this because they don't want to learn how to wavedash. we finally found a way to clean up the **** sakurai dumped on our game and you guys start complaining.

 

[Amide]

People that can't put in the code would be at a huge disadvantage at tournaments.

 

[Dav657]

What everyone has to understand. Wave dashing and hitstun DO NOT FIT WITH BRAWL. Imagine MK with both wavedashing and hitstun. How broke is that. Image IC with WD and Hitstun, wavedashing completes their grab game and hitstun will allow for **** like dash attack into grab. Imagine Snake with WD and Hitstun. WD>Ftilt/Uptilt/Jab.

Am guessing you never heard of wobbling? I love how people say stuff and have no clue what they are talking about

 

[Sesshomuronay]

You really don't get it. Your ignorance is without bounds. Brawl sucks its just that simple. No it is not good. You obviously don't know what true fun is. You are in a cage built around you by Sakurai's restrictive fighting system. The only way to unlock the cage is to want to try something different. No one else can do it for you. It is something you have to educate YOURSELF about.

I dont really see how brawl sucks. All I see is a great game that is very fun to play. Why dont you unlock your cage.

 

[Jack Kieser]

Under no circumstances should the competitive community condone hacking games/systems for official play. If we don't have the ability to change it in game, we deal with it. Simple as that.

 

[Foshy]

If theres a hack that should be allowed in tournaments, it should be No tripping and maybe the code for saving any replay even if it's longer than 3 mins(which doesn't change the gameplay anyway)

 

[Fatalzyntax]

if you want to play melee then play melee, if you want to play brawl then play brawl
hacking something for tournaments? I dont even think that should be considered.

 

[metaXzero]

The person who made this should REALLY add to the title "as an alternate standard". It's obvious that hacks will never be THE standard, but this thread will continue getting such responses.

 

[MuBa]

Under no circumstances should the competitive community condone hacking games/systems for official play. If we don't have the ability to change it in game, we deal with it. Simple as that.

We do have the ability to change it though =/

It's a freaking hack. That's all. It's not a big fecking deal you guys. Having a Brawl game with Melee physics would be awesome. Everyone download the ****ed program and implement it. It's not rocket science!

 

[Revven]

We do have the ability to change it though =/

It's a freaking hack. That's all. It's not a big fecking deal you guys. Having a Brawl game with Melee physics would be awesome. Everyone download the ****ed program and implement it. It's not rocket science!

It's not even that hard to put onto your Wii, much less does it cost much (rent Twilight Princess, if you have it and have the SD Card and SD Card Reader, it's completely free!) The only ones who wouldn't have this installed are those "scared" about "bricking" their Wii, which can't even happen in the first place because you're not actually hacking the game, you're cheating (hacking is the act of making the code).

*Sigh*

 

[MuBa]

My thoughts exactly! =/

People needs to stop being such a pussbag and try this out. I personally believe that Brawl could become even more competitive than Melee itself.

 

[FunkMaster]

hey this looks too good i hope this becomes somewhat standard

so yes yes yes it should be done

because it will probably make metaknight better as well.

 

[Turbo Ether]

What everyone has to understand. Wave dashing and hitstun DO NOT FIT WITH BRAWL. Imagine MK with both wavedashing and hitstun. How broke is that. Image IC with WD and Hitstun, wavedashing completes their grab game and hitstun will allow for **** like dash attack into grab. Imagine Snake with WD and Hitstun. WD>Ftilt/Uptilt/Jab.

People that post this are idiots. Adding hitstun to the game doesn't mean adding hitstun to every single attack or character.

 

[King~]

Nope not even for a side tournament, at home around friends sure.

If you think brawl needs this or is a piss poor game obviously this is not the game for you and you need to either:

A) do what cinder did and break yours on youtube for the lulz

or

B) trade it in


If you feel brawl is beneath you why bother hacking it in the first place? when you can just as simply play stuff YOU ACTUALLY LIKE?

 

[FunkMaster]

metaknight isn't in melee you know

and he's the reason brawl is fun at all to me

besides fox somewhat

 

[Skyshroud]

Personally, although I respect those would would like to use new characters/updated movesets, I don't know if this should be allowed in official tournaments. I think it is perfectly acceptable for those who just want to play melee with different characters or for small scale tournaments, IMO. I would mind playing with either ruleset, but I'm of the opinion that the formats should coincide with the games.

I think it would be best for the community as a whole to stick to one official ruleset, regardless of which gets chosen. If you want to have wavedashing/other hacks tournaments, I'm cool with that, and if not, that's fine too. We need one official ruleset, so everyone knows what to practice for. The other rules should be perfectly acceptable to be used, but if the results count (as far as metagame analysis and such is concerned), there should be an agreed upon list.

Ultimately, I think the community is going to bend with whatever direction MLG goes. It seems as though they are just going to take Brawl for what it is, which I'm ok with.

 

[pockyD]

i didn't actually read this thread, but what's the point? wavedashing made very little sense to begin with. are people going to try to hack and bring back things like SHL, the extender, SWD, even JC shining?

 

[Jiangjunizzy]

you know what? we need another forum.

i'm tired of listening to these girlymen cry about this. im sorry, but brawl is just not fun. it's not fun to watch and its not fun to play. the reason being is that brawl is a p*****'s game; you are punished for going for the offensive. its all about who can outcamp the other player. the only character that transcends this problem is metaknight which is why he is so far above everyone else. you guys are 100% right that this shouldn't replace tournament play because guess what! brawl isn't meant to be played in a tournament anyway...there are no linking of attacks, no room for creativity with metaknight around and standard matches take WAY too long.. how can you expect a game like this to be taken seriously?

watching the matches with tripping and wave dashing on made the game sooo much more fun to watch and i bet even makes it that much more fun to play... imagine what increased hitstun would do and some a nice side order game balance.

and honestly; don't be a hypocrite. to those of you who hack tripping out of brawl... tripping IS brawl. stick to your guns. you're either for it or against it. you're either for hacking or not.

the way i see it is brawl is doomed to fail in the eyes of those who want to play a true, meaty competitive experience. who likes playing like a **** bag in a game? these hacks and their hackers are the saving grace that brawl needs and you guys are condemning them?? you guys should be praising the efforts of these guys, they are dedicated players that simply want the game to be fun again... granted we don't want "melee 2.0" (why people even bring this up is ****ing dumb in the first place..) we want a unique experience, these guys just need feedback on certain things, but thats besides the point.. you can continue playing brawl the way it is.

but for those of you who say "THERE IS NO WAY THIS CAN BE TOURNAMENT STANDARD".. why the hell not? Defense of the Ancients, which is a WC3 CUSTOM map (don't **** with me on semantics here alright because is essentially the same ****) is HUGE and i think even HUGER than the real WC3 game. maybe if we're lucky... hacked brawl will become the dota of nintendo's lolletsallbefriends party fighter (with tripping!).

so continue playing brawl in its current state. thats perfectly fine, but those of you who tell us to "go play melee", screw you. we HAVE played melee. and you know what? we're tired of it. sick of it. every orifice on my body begins to bleed at the sight of the cd for melee. brawl is prettier, flashier, and looks waaaay cooler. but it lacks the competitive edge. it lacks FUN.

thats why the hackers are here. the hackers are here to fix that. they are the medical team that has come to resuscitate the dying victim that is brawl.. and you guys are standing between them like hippies in front of nuclear power plants.. well, more like the sheltered individuals of rural midwestern america in the presence of an obama supporter.

so please. give us another forum. i'm sick of the nagging.

 

[Skyshroud]

i didn't actually read this thread, but what's the point? wavedashing made very little sense to begin with. are people going to try to hack and bring back things like SHL, the extender, SWD, even JC shining?

The point is it is a quick method of spacing and movement that opens up options for characters on the ground.

 

[Rapid_Assassin]

No. If you want to wavedash in tournament play Melee. This looks fun to screw around with a bit, just like items, non-legal stages, 1p mode in general... For a tournament standard, no.

 

[King~]

you know what? we need another forum.

i'm tired of listening to these girlymen cry about this. im sorry, but brawl is just not fun. it's not fun to watch and its not fun to play. the reason being is that brawl is a p*****'s game; you are punished for going for the offensive. its all about who can outcamp the other player. the only character that transcends this problem is metaknight which is why he is so far above everyone else. you guys are 100% right that this shouldn't replace tournament play because guess what! brawl isn't meant to be played in a tournament anyway...there are no linking of attacks, no room for creativity with metaknight around and standard matches take WAY too long.. how can you expect a game like this to be taken seriously?

watching the matches with tripping and wave dashing on made the game sooo much more fun to watch and i bet even makes it that much more fun to play... imagine what increased hitstun would do and some a nice side order game balance.

and honestly; don't be a hypocrite. to those of you who hack tripping out of brawl... tripping IS brawl. stick to your guns. you're either for it or against it. you're either for hacking or not.

the way i see it is brawl is doomed to fail in the eyes of those who want to play a true, meaty competitive experience. who likes playing like a **** bag in a game? these hacks and their hackers are the saving grace that brawl needs and you guys are condemning them?? you guys should be praising the efforts of these guys, they are dedicated players that simply want the game to be fun again... granted we don't want "melee 2.0" (why people even bring this up is ****ing dumb in the first place..) we want a unique experience, these guys just need feedback on certain things, but thats besides the point.. you can continue playing brawl the way it is.

but for those of you who say "THERE IS NO WAY THIS CAN BE TOURNAMENT STANDARD".. why the hell not? Defense of the Ancients, which is a WC3 CUSTOM map (don't **** with me on semantics here alright because is essentially the same ****) is HUGE and i think even HUGER than the real WC3 game. maybe if we're lucky... hacked brawl will become the dota of nintendo's lolletsallbefriends party fighter (with tripping!).

so continue playing brawl in its current state. thats perfectly fine, but those of you who tell us to "go play melee", screw you. we HAVE played melee. and you know what? we're tired of it. sick of it. every orifice on my body begins to bleed at the sight of the cd for melee. brawl is prettier, flashier, and looks waaaay cooler. but it lacks the competitive edge. it lacks FUN.

thats why the hackers are here. the hackers are here to fix that. they are the medical team that has come to resuscitate the dying victim that is brawl.. and you guys are standing between them like hippies in front of nuclear power plants.. well, more like the sheltered individuals of rural midwestern america in the presence of an obama supporter.

so please. give us another forum. i'm sick of the nagging.

lol im tired of sissyboys talking about how much they dislike brawl in the BRAWL FORUMS

Since your bored with melee and don't find brawl fun or competitve obviously smash is not for you go play SF or something

Any you say you don't want melee 2.0 but the things your suggesting hacking in are all from MELEE.

 

[S.B.Soldier]

yeah , it cannot be a standard, especially in regards to the MLG

 

[ytv]

It wouldn't happen this will cost too much time and energy for tourny host's to mange. If they wouldn't do heavy brawl why would they allow this?

 

[S.B.Soldier]

i doo wanna try it though. just for kix

 

[Chum]

Couldn't possible be a tournament standard. Deffintely something to have fun with though. I'm using the code once I soft mod my wii. There would also be no need for this to be a standard, if I had a choice between a hacked-brawl tournament and a melee one, I would still go to the melee one.

 

[S.B.Soldier]

yeah you can NEVER replace melee! that's just how it is

 

[FBM]

I personally won't touch Brawl without these codes on much less enjoy it. There is no point in defending this game as is. Tournaments should use this code to try to infuse some skill into this game. The fact remains that Sakurai took a dump in your mouth and people are still calling it ice cream.

Allow me to respond with an analogy:

You are saying "if that chick doesn't get a facelift, I won't **** her." So should she get that facelift for you? Should she get it for the betterment of mankind? Did you ever consider for a second that maybe other people have an opinion about that chick that is different from yours and actually would **** her anyway? Do they have lower standards? Maybe. Do they see something in her that you don't? Maybe not. But if you want to **** someone who looks a certain way, then go find someone who does rather than trying to change someone else into that person.

To people who say "Just play Melee."

The thing is, it's not that simple. Does Melee have the awesome new characters and stages that Brawl has? No. That's WHY we all bought Brawl. We wanted new stuff. With wavedashing/L-cancelling/hitstun/etc taken out of Brawl, it's kind of like trading those for the new stuff. With these codes, those who WANT it can have their cake and eat it too.

If you don't want to use wavedashing, don't. I personally love wavedashing around with Sonic, Lucas, and all the other characters. It makes the game more interesting and fun for me. If that somehow bothers you or infringes on your fun, then you might as well give it a try. If you're fully satisfied with the way Brawl is currently, then keep playing it. Leave the ones who want new things alone.

tl;dr - I like Brawl physics. I like new characters. I like wavedashing. I love cake.

Cool, then use it. Have fun with it. I agree that those who want it should enjoy it. If you want to have your own tournaments with it, be my guest. I may not come, but that is beside the point.

All of the kids with the 2008 joindates saying "just play Melee" only make themselves look stupid.

Fun is relative to what each individual conceives as enjoyable. GET OVER IT.

The wavedashing code does indeed help Brawl, but only very little. If two skilled players were playing the game, I could see wavedashing increasing the speed of the game, which is a plus. Wavedashing is caused by the directional airdodge. Because this airdodge is directional, you now fall helplessly after airdodging ONCE in the air, until you are hit, land on solid ground, or grab the edge. This removes a lot of defensive options from our very inTENTS Brawl metagame. Not being able to airdodge directly after being hit leaves room for people to actually do combos. Should you airdodge, you'll most likely be punished by any COMPETENT player.
This changes the game; but it's simply not enough. You'll need hitstun, mainly. Then icing the cake with things like (proper) dash dancing and Lcanceling.
Also, hitstun would be applied to moves separately, would be my guess. Which means Snake's ftilt would most likely be left alone, or modified to have a little less flinch/stun. Meta Knight's moves would also be worked accordingly. A hitstun hack would need extensive testing, clearly.

So, yes, I think the wavedashing/Melee airdodge code should be used in tournament. Which means the no-trip code should also be on.

And I already know of a place that's going to be using this hack in tournament; BUM said he'd use it for his weeklies/tournies.
Pwnt.

If this is all just about fun, then no, I don't care what you do. But as soon as you argue that it makes the game better on the whole AND THAT MAKING THE GAME BETTER IS SOMETHING INDIVIDUALS SHOULD DO AND THAT THEIR CREATION SHOULD BECOME THE STANDARD, then you show that you don't have to have an 08 join date to a tard.

Wanna know why?

Because once you mod one thing, the question arises: what if we change X too? And if you don't believe me, then why do you think this topic exists? People started with no-trip and it's moving forward. And frankly, if you change 2 things, you might as well change more.

Now the problem: who the **** says you are the authority on what should be changed? Who the **** says ANY one person CAN be the authority on this? What if some people prefer a little more hitstun? Or some people decide that certain characters should be rebalanced? If you make MK worse, why not make Falcon better? Then why not make Link better too? IT IS SELF PERPETUATING. If a balanced version of the game that is highly competitive and acceptable to competitive players everywhere comes out in a couple years' time, then I will happily play that. But until then, you have no right to impose your preferences on me (which is what this topic is about - if you want to have a special hack tourney, go right ahead, but don't say that should be the standard).

This all boils down to the problem that plagues this generation: you are so used to instant gratification that you think the world should conform to your dreams. Well, guess what, not everyone has the same dream and if we don't change it for everyone, then we change it for no one. Deal with it.

To be honest, this is a little reminiscent of homophobia. If you can't understand why people enjoy something, then don't partake. If you want to dabble, then maybe you explore the roots of those urges. And most of all, don't hate people for liking something you don't. Some people like things even if it gets them called "gay."

 

[HolyCrusader]

You really don't get it. Your ignorance is without bounds. Brawl sucks its just that simple. No it is not good. You obviously don't know what true fun is. You are in a cage built around you by Sakurai's restrictive fighting system. The only way to unlock the cage is to want to try something different. No one else can do it for you. It is something you have to educate YOURSELF about.

WTF who are you to tell what someone thinks is fun or not...
I bet when you lose in Brawl you throw hissy fits. For God's sake its a video game. Stop trying to find ways of tearing it apart bit by bit and throwing up ridiculous comments in the process. We need some Mods on this topic A.S.A.P

 

[S.B.Soldier]

although a good stereotypical generalization of why people who are opposed to this idea are "afraid" or "hackaphobes" , lets keep in mind that many new smashers just want a chance to get to a level, if you take away that fresh start, then whats the point? if all the old pros come back.. there is no point...you dont have to hack, or not hack.. but when it comes to mlg they will restrict it... its that simple... so when you host a tournament.. make the choice for yourself... but since heavy brawl wasnt allowed why should this be?

 

[FBM]

but for those of you who say "THERE IS NO WAY THIS CAN BE TOURNAMENT STANDARD".. why the hell not? Defense of the Ancients, which is a WC3 CUSTOM map (don't **** with me on semantics here alright because is essentially the same ****) is HUGE and i think even HUGER than the real WC3 game. maybe if we're lucky... hacked brawl will become the dota of nintendo's lolletsallbefriends party fighter (with tripping!).

Nice try with the analogy, but there are flaws:

1) DOTA is under someone's control. The community tries to contribute ideas, but in the end there is a small collective that actually implements the changes in the ways they see fit (and sometimes the changes suck and have to be reworked). There is no such thing with "hacked brawl." If the back room came together to mod the game, that might be different.

2) Warcraft and DOTA do not have the same relationship hacked Brawl and real Brawl do (and this is not semantics ACTUALLY). Hacked Brawl is more like the patches that Blizzard keep adding to the game which rebalance it. Now if only Sakurai could come to SWF, realize what is wrong, and fix his game...

Oh and oddly enough, DOTA is more like Brawl and Warcraft 3 is more like Melee. You may have to remember an ****load of stats and think 2 steps ahead of everyone else to be really good at DOTA, but executing of the game is relatively easy compared to high level Warcraft, where people have a Melee-like speed with their hands (I watched the WC3 season-end Grand Finals a couple years back and top level people make 250-300+ actions per minute in multi-minute battles).

 

[Jiangjunizzy]

heavy brawl wasn't allowed because it a mode included with the game that severely gimped some characters. how funny is that? further evidence that not enough time was taken to iron out the kinks in brawl's balance issue.

 

[S.B.Soldier]

ahh my head hurts, but everyone deserves to say their piece... keep in mind, this is opinionated for the time being

 

[SothE700k]

Know how there's always the complaints that people say such as, "That's not how the game was meant to be played"?
That's exactly our case here. In Melee, everything was there from the start and we were able to pick up the tools PROVIDED to us in-game. There was never ANY case of hacking in order to get l-canceling, hitstun, wavedashing, waveshining, or anything you can possibly imagine.

In this situation with Brawl on the other hand? Clearly HACKED, using a program, codes, and underhanded techniques in order to add something into the game. Which I believe hacks and gamesharks and such for examples were ways to play a game that was NOT meant to be done.
So if we're going to make Brawl competitive, NO WAY should we use the wavedashing hack for serious tournaments, PERIOD.

C'mon guys, we already have such messes on our hands like the MK ban issue and Melee vs. Brawl, do we HAVE to add one more major problem to the list?

 

[S.B.Soldier]

/\ post from above /\ well said. i agree with you fully

 

[Crizthakidd]

aside from the FUN aspect of it, things like no tripping and maybe even this make brawl.... BETTER.

u have to read a long *** article on what makes a good fighting game that. its not opinions either because you can have all the opinions u want and say SF turbo> any game but does it make it a better game in terms of chars., game design, abillities, glitches?

 

[metroid1117]

Absolutely not. It'd be similar to allowing Custom Stages at tournies in the sense that those who have the glitch/stage can practice with/on it and have an advantage.

 

[Andydark]

What was the policy with the no tripping code?

 

[Cerozero]

Brawl is not a good game nor is it a pretty girl or an awesome mustang. Some took your car/girl worked it over with a pipe and gave it back to you, or those who started with brawl sold you a dinged up car or fixed you up with a psychotic. You can still love it I'm not saying there is anything wrong with that, but don't act like it is the best thing ever or its like what it was before. You obviously never knewor you forgot. Don't try to say there isn't anything wrong just look at your old pictures together. Its just not the same.