Brawl 64 - Don't Get Hit

[Grim Tuesday]

Um, you guys are all wrong.... Have you even played 64 recently? lol. I know you can definitely meteor cancel moves. Moves like falcon's dair I know for sure.

You can't meteor cancel any moves.

Whatever, I'll test myself what can be meteor cancelled.

Undoubtedly the window is different.

You can't meteor cancel any moves.

 

[Lightosia]

Geez, that big CANCELLED in the title made me think that the project was actually cancelled.

 

[Fireblaster]

Whatever, I'll test myself what can be meteor cancelled.

Undoubtedly the window is different.

In case you didn't see my post. I'll make it nice and clear.

THERE IS NO METEOR CANCELLING IN 64

 

[standardtoaster]

No Meteor Canceling [Standardtoaster]
04FB3EAC 00020000

/discussion

 

[kenshen]

nice code standard toaster

 

[Supreme Dirt]

And there we go.

And yeah, I somehow managed to miss Fireblaster's post. Really need some sleep, haven't slept since Friday morning.

 

[kenshen]

And there we go.

And yeah, I somehow managed to miss Fireblaster's post. Really need some sleep, haven't slept since Friday morning.

=O wow dude

 

[Z'zgashi]

Dont get rid of yoshi's egg lay, get rid of egg roll if you have to.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Obviously. Egg Roll is terrible.

 

[Z'zgashi]

Egg lay is a staple and signature move of yoshi's. In fact, egg roll is the only special move of his that isn't true to his game, he has egg lay, egg throw, and yoshi bomb in the yoshi games, but not egg roll.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

You do realize that we all agree with you and no one has even once considered removing egg lay, right?

 

[kenshen]

seriously fix Yoshi up b so awkward

 

[magikoopa]

Egg lay is a staple and signature move of yoshi's. In fact, egg roll is the only special move of his that isn't true to his game, he has egg lay, egg throw, and yoshi bomb in the yoshi games, but not egg roll.

Egg roll is a reference to the effects of eating a 'Power Tulip' in Yoshi's Story.

edit: not saying it should stay in though.

 

[Rhubarbo]

I've compiled some suggestions about which characters should have their special moves rearranged since Supreme Dirt has insisted on removing side specials:

Link: Boomerang definitely reclaims its neutral special position. As an additional suggestion, how about removing the gale effect and changing the texture of the boomerang to match his 64's version of the weapon.

Game and Watch: Remove sausages, and replace them with his side special. His side special is undoubtedly more useful.

Zelda: Two potential changes can be made to Zelda. Her transformation ability can be removed, or re-mapped to a taunt, and Nayru's Love could become her down special while Din's Fire can become her neutral special. If Supreme Dirt doesn't want to use this option, I recommend removing Nayru's love in favor of Din's Fire as it is a more important part of Zelda's game.

Pokemon Trainer: This one is awfully tricky. I believe Pokemon Trainer would be severely gimped if his Pokemon's side specials were removed, and he kept Pokemon Change. So I propose that Pokemon Trainer is scrapped entirely, and the three Pokemon are given individual spots on the character select screen. Squirtle's watergun would become his down special, Ivysaur's Razor Leaf would become his neutral special and his Bullet Seed would become his down special, finally Charizard's Rock Smash would become his down special.

Peach: I believe we should open this one up for debate. I don't believe there's a clear cut answer for wheater Toad or Peach Bomb is more useful.

Ice Climbers: I'm no expert on the Ice Climbers. I would recommend swapping their neutral special with their side special for recovery purposes, but again, I'm no expert. Perhaps cutting their down special is in order?

King Dedede: Dedede's mech-hammer is generally considered to be his least useful special, so I recommend swapping it with Inhale and making Waddle Dee Toss his neutral special.

Ness/Lucas: PK Fire takes the position of both PK Flash and PK Freeze respectively.

Toon Link: To differentiate him from adult Link, I recommend keeping the bow and arrow as his neutral special.

Olimar: Re-arrange would have to be lost for his game to work. So Pikming Pluck would become his down special and Pikmin toss would be his neutral special.

Jigglypuff: Rollout should be swapped with Pound.

Let's get some character talk going here!

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Ice Climbers: I'm no expert on the Ice Climbers. I would recommend swapping their neutral special with their side special for recovery purposes, but again, I'm no expert. Perhaps cutting their down special is in order?

NO.

Ice Block is more important than Squall Hammer, and Blizzard is VERY important. I'd recommend buffing their recovery some-how though to make up for the loss of Squall.

King Dedede: Dedede's mech-hammer is generally considered to be his least useful special, so I recommend swapping it with Inhale and making Waddle Dee Toss his neutral special.

Waddle Dee Toss would make more sense as his down special than the other way round.

Ness/Lucas: PK Fire takes the position of both PK Flash and PK Freeze respectively.

Or you could do what PM has done and give Lucas's PK Fire an ice effect and call it PK Freeze.

 

[kenshen]

Toon Link: To differentiate him from adult Link, I recommend keeping the bow and arrow as his neutral special. !

this that is all

 

[Rhubarbo]

NO.

Ice Block is more important than Squall Hammer, and Blizzard is VERY important. I'd recommend buffing their recovery some-how though to make up for the loss of Squall.



Waddle Dee Toss would make more sense as his down special than the other way round.



Or you could do what PM has done and give Lucas's PK Fire an ice effect and call it PK Freeze.

Great suggestions. If this project does take advantage of PM (I'm not sure if it does), a PK Fire/Freeze hybrid would be great!

 

[King Funk]

How about you guys first remake the 12 original characters perfectly?

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I am, actually. I'm going character by character and perfecting their physics right now. Still on Mario because I've been swamped with schoolwork.

As to Popo and Nana, suffice it to say they will have a very different playstyle from Melee or Brawl, and will feel like 64 characters.

Also, I'm pretty sure I've mentioned before that Toon Link would keep his bow and arrow.

I have a list somewhere of what I'm planning to do with specials and movesets in general, stay tuned once I've got the original 12 ready. I'm actually considering releasing a Beta once the original 12 are done.

 

[kenshen]

I'm actually considering releasing a Beta once the original 12 are done.

OMG

 

[PeachEater74]

Normally I'd be super excited for a project like this, that I've been DREAMING of (in my sleep), but it worrys me that the creator of dBrawl is the project leader. Not to mention you'll probably have to cover even more issues than the P:M team.

Once there's some progress made and whatnot, I'll be moderately excited. Godspeed to you sir, who are attempting the unpossible.

"Dash-Dancing - I personally find Brawl "dash-dancing" to be silly and thus proper dash-dancing will be implemented."

Oh, and when you make the original SSB64 characters, I'd recommend keeping them at their original forms and making no changes until AFTER the first beta you mentioned is released, this way people can see if it actually feels like the original easier.

Also, when you say "proper dash dancing", you do mean 64's timing window, right?

 

[kenshen]

Normally I'd be super excited for a project like this, that I've been DREAMING of (in my sleep), but it worrys me that the creator of dBrawl is the project leader. Not to mention you'll probably have to cover even more issues than the P:M team.

Once there's some progress made and whatnot, I'll be moderately excited. Godspeed to you sir, who are attempting the unpossible.

"Dash-Dancing - I personally find Brawl "dash-dancing" to be silly and thus proper dash-dancing will be implemented."

Oh, and when you make the original SSB64 characters, I'd recommend keeping them at their original forms and making no changes until AFTER the first beta you mentioned is released, this way people can see if it actually feels like the original easier.

Also, when you say "proper dash dancing", you do mean 64's timing window, right?

this is dash dancing http://super-smash-bros.wikia.com/wiki/Dash-dancing

 

[Lorenzo The Comic]

Eh, I wouldn't rely on Wiki's if I were you.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Sometimes I feel like no one can read.

Supreme Dirt said he would have proper dash-dancing, not Brawl dash-dancing. Which means it will have the same timing as 64 dash-dancing.

Kenshen, Peach Eater didn't ask what dash dancing is.

 

[kenshen]

oh sry tired

 

[Lorenzo The Comic]

Though I have to admit the information's accurate anyways, after observing that article.

 

[kenshen]

so whats being done with snake wont he be alot heavier ???

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Why would Snake ever be heavier? His weight will decrease accordingly with the fact he no longer carries a Nikita.

 

[Tommy_G]

Snake should be a bit floatier or have his short hop go higher, preferably the latter. Anyone who plays Smash 64 knows short first jump+powerful aerials+lots of hitstun+no landing lag=a bit too good.

I know this doesn't relate to weight since Samus is heavy and floaty and Fox is light and falls fast(no relation between the two,) but just thought it should be brought up.

 

[KingClubber]

How far have you even gotten on this project? After some animation work for the original characters, and some slight changes to the fighter pac files you could have this done quickly.

I've already done a SSB64 Link fighter pac, and the only problems i came across was the up throw, down throw, and the catch attack, that only took me 1 hour. The only thing i haven't done is the taunt cancel which i didn't see the point of doing at the time, or added the L-cancel which i have already made myself for PSA and im waiting for the animations for him.

Don't believe me - http://www.mediafire.com/?22mx9o4jtlimi8r

 

[Supreme Dirt]

It's nowhere near as easy as you think it is. I'm matching fall, walking, etc. speeds EXACTLY to 64. This takes a lot of work, a lot of testing, and quite a lot of time.

Taunt canceling is a code.

Also, I'd be matching knockback to 64 as well. As nobody has ever ripped the knockback values from 64, this is again trial and error.

It's NOT as simple as you're making it out to be. You also have to factor in that my entire life does not revolve around this project. I have school. I am trying to get into college.

Note that, as well, some of the more trash characters - I'm looking at you Samus - will be getting buffs, and that there are 25 new characters who need movesets.

If you'd like to apply to be on the team, either send me a PM or catch me on Skype. Don't post in the thread talking about stuff you don't know.

 

[Dragoon Fighter]

Just curious you are not going to modify the grabs right? If so then good, and this project looks good over all. Thumbs up.

 

[King Funk]

It's nowhere near as easy as you think it is. I'm matching fall, walking, etc. speeds EXACTLY to 64. This takes a lot of work, a lot of testing, and quite a lot of time.

Taunt canceling is a code.

Also, I'd be matching knockback to 64 as well. As nobody has ever ripped the knockback values from 64, this is again trial and error.

It's NOT as simple as you're making it out to be. You also have to factor in that my entire life does not revolve around this project. I have school. I am trying to get into college.

Note that, as well, some of the more trash characters - I'm looking at you Samus - will be getting buffs, and that there are 25 new characters who need movesets.

If you'd like to apply to be on the team, either send me a PM or catch me on Skype. Don't post in the thread talking about stuff you don't know.

Sorry but Samus is not trash and no one is in Smash 64. It's a pretty balanced game and I hope you'll leave the original characters exactly as they are.

 

[GP&B]

At the very least, Samus and Link's Up B's can be made less awful. Beyond that, I only feel that Samus' air game could be slightly improved (Uair and Fair at least; Bair, Dair, and Nair are all great). Just by observing what players like Isai can do with Link, the cast is indeed quite balanced. His recovery just doesn't need to be that bad though.

 

[King Funk]

At the very least, Samus and Link's Up B's can be made less awful. Beyond that, I only feel that Samus' air game could be slightly improved (Uair and Fair at least; Bair, Dair, and Nair are all great). Just by observing what players like Isai can do with Link, the cast is indeed quite balanced. His recovery just doesn't need to be that bad though.

Uair and Fair are fine. Samus's up-b is not that bad. I think that if you're gonna give buffs to Samus it should only be her damage/knockback on specific moves, and maybe slightly faster ground speed.

As for Link, yeah his recovery could get a little more distance indeed. The rest is absolutely fine and he is a solid character.

 

[Tommy_G]

Uair and Fair are fine. Samus's up-b is not that bad. I think that if you're gonna give buffs to Samus it should only be her damage/knockback on specific moves, and maybe slightly faster ground speed.

As for Link, yeah his recovery could get a little more distance indeed. The rest is absolutely fine and he is a solid character.

It'd be nice if Uair and Fair had less aerial ending lag (not landing) To combo with those moves, you MUST land with them(or Brawl combo them.) I'm sick of seeing Pikachu's doing fair->uair and Samus not having something like that, granted Pikachu's is DIable.

Also, Samus' UpB is the only UpB that can grab the ledge from low enough on the ledge to sweetspot(Samus is the only character than can sweetspot the ledge)

If you make it so Samus can double jump after downBing, that would fix the recovery problem.

I'd absolutely love if you make it harder to di out of Samus' UpB. That would fix a lot of problems.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I didn't mean major buffs, King Funk, it's just not losing double jump after down-B, minor, minor things like that.

 

[King Funk]

Yeah sure.

When you buff one of the 12 original characters you have to make sure he can still do all the stuff he could do before. A little more knockback can ruin what was before a guaranteed combo for example. But I'm sure you know that so I'll stop annoying you. =p

 

[Fireblaster]

Yeah sure.

When you buff one of the 12 original characters you have to make sure he can still do all the stuff he could do before. A little more knockback can ruin what was before a guaranteed combo for example. But I'm sure you know that so I'll stop annoying you. =p

I'm pretty sure adding more stun to samus's Uair won't hurt. IIRC it gave frame advantage to the one getting hit in SSB64.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Can't edit individual hitstun on moves. I will however make it framesafe.