my guess for top tiers

[Ryo242]

You mentioned Ike, but forgot Snake. And Pikachu, because he got a huge buff..
Marth is still really really good, and I agree for Olimar. Haven't played Toon Link, and Pit is the new Shiek (Aka, for noobs).
Yes, I'm for Ike as Top Tier. And PT (Not the Pokemon, just PT)

 

[BentoBox]

I agree with most of his guesses, actually. I also know Ike will be a lot better than people are assuming.

People with the mentality that tiers don't exist are just being silly, though I disagree with people who dismiss it as being decided only by tournament results. It is more a matter of match ups than it is a matter of tourney results.

Games with no real tournament scene can have tier lists.

Yes and as of now, actual matchups haven't been documented enough to come up with anything substantial.

 

[joepinion]

I agree with most of his guesses, actually. I also know Ike will be a lot better than people are assuming.

People with the mentality that tiers don't exist are just being silly, though I disagree with people who dismiss it as being decided only by tournament results. It is more a matter of match ups than it is a matter of tourney results.

Games with no real tournament scene can have tier lists.

The reason I think tournament results reflect tiers best is that the competition is fierce enough and big enough and worth enough that the most effective techniques and plays are forced out (it's like a video game natural selection time machine). So as far as being a matter of "match ups" I'd say the tournaments are the best way to determine those matchups, and games without a competitive scene rarely have that kind of natural selection and evolution that brings the best play to the surface.

Of course Mew2King cautioned in the very first post that this post is meaningless, so there is no harm in speculation.

 

[Mama]

I think if anything we'll have less completely useless characters. But saying most characters will be high or top tier is just stupid. And another misconception idiots seem to have is pros determine their mains based solely on the tier list. Thats not true. Good players pick characters they like and can win with with. They take the tiers into consideration and make an educated choice. There are people who choose their characters based solely tiers. But not just high tier characters. The people who want to be "noble" or different pick low tier crappy characters and thats not unique at all.

 

[AlphaDragoon2002]

Also guys, Ike is good, if you think otherwise you need to play Azen online. I'm not telling his FC cuz I don't think he wants to give it out, but if you can find another way to play him online and get destoryed then please try it.

This makes me smile.

 

[SynikaL]

I agree with everything M2k says about Marth -- he's so gay in this game, I dropped him.

And I mained him Melee.

He does get easily camped, though -- Snake is a *****. His Dash Attack hits within like, 10 frames and has a disjointed hitbox the size of Texas.

I think Fox should be on that list. He's pretty much the same right now, without the Waveshine stuff.


I really think the projectile and flying characters are going to be the real nuisances later, though. Tha game play changes seem to support campy styles at this point.


-Syn

 

[-Aether]

Obviously, this is not a "Set in stone" tier list that M2K has provided us. All it does is provide us some speculation.

Obviously Olimar / Marth / Ike have disjointed hitbox advantage. We saw the strength of that in melee. It would not surprise me to see these people lingering above mid tier because of that strength alone.

Projectiles are also key, 4 of the 5 top characters (Shiek, Fox, Falco, Peach) had versitile projectiles. They share this strength with Olimar.

This is not to equate Melee with Brawl, but it's common knowledge that disjointed hitboxes and projectiles are good.

Oh, and if Azen says Ike is good, it must be true. Azen is never wrong. He is Jesus.
/end sarcasm.

 

[billywill]

Just close this thread PLEASE

 

[Antinegative]

Just curious, why such outrage at tier predictions? Yea it's early and they will probably be mostly wrong, but who cares? It's fun to speculate on this just like it was fun to speculate on the roster.

 

[Yuna]

Obviously Olimar / Marth / Ike have disjointed hitbox advantage. We saw the strength of that in melee. It would not surprise me to see these people lingering above mid tier because of that strength alone.

So did Roy, Link and Young Link. Low Tiers the lot of them.

Projectiles are also key, 4 of the 5 top characters (Shiek, Fox, Falco, Peach) had versitile projectiles. They share this strength with Olimar.

A projectile is only as good as it's programmed to be. Peach's projectile game sucks now as she can barely throw them any distance and every single Special Item she can pull has been nerfed (except possibly Mr. Saturn, I haven't checked it yet).

In Melee, Young Link and Link were both projectile spammers.

Good projectile and/or Disjointed Hitbox does not a Top Tier or even High Tier necessarily make.

Oh, and if Azen says Ike is good, it must be true. Azen is never wrong. He is Jesus.
/end sarcasm.

Umm... M2K says Azen's Ike is good, not that Azen says Ike's good. Azen could **** people with Low Tiers in Melee as well. I guess Pikachu should be Top Tier.

 

[billywill]

THE OFFICIAL TIER LIST FROM SAKURAI I SWEAR>> http://www.smashbros.com/en_us/info/info05.html

 

[Losnar]

THE OFFICIAL TIER LIST FROM SAKURAI I SWEAR>> http://www.smashbros.com/en_us/info/info05.html

LMAO, WIN^^^^^^^

 

[USMC_JAGUAR]

ike is top tier, BY DEFAULT.

that is all.

 

[AlphaDragoon2002]

THE OFFICIAL TIER LIST FROM SAKURAI I SWEAR>> http://www.smashbros.com/en_us/info/info05.html

1. Stop trolling.

2. Doesn't help your Rick Roll when you hover over the link and it says "www.yougotrickrolled.com" clearly.

 

[limitbreak]

I dont understand what the big deal is. I think its cool that people are developing theories on how characters play as.

 

[AlphaDragoon2002]

Umm... M2K says Azen's Ike is good, not that Azen says Ike's good. Azen could **** people with Low Tiers in Melee as well. I guess Pikachu should be Top Tier.

Also guys, Ike is good, if you think otherwise you need to play Azen online. I'm not telling his FC cuz I don't think he wants to give it out, but if you can find another way to play him online and get destoryed then please try it.

The original post disagrees with you.

 

[Radical Dreamer]

Also guys, Ike is good, if you think otherwise you need to play Azen online. I'm not telling his FC cuz I don't think he wants to give it out, but if you can find another way to play him online and get destoryed then please try it.

Record please.

The people who are like LOL YOU CAN'T DISCUSS TIERS NOW are ********. Tier discussion is appropriate at all times so long as the people discussing it have played the game. The Smash community is so ignorant as to what a tier list actually is. Tiers exist in a game whether a list is made or not. Tier lists can exist whether there are tournaments or not. A tier list is a rigorous assessment of every characters' strengths, weaknesses, matchups, etc based on empirical data. Tournament results are just usually a good source of empirical data because players usually bring out the full potential of a character in a tournament.

Lern2tierlist.

 

[S2]

I pretty much agree with M2K's predictions.

Unless hard counters to some of these characters get found through an engine exploit or something, they all immediatly feel like very viable characters.

 

[sHy)(gUy]

m2k, what are your impessions on diddy?

 

[VersatileBJN]

Record please.

The people who are like LOL YOU CAN'T DISCUSS TIERS NOW are ********. Tier discussion is appropriate at all times so long as the people discussing it have played the game. The Smash community is so ignorant as to what a tier list actually is. Tiers exist in a game whether a list is made or not. Tier lists can exist whether there are tournaments or not. A tier list is a rigorous assessment of every characters' strengths, weaknesses, matchups, etc based on empirical data. Tournament results are just usually a good source of empirical data because players usually bring out the full potential of a character in a tournament.

Lern2tierlist.

This guy has won every single tier thread ever created on here, gamefaqs and anywhere else with this one post.

Uber, mega, ultimate props.

*claps*

 

[hippochinfat!!]

omg u cant strart talking about tiers yet its dum mods lock this plz!!

 

[sHy)(gUy]

mew2king is the best meele player in the world, if u dont wanna hear his impression than dont look, but i for one am very interested, not that im a mewking fanboy, but everyone should atleast respect his opinions

 

[Kirby M.D.]

Record please.

The people who are like LOL YOU CAN'T DISCUSS TIERS NOW are ********. Tier discussion is appropriate at all times so long as the people discussing it have played the game. The Smash community is so ignorant as to what a tier list actually is. Tiers exist in a game whether a list is made or not. Tier lists can exist whether there are tournaments or not. A tier list is a rigorous assessment of every characters' strengths, weaknesses, matchups, etc based on empirical data. Tournament results are just usually a good source of empirical data because players usually bring out the full potential of a character in a tournament.

Lern2tierlist.

I agree with the ignorance of the TIRES DON EXITS crowd, but I'm hesitant to really start discussing tiers hardcore yet. Yes, there are a few people who have the game, but that's the thing. There are only a few people with the game, and they might not have explored every character. Empirical data is necessary, but getting it from only a few points may not be the best idea yet. Theory and discussion is really all we are entitled to give with any sort of conviction.

 

[Spyda]

ah... m2k hates brawl? not technical enough? or losing to mango has made him sour? =P

 

[xilez]

i havnt been rickrolled in ages

 

[Dark Sonic]

Marth for top tier=Win! I freakin' love this game.

 

[SirroMinus1]

M2k Is A Dewd That Rox

 

[demonpanther]

So far it seems the character really having problems is Captain Falcon.

I have seen decent videos of every character owning to some extent.

Bowsers infinate jumps and slam
Dk's Bairs, punch and B/\
Ganondorfs rush and Uair
Dedede's Awesomeness
Rob's Godliness

even makes big characters viable for high teir

Hell even yoshi's Dair to stool jump can be annoying when it comes to edgeguarding

Kirby,Pikachu,Ness,Zelda are in rare fighting form

The tieir list that i see will consist mainly of high and upper tier and The rest Medium.

 

[BentoBox]

If you're going to speculate about a tier list, don't half-*** it and tell us why the rest of the cast falls short in whatever aspect I thought Diddy had a pretty decent chance at making it to the top, quick, combos well, banana setups are sexy, decent air game, yadayada...

 

[SynikaL]

To the monkeys cradled in their cages, aurally discharging in high-pitched staccato screams and squeals "It's still too early to judge!!!" in every d@mn topic regarding serious discussion about this game:

Shut up!

Shut up! Shut up! Shut up!!.


This side debate should not even exist in this thread -- if you're not playing the game you're contributing nothing.

As previously stated, tier discussion is applicable and relevant at all times. The only difference is, when an unofficial, light-hearted discussion on the subject pops up, you people are never cognizant enough to make the clear distinction, and attempt to derail the thread. The only people taking M2K's portions without any salt seasoning is you.

Don't want to see opinions on tier lists until 1,2 or even 4 years from now? Until then, Stay away from the threads.


-Kimosabae

 

[Jinx]

Record please.

The people who are like LOL YOU CAN'T DISCUSS TIERS NOW are ********. Tier discussion is appropriate at all times so long as the people discussing it have played the game. The Smash community is so ignorant as to what a tier list actually is. Tiers exist in a game whether a list is made or not. Tier lists can exist whether there are tournaments or not. A tier list is a rigorous assessment of every characters' strengths, weaknesses, matchups, etc based on empirical data. Tournament results are just usually a good source of empirical data because players usually bring out the full potential of a character in a tournament.

Lern2tierlist.

True that. In addition to this, probably close to 100% trolls posting "you can't discuss tiers yet" probably haven't even played the game yet. Furthermore, the select few that have probably haven't played ENOUGH to even comment on tier lists.

Also guys, Ike is good, if you think otherwise you need to play Azen online. I'm not telling his FC cuz I don't think he wants to give it out, but if you can find another way to play him online and get destoryed then please try it.

Pretty sure Azen wouldn't have posted his Brawl FC in the "Wifi friend codes Exchange" thread if he didn't want to give it out. =P

Anyways, I agree with your thoughts on Marth, Pit, & Olimar (but haven't really played enough TLink to comment on him). Having spent a decent amount of play time in the past 2-3 weeks on the aforementioned characters, I can say that my reasons for agreeing are based solely on playtime and NOT b/c:
-"it's M2K, he must be right"
-"I watched x number of Brawl vids and I think..."
-"everyone on SWF says..."
-"I read on some site that..."

I'm not saying I know more or have more skillz @ Brawl than anyone else, but playing the game is completely different than watching vids + reading threads.

This side debate should not even exist in this thread -- if you're not playing the game you're contributing nothing.

Don't want to see opinions on tier lists until 1,2 or even 4 years from now? Stay away from the threads.

Couldn't agree more with all of this (& the other stuff, but I didn't want my post to look too long, so I cut the other parts & left the parts that pretty much summarize it all anyways).

 

[BentoBox]

Top tier list =/= tier list!

 

[Mew2King]

the reason i posted this is because people wanted to know what i thought about tiers, I got a lot of IMs about it so I made a thread about it since I have the game and they don't. I could be way off for all I know, but I just did what people asked me on aim.

btw just in case some people don't know, Japanese Wii game (from play-asia I guess) doesn't work with WiiKey. (at least not for me). The downloadable version works for wiikey though. That's all I know.

 

[Juggleguy]

I was actually under the impression that the game's new mechanics hurt Marth more than helped him. I mean, recovery is so easy now with auto sweetspotting that Marth's edgeguarding won't matter as much, and the decreased hit stun combined with more floatiness is not favorable for uthrow utilt combos. Plus his fair doesn't seem to have the same combo ability. Can you elaborate on this, M2K?

 

[the_judge]

though I lack the game, I would say the best 4 chars I've seen are

Marth, Pit, Wolf, and Olimar.

The only problem with wolf and Olimar is their recovery game.

Diddy is beastlike!

 

[Yuna]

the reason i posted this is because people wanted to know what i thought about tiers, I got a lot of IMs about it so I made a thread about it since I have the game and they don't. I could be way off for all I know, but I just did what people asked me on aim.

btw just in case some people don't know, Japanese Wii game (from play-asia I guess) doesn't work with WiiKey. (at least not for me). The downloadable version works for wiikey though. That's all I know.

Original Japanese games do, indeed, tend to not work on chipped PAL/NTSC-UC Wiis. Burnt versions of the exact same games, however, do.

I was actually under the impression that the game's new mechanics hurt Marth more than helped him. I mean, recovery is so easy now with auto sweetspotting that Marth's edgeguarding won't matter as much, and the decreased hit stun combined with more floatiness is not favorable for uthrow utilt combos. Plus his fair doesn't seem to have the same combo ability. Can you elaborate on this, M2K?

The new game mechanics hurt everyone. It's just that they don't hurt Marth that much. The only thing he really lost was the ability to chaingrab, throwcombo and chain-combo fastfallers... but so did everyone else and the fastfallers got nerfed, so he doesn't actually need his old tricks against them anymore.

His fair is pretty much the same. Ken combo? Sure! All of his aerials have almost no lag, which make them ideal for (safe) approach. He can still do Fair-****s and I think his Dsmash is faster.

 

[usea]

Original Japanese games do, indeed, tend to not work on chipped PAL/NTSC-UC Wiis. Burnt versions of the exact same games, however, do.

This is false. The reason his original copy of brawl doesn't work is because it's a dual layer dvd and wiikey doesn't support dual layer.

The copy he downloaded and burned is missing the second layer (mostly just SSE) so it works fine.

 

[orintemple]

Tiers are perfectly viable to talk about now. There has already been tournaments and many are coming up. I've heard SoCal has already had a number of them. I haven't heard much about the rest of the country but I'm sure there has been other tourneys for Brawl.

 

[yoshi_fan]

Have you played Yoshi, how does he feels?

i'm glad 2 of my mains are upper tiers ^_^

 

[Scicky]

Didn't you go on this big rant on GFaqs about how brawl was ****? ._.

whatever, nice to see a few characters I might main are up there :3