Tomafia 3 - Game Over, Town wins!

[Rockin]

I better thing for me to say is that we shouldn't ex out someone who is useless. What if that useless person turns out to be a townie. or worse...a doc?

Then again...so far you helped little in the situation, Omis. While Ronike hasn't said out his reasons in a better form, there has been a lack of contribute coming from you. Stratford is the same. being inactive isn't that much of a real issue. If you're not contributing much as a plan of what to do, then you may be targeted.

I have yet to hear from Eor as well. I really would like to hear from him and see what he thinks.

 

[Stratford]

Ok first of all up until Omis' last post it seemed the consensus that with this number of people it would be a 2 man mafia, and his last argument was assuming that it's a 3 man mafia.

Next order of business, let's assume Omis is a townie, which I think we can safely say he'd like us to believe. As his last post suggested, at least 1 experienced townie, which he would be, should be enough to hold a town of inexperienced players together at least decently well to make smart decisions. If there is such a difference in skill between an experienced and an inexperienced player, the real threat to an experienced townie should be an experienced mafia, not some inexperienced unknown. The logical lynch vote for an experienced townie, if no other legitimate evidence surfaces, should be another experienced player. If that lynched experienced player turns out to be mafia, excellent. If not, the experienced townie hasn't screwed himself over, because it is now slightly more likely that the mafia is more inexperienced, which makes the game easier for an experienced townie.

I cannot understand Omis' vote for me as logical if he were indeed a townie.

Vote: Omis

 

[MexicanBJ]

Hey Omis, you best do something to prove your worth. You got 2 votes so far. Only 3 more till your eliminated. =/

um, if i'm counting correctly, Omis? currently has 4 votes?

 

[Ronike]

unvote: omis?

Not because I trust you quite yet, though you are doing better, but because I don't want you lynched just yet. I want to hear what others have to say yet.

 

[Rockin]

um, if i'm counting correctly, Omis? currently has 4 votes?

Omis HAD 3 votes (Ronike, Stratford, Mexican) and Omis? Himself voted for Stratford so far. Right now, Ronike has unvoted him, so the tally thus far

Omis? 2 (Stratford, MexicanBJ)
Stratford 1 (Omis?)

Omis? is the closest from getting his head chopped off. Something is best be done before the deadline pops up.

 

[Ronike]

Let us assume that there is a three member mafia and everyone else is town. Odds are that only one of the experienced players (going by the consensus that there are three) will be in the mafia. That leaves two for the town side. If we lynch an experienced townie on accident than we are left with a town experienced and an experienced. If that occurs than Mafia will IMO most likely night kill the remaining townie experienced player. This leaves them with the only experienced player and the whole town in a state of shock. We dont want that to happen.

See? This is much better! We actually get to hear what you think! However, there are a number of flaws in it, even though I agree with your overall point:

1) I think it is fairly safe to assume that there are only 2 mafia in this size of a game. If there were three, that would mean they control 1/3 of all votes, which is an overwhelming amount. It's far more likely to be 2. If it's not, we'll know it when we kill off two and we still get mafia kills. Despite what I was saying before, I DO think that it is probably that there is an experienced player in the mafia, but only because of probability.
2) There are 4 experienced players: Eor, Matunas, Marshy, and of course, yours truly. So if we lynch one, and get one night killed, we still have 1 townie experienced.

Considering Stratford is new, a good mafia tactic to him would be to lay low while I get accused. When he last checked in the debate over my loyalty was under heavy fire. Most townies would try to stay logged on to determine if I was town or not while the mafia could lay back. Overall Stratford is the best choice to lynch IMO.

You do make a good point here, so can you esplain to us why you left Stratford?

I better thing for me to say is that we shouldn't ex out someone who is useless. What if that useless person turns out to be a townie. or worse...a doc?

If they are the doc, then we will have three week nights, which I hate... And plus, what if we lynch someone useful and they are townie? Theres always a chance you are gonna strike townie in this game, you just have to accept the risk.

Then again...so far you helped little in the situation, Omis. While Ronike hasn't said out his reasons in a better form, there has been a lack of contribute coming from you. Stratford is the same. being inactive isn't that much of a real issue. If you're not contributing much as a plan of what to do, then you may be targeted.

LIES!!!!! It is a big issue, it allows the mafia to stay in the background, it increases our nights from what should be maybe 2 rl days to 3 rl weeks, It makes people forget about the mafia members so that they are practically immune, etc. It is a big issue

So anyways, I feel no need to flesh out my reasons, as Rockin practically did it for me.

Next order of business, let's assume Omis is a townie, which I think we can safely say he'd like us to believe. As his last post suggested, at least 1 experienced townie, which he would be, should be enough to hold a town of inexperienced players together at least decently well to make smart decisions. If there is such a difference in skill between an experienced and an inexperienced player, the real threat to an experienced townie should be an experienced mafia, not some inexperienced unknown. The logical lynch vote for an experienced townie, if no other legitimate evidence surfaces, should be another experienced player. If that lynched experienced player turns out to be mafia, excellent. If not, the experienced townie hasn't screwed himself over, because it is now slightly more likely that the mafia is more inexperienced, which makes the game easier for an experienced townie.

I cannot understand Omis' vote for me as logical if he were indeed a townie.

Vote: Omis

Hmm... a number of problems here...

A) This is omis?'s first game, he in't experienced.
B) If we lynch two experienced (the third WILL be night killed by then), how have we reduced the chance that the mafia has experience? If we do that, we are just taking our greatest assets and letting them swing. Or chow down in this case I guess...
C) DUDE! You should go into magic! You disappear, and then when you reappear, you give us no explanation and launch right into your next act as though you were never gone. Please explain why you left us.

I just want to clarify here as well, I'm not saying that we can never lynch an experienced townie, all I'm saying is that right now, when we are picking a random, it's not the best choice. Tomorrow when an experienced townie messes up, we should definetely vote on them. Heck, if they slip up today we should get them to eat some cake!

 

[Ronike]

Eor voted him too at the start. Also, we have no deadline yet, so chill man! Short day 1s benefit the mafia!

On another note, Ah... my first long post in a while... feels good.

 

[MexicanBJ]

I don't see how an experienced will MESS UP since ure pretty much the only experienced one that's even truly "active"

 

[Ronike]

Nah, the others are just having problems. Matunas has said that he can only get on at school, so thats his reason. Marshy prolly has school. I'm just lucky enough to be sick and have nothing else really to do...

 

[Rockin]

I don't see how an experienced will MESS UP since ure pretty much the only experienced one that's even truly "active"

Trust me, even a pro can make a few midstakes from time to time.

 

[Matunas]

I don't see how an experienced will MESS UP since ure pretty much the only experienced one that's even truly "active"

I'm trying here.

Ronike summed up pretty much what I was thinking over the last few posts. It felt like I had a lot to say and then I read your post..

It'd be nice if we could get Eor to post something seeing as he is the most inactive person thus far.

 

[Rockin]

It'd be nice if we could get Eor to post something seeing as he is the most inactive person thus far.

It's not like he seen the thread...>>

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=6008291#post6008291

If you check all the post he made in his profile, you can see he was posting in other areas.

I think he's ignoring the thread for some odd reason...>>

 

[Rockin]

Keep in mind he was posting yesterday at midnight

 

[DtJ Jungle]

I think being in active isn't as big as we are making it. Like we've said, some people just can't get to their computer as often as some other people, or they don't have the time to write epic rebuttals like Ronkike did to everyone elses posts.

I find Eor's presence, or lack of presence, odd because i know he's on a lot. he posted first and i'm pretty sure he had a joke vote but that's it. >_>, my suspicion is leading that way but I want to hear from him first.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

Most townies would try to stay logged on to determine if I was town or not while the mafia could lay back.

this is a really bad assumption to make since now especially that you've said it, mafia can now just be active and you wouldnt think they are the mafia...this is a very basic tactic of this game: most people assume the mafia lays back, so the mafia stays active in order to throw you off.

 

[Ronike]

Eor, why are you lurking? I saw you were on not 15 minutes ago and yet you aren't posting? Whats the dealio?

 

[DtJ Jungle]

oo he got scared LOLOLOL

*gets infraction from Eor*

 

[MexicanBJ]

hm yea, it's getting increasingly interesting that you guys are pretty much blatantly calling him out for purposely avoiding THIS thread, and yet.....still no reply??

 

[DtJ Jungle]

its that or he's just THAT apathetic and needs to be sub'd out.

 

[Matunas]

Well it has only been like 30 minutes since it was mentioned. Activity here has been pretty good overall, but sometime there are days in between posts if the game starts to drag.

I was hoping he would post so we can get some activity from everyone.

 

[Eor]

I'm lurking because if I post too much I get night killed, I find it better to post, then wait and watch what people do, then come back and reveal it. I also have a problem where if I argue with someone about something, even if I later find that they're suspicious I'll rule it out as being personal bias, even when it isn't. So I wait until i have something to post.

 

[Ronike]

Ok, its one thing to not post too much so as to avoid getting night killed and avoiding personal bias, I understand that. However, when you saw omis? vote count approaching terminal quantity, why didn't you just quick post unvoting him? That only takes two words, and you coulda just said something real quick. W/e, Im not quite sure I believe your reasoning, but we shall see I guess...

 

[Rockin]

Well, Eor has spoken. While I do question his lurkness (I would picture he'd be more willing to post), he has a fair amount of reason to do so. He could be a townie, or a personal ally...or a mafia. In anycase, let's back off him for now since we're not gonna get anything else from him

Let's see...

So far, we got two main suspects to lynch

Omis - Voice of reasoning seems meh in my opinon, but so far from your latest post, you shown some good info and words as well.

Stratford - I'm actually more warey of you then Omis. Despite his n00bness, Omis has shown how much he likes to contribute. However, you're a bit questionable. You havn't given us any useful information to contribute thus far. This also bothers me

Ok first of all up until Omis' last post it seemed the consensus that with this number of people it would be a 2 man mafia, and his last argument was assuming that it's a 3 man mafia.

Next order of business, let's assume Omis is a townie, which I think we can safely say he'd like us to believe. As his last post suggested, at least 1 experienced townie, which he would be, should be enough to hold a town of inexperienced players together at least decently well to make smart decisions. If there is such a difference in skill between an experienced and an inexperienced player, the real threat to an experienced townie should be an experienced mafia, not some inexperienced unknown. The logical lynch vote for an experienced townie, if no other legitimate evidence surfaces, should be another experienced player. If that lynched experienced player turns out to be mafia, excellent. If not, the experienced townie hasn't screwed himself over, because it is now slightly more likely that the mafia is more inexperienced, which makes the game easier for an experienced townie.

I cannot understand Omis' vote for me as logical if he were indeed a townie.

Vote: Omis

1) Omis ASSUMED it was a 3 man Mafia because it was his opinon. Ronike agreed with me that there could be two Mafias, but also feels there could be just one

2) What proof you have that he's as experianced as say...Medi and Evil Eye? Not saying you're really wrong, but you hold no weight to your arguement with this.

3) I saw no signs of actual egknowlegement in terms of our previous opions/topics/etc. on this issue except for the fact that Omis is possibly a Mafia.

Your arguement in general is as light as a feather. All words and no meaning. You're even talking about lynching out all the members. That's pretty bad. My original goal was to possibly lynch a experiance player of the group on the 1st day in hopes to move onto the second day, not only hoping we lynched a mafia on first day, but clues and hints on what to do. Keep in mind of something: Just because we have a inexperianced Mafia, doesn't mean it'll be cake walk. No matter what, a Mafia of any level can screw us off.

With that, I'll cast my vote

Vote: Stratford

 

[Ronike]

Not sure what you meant in #1... I think there are 2 mafia members, not two separate mafias (I don't think thats what you meant, but Ima make sure). Its possible there are three, though doubtful. There isn't only one. No way. There might be two mafia members and an independent, but I strongly doubt there is just the one mafia. Never said that ever.

Im still gonna old off on a vote for now.

 

[#HBC | marshy]

2) What proof you have that he's as experianced as say...Medi and Evil Eye? Not saying you're really wrong, but you hold no weight to your arguement with this.

What good would answering that question do? EE's only played one mafia game anyway. Stratford was wrong in saying that omis? played these games before, and that's obvious. Asking him that just seems like you're trying to set him up.

B) If we lynch two experienced (the third WILL be night killed by then), how have we reduced the chance that the mafia has experience? If we do that, we are just taking our greatest assets and letting them swing.

He never claimed that it would. He said that a seasoned townie would want to vote another experienced player so they could catch mafia easier, as the remaining players would be more likely to mess up.

Also you're assuming that somebody wouldn't want to vote out certain players because they're "our greatest assets", but not everybody thinks like that. I haven't been reading the thread looking at members and thinking "Nope, can't vote him because he's played before" like others seem to.

 

[Rockin]

When did he say that?

I thought I filled in 'experianced members,' but I guess I didn't, so I'm sorry about that. As far as mentioning EE and Medi, I was just naming examples of those who could be experianced. And sorry about the question. I was just mainly asking him, since he seemed so sure in his statement against Omis.

Ronike - In the quote there, Stratford said that Omis said that there was possibly 3 mafias, when I was just clearing up that in Omis' opinon, that he feels there's 3 mafias.

I don't feel I'm like that when I vote, Marshy. I just mainly wanted to target the more experiance player IN GENERAL so as to possibly weaken the mafia. In day two, whether the lynch of the first day was a mafia or a townie, we'll at least have something to work on next, depending on the outcome of the night kill and the reaction.

 

[Ronike]

Agh, thats not actually what I am thinking, I just keep getting so enthused with my writing against lynching an experienced player beacuse there is prolly one in the mafia that that is how it came out. Thats honestly not what I'm thinking at all.

However, if it does come down to a random vote, I don't think the random should be an experienced player unless there is good reason for it.

I still dont see the merits of wanting to vote off a second experienced player. I think I might be reading these statements wrong...

 

[Omis]

Agh, thats not actually what I am thinking, I just keep getting so enthused with my writing against lynching an experienced player beacuse there is prolly one in the mafia that that is how it came out. Thats honestly not what I'm thinking at all.

However, if it does come down to a random vote, I don't think the random should be an experienced player unless there is good reason for it.

I still dont see the merits of wanting to vote off a second experienced player. I think I might be reading these statements wrong...

I believe they are under the vein of thought that one good town can keep the whole town together. IMO one person cant keep everyone safe.

 

[MexicanBJ]

I still dont see the merits of wanting to vote off a second experienced player. I think I might be reading these statements wrong...

wait what???

what do you mean SECOND experienced player.....

 

[DtJ Jungle]

Who wanted to vote a second experienced player off?

 

[#HBC | marshy]

In day two, whether the lynch of the first day was a mafia or a townie, we'll at least have something to work on next, depending on the outcome of the night kill and the reaction.

Because the player was involved in games before?

We'll have something to go on when Day 2 comes depending on the lynched players' posts in this game, not if they played in earlier mafias.

 

[Rockin]

Because the player was involved in games before?

We'll have something to go on when Day 2 comes depending on the lynched players' posts in this game, not if they played in earlier mafias.

That's what I mean. I put down experianced player in term to who to lynch off first IMO, or someone suspicious.

I'm sorry if I'm hard to understand ><;;

 

[DtJ Jungle]

Do we even have anyone really to suspect? From what it sounds like...Stratford MAYBE...but even thats sort of a stretch.

 

[MexicanBJ]

yea im not really gonna lie......i feel like we've gotten almost nowhere, im not convinced on stratford at all....

going off purely "hunch" im still "omis?" but to be honest, i can't back that up very well..

 

[DtJ Jungle]

I just don't feel justified enough to vote on anyone yet, everything is a hunch. It just seems to rash to say anything yet.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

Like even despite how illogical i find some of omni?'s arguments, I still don't think we have shit to vote on yet.

 

[Tom]

Vote Count [5/9 to lynch]
Omis (3): Eor, MexicanBJ, Stratford,
Stratford (2): Omis, Rockin

 

[Matunas]

Like even despite how illogical i find some of omni?'s arguments, I still don't think we have shit to vote on yet.

That's why I was hoping to come to some sort of group decision. Day one is never really based off of anything.

At this point it seems that it is between Stratford and omis?. If anyone else has any ideas throw them out there. After work I'm going to check back in and probably figure out who I want to vote for.

 

[#HBC | marshy]

Omis? is voting Stratford because he hasn't posted much, and while players often don't post much on Day 1 due to apathy, boring roles, and a bad schedule, he chooses to vote Strat because he might be waiting for us to lynch omis? or whatever. Maybe he's the cop, but it's strange that he'd be confident enough in his own idea that he'd vote Stratford for it. Really, it just seems like going after an easy target and throwing him under the bus so he isn't as pressured.

I still stand by this and think he's the most suspicious.

Vote: Omis?

 

[Omis]

I still stand by this and think he's the most suspicious.

Vote: Omis?

Assuming Strat is mafia there would be no reason for him to post. With me almost on the edge of being lynched, waiting would be one of the safest options. On day 2 it would be harder to vote for some whom has never been in the spotlight IMO. This is IMO what Stratford is probably aiming for. In addition, Stratford he never really given a defending post of himself. Instead he does the childish thing and votes for the person who accused him.

Could I hear why people think Im suspicious? All I did was bandwagon with jungle and make a few "n00by" posts.

Also what is up with Eor being totally inactive? I know he said that he doesnt want prejudices against him to form, but as I teeter on being lynched why hasnt he recalled his vote for me? That is assuming it was a joke vote, however. If it was a real vote, is what I said really that suspicious? That was a pretty hasty decision considering what he has allowed it to grow into.