Captain Falcon's Match-Up Database! | (General Discussion); UPDATED: April 18th, 2010

[Zeallyx]

It's really simple, really.

But i'm not explaining what to do in that match-up till it's that time to do so.

I'm telling you, you are wrong.
But let's end here as we both won't go in depth yet.

 

[phi1ny3]

Ksizzle/Zucco must have sandbagged big time or didn't know how to do the MU at all lol.

 

[Zeallyx]

Ksizzle/Zucco must have sandbagged big time or didn't know how to do the MU at all lol.

This^

Also, Salem, you are aware that mindgames/mindgame potential can not be used in favor of any character in matchup discussion, right? (Not talking down to you, I just want to get to the bottom of this.)

 

[phi1ny3]

Me too, spill the beans pl0x, or tell via PM.

 

[Sovereign]

This^

Also, Salem, you are aware that mindgames/mindgame potential can not be used in favor of any character in matchup discussion, right? (Not talking down to you, I just want to get to the bottom of this.)

Get on the wi-fi now. We have an appointment.

 

[Zeallyx]

Get on the wi-fi now. We have an appointment.

alright.

ill be right there.

i still have to add you though.

Just host, ill join asap.

 

[Salem]

This^

Also, Salem, you are aware that mindgames/mindgame potential can not be used in favor of any character in matchup discussion, right? (Not talking down to you, I just want to get to the bottom of this.)

Mindgames are used to trick the human, not the character match-up itself since thats always perfect.

I rarely use it anyway so why should it be used?

And i'm still not discussing the match-up till Darky-Sama brings it to that point where we are actually suppose to discuss that in this thread.

From what I see we are still on the ZSS # ratio.

*Waits for next Match-Up while continueing to ignore everybody about the Lucario vs Falcon match-up*

 

[phi1ny3]

We had the C. Falcon discussion on our boards recently, although I don't entirely agree with the ratio we put it at, when the time comes when I make the export for it, would you reply there Salem?

 

[Salem]

We had the C. Falcon discussion on our boards recently, although I don't entirely agree with the ratio we put it at, when the time comes when I make the export for it, would you reply there Salem?

Maybe.

That's if I don't forget. lol

 

[Snakeee]

Both 35:65 and 40:60 seem accurate.

35:65 if the Falcon doesn't bait and punish.
40:60 if the Falcon does bait and punish.

Judging that the Falcon plays the match-up defensively, I'd say 40:60 is reasonable.

But I'm the one that baits and punishes o_O

 

[Salem]

But I'm the one that baits and punishes o_O

lol

Then what happens?

Both waiting to bait and punish sounds gay. ROFL

 

[Darky-Sama]

Well, that's when Falcon goes in for a grab, or the ZSS starts trying to use her Neutral+B or something ranged. No character just sits around and waits all day to punish.

(Though it we did, it would revolutionize our metagame! C: )

 

[Acedude55]

SPEED GUYS SPEED

Bait & Punish

BUT AT THE SAME TIME GET IN THAT *****'S FACE AT THE BLINK OF AN EYE o_o

SNAKEEE IMA CALLIN YOUU OUT SON PLAY ME OFFLINE
(will get ***** tho, and is only being a silly muffin)
would still like to play that ZSS tho

Edit: Who ITT knows about u-air?
no one
nada
zip
up-air

 

[Zeallyx]

SPEED GUYS SPEED

Bait & Punish

BUT AT THE SAME TIME GET IN THAT *****'S FACE AT THE BLINK OF AN EYE o_o

SNAKEEE IMA CALLIN YOUU OUT SON PLAY ME OFFLINE
(will get ***** tho, and is only being a silly muffin)
would still like to play that ZSS tho

Edit: Who ITT knows about u-air?
no one
nada
zip
up-air

Please dude, stop your daily rant about this sort of thing.
This is known, and is probably the best way to play falcon.

But falcon still sucks, as some characters movesets keep them for getting bait'd, and some players just know the matchup against falcon and completely shut him down (If their character lets them, which is, approx. 85 to 90% of the brawl cast.)

Also, what snakeee says, if the opponent does the same, which I implied with bringing up character specific movesets/metagames and different players, falcon is ****ed.

 

[Acedude55]

Nahnah see, only guys that have yet to understand say that.

 

[Darky-Sama]

There's little Zero Suit Samus can do to a Falcon approaching her and pulling up a shield, only to punish what she does with either a grab or something else if her punishing attack has a long cool down time. If she doesn't punish, then Falcon can still grab her. I mean, it's not that hard.

Of course, that isn't discussing the metagame, that's discussing a simple question.

Question: "WHAT DO I DO IF SHE TRIES TO BAIT AND PUNISH ME INSTEAD?"
Answer: "You mind game the **** out of her."

 

[lordhelmet]

You want to just call it 60-40 and move on?

I'd like to discuss Snake =3

 

[Player-3]

ace i know abotu dat up air

 

[†Slader7†]

Well this match up seems almost complete except for one thing. . . . . . . a summary

and maybe also a pic

 

[Darky-Sama]

Which I'll be adding tomorrow.

40:60 sounds about right, I'm guessing. Unless there's a bunch of objections by tomorrow morning, that's what I'll put along with the summary and information.

Who are we discussing next?
Snake?

 

[Zeallyx]

Who are we discussing next?

Talking for me and Ph1ny:

ZSS

 

[Player-3]

Knee we just discussed zss silly

If we do snake i have oodles of xp but im apparently bad at matchup discussions

 

[phi1ny3]

Continue on your normal schedule, I'll probably either rediscuss C. Falcon on our MU thread or make an export tonight to have Salem debate why it's 50:50.

 

[Darky-Sama]

So, the votes are between Snake and Lucario.

Personally, since the Lucario Boards are going to be doing their export (or re-discussion), we could help them out with that and just forward the discussion over here in the end, just with a few alterations and a MINOR discussion on it for the time being.

Snake would be our best bet. We could cover more ground doing it that way, since this board is lacking highly in match-ups. Snake is something many people deserve to know the match-up for, even if it is Falcon.

 

[Zeallyx]

Talking for me and Ph1ny:

ZSS

I meant Lucario 0.o

My bad.

 

[Darky-Sama]

There was a slight change in my schedule. I'll be busy this weekend. As soon as I get back, I'll update the OP. If you guys want to continue the discussion on Zero Suit Samus a bit further, go ahead. I'll alert either the Snake or Lucario boards once I get back (whatever we decide on).

 

[Salem]

*Wants Votes to do the Snake Match-Up*

It's more interesting, cause it all depends on Snake himself. o_o

 

[Ray_Kalm]

How about a character you actually have an advantage on? Ganon?

 

[phi1ny3]

CF vs. Lucario export is up.
It's kind of lacking though imo, the discussion seemed more on how much we **** ganon (although now that I think about that, that's a very disturbing image)
...
I think I'm scarred for life.

 

[lordhelmet]

I'd rather work our way down the tier list rather than flipping a coin on it

We did Meta a month or so ago, now let's do Snake

 

[teluoborg]

Whatever, Snake should be almost as quick as MK to discuss so let's do this and follow up with Lucario.

 

[SuSa]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=251001

That thread is basically for you guys.

Also me and Knee basically did the Snake matchup elsewhere.

 

[phi1ny3]

I actually have this "50:50" thing flattened out a bit, (I'm writing it out as we speak, now that I'm back from work) I think we should actually wait on lucario a bit more, unless you guys really want to do it after snake.

Edit: Gah! Where's your aerial frame data? SuSa got lazeh, and I want to know the frame data for nair/uair.

 

[Salem]

I actually have this "50:50" thing flattened out a bit, (I'm writing it out as we speak, now that I'm back from work) I think we should actually wait on lucario a bit more, unless you guys really want to do it after snake.

Edit: Gah! Where's your aerial frame data? SuSa got lazeh, and I want to know the frame data for nair/uair.

I want to go to Snake first.

Cause thats possibly another 50-50, cause Falcon can force Snake offstage.

But i'll have to go into more details for that one.

 

[Player-3]

salem.

i love you so much you do what i would except people actually feel like arguing with you isntead of dismissing you as a troll
<3333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333

@phil i have no idea honestly.
lol all i need to know is that jab is 3 frames
;3 mindgames

 

[phi1ny3]

I was told that SuSa was a lazy bum and left you guys hanging.
Well, truth to be told, I myself could help get more of that frame data made for C. Falcon, although it will be limited.
I have Project Smash attacks, so I could just crank some Captain Falcon numbers out, although I won't be able to find fancy things like shield advantage or anything like that.

 

[Salem]

I was told that SuSa was a lazy bum and left you guys hanging.
Well, truth to be told, I myself could help get more of that frame data made for C. Falcon, although it will be limited.
I have Project Smash attacks, so I could just crank some Captain Falcon numbers out, although I won't be able to find fancy things like shield advantage or anything like that.

We just need some more information.
any would help Falcon right now.

 

[phi1ny3]

Should I add it to the social thread?
On topic: make sure you bait snake's 2nd ftilt hit, but be careful in the air for his first jab.

 

[Salem]

Should I add it to the social thread?
On topic: make sure you bait snake's 2nd ftilt hit, but be careful in the air for his first jab.

Yes.

And Snake's jab is annoying, you'll basicly go into a clash fight no matter what you do unless you actually land an air attack on him.

 

[lordhelmet]

Snake is definantly not 50:50! But I do think he's easier than generally considered on this board.

Snake's whole moveset probably go through our highest priority attack, so we really have to be careful in this matchup.

I think you can FF Uair him out of his jab with correct spacing... I'd need to do some testing though