talkingbeatles
Smash Ace
Falcon kind of sucks now, so we should all get super into counter picking stages and getting crazy familiar with them. As Falcon mains we need to know what to play on, when to play on it, and whom to play on it against. Also, we should all try to knee more.
Anyway, this is like a third or fourth or fifth attempt at a Falcon Stage discussion thread, and hopefully this time it'll stick. I'll start with neutrals first, and then we can move on to um... the ones that aren't considered neutral. I'll post summaries of what people said that include pros and cons, and have a section for who we should play against on the specific stages, if we should play there at all.
First up:
FINAL DESTINATION
PAGES: 1-2
PROS: Virtually none. Wall jump to knee, or any other aerial really. This isn't something that necessarily sells the stage though...
CONS: No platforms for Falcon to play with. It's a spammers paradise. Ledges will kill you if you don't know what you're doing.
PLAY OR NAY(?): Nay. The whole cast basically will have an even bigger upper hand on you here. The worst neutral stage for Falcon. Avoid and/or ban it.
VIDEO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1AxIgEM8rU&feature=related
Rebaz, doing his best with what's he's got. As you can see, the stage doesn't help at all, and really only aids Link.
YOSHI'S ISLAND (brawl)
Pages: 2-3
PROS: The moving stage in the middle is nice to have. Many character can't utilize it nearly as much as Falcon can. The wacky ground can mess up people's projectiles, and Falcon needs all the help he can get against spammers. The ghost platforms can help with recoveries, and if they jump up on your opponent, they can help set up some cool aerials. Pay attention to the walls of the stage. You can jump off of them! They make recovering easier, as well. Also, the following characters, in their stage discussion board have talked about this stage hurting them, or being a bad stage to play Falcon on: Bowser, G&W, DDD, Ness. Also... shy guys.
CONS: This is a neutral stage, and most of the silly things about it, help Falcon out, albeit only slightly. That silly moving platform in the middle can make things wonky, and you don't ever want to be caught up there. Beware of Ike, Wolf, ROB, and Snake here.
PLAY OR NAY(?): Play. The music is awesome. And there are shy guys.
VIDEO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_d6Cwl5FhRY&feature=related
Close match, Silent Spectre. Good stuff, overall.
SMASHVILLE
PROS: The balloon! Slanted sides lead to Falcon Diving spikes against people who can't/ (forget to) tech. That's cool. Floating platform leads to uair and knee shenanigans, so track it and use it to your advantage. Stage is easy to grab. Yay!
CONS: Functions very much like Final D. Long flat platform. This makes approach pretty hard against some opponents. Watch out for Falcos, TLs, and ROBs here. Anybody that you wouldn't play on FD. Here won't be too much better, methinks.
PLAY OR NAY(?): Meh. I say play. I love this stage a lot. Hah. The music and background charm me to no end. "2 am" is the jam, man. Horizontal blast zone is close to the stage, apparently so keep that in mind. The floating platform and slanted stage ends should be your friends.
VIDEO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnnDOU76_Ac&feature=related
BATTLEFIELD
PROS: Platforms, platforms, platforms. They're pretty awesome for Falcon, and here they abound. Also, the curve of the edge allows for cool Falcon Dive spikes, if you know what you're doing. Uptilts, and upsmashes are nice here as well. Hmm... what else? Oh yeah, tech chase with knees, nairs and bairs, of course!
CONS: Watch out for nanner shenanigans and mine games on the platforms. Falco rules this area pretty hardcore, I believe as well. Anybody who is tall (see: Ike) should be taken on with caution. Just don't let the platforms be played against you.
PLAY OR NAY(?): Did you see the pros? Play! Falcon's best Neutral. Keep in mind... the background has four stages(?)
VIDEO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4422AJJnwE&feature=related
There goes rebaz... battlefield-ing it up. Go rebaz go.
BRINSTAR
PROS: On the slopes and what not of the stage, you've got some cool sliding shenanigans if you fast fall an aerial into them. So, that's cool. The tendril thingies also extend your hit box of the knee. The tendrils and slopes also help against spammers such as T. Link, Link, and the space animals.
CONS: Nearly everybody uses this stage better then Falcon. Move are hard to autocancel because of the weird geography. Falcon is a big character, and that make making the higher platforms to escape the lava difficult. Uair works well here, but it's hard to utilize, since Falcon doesn't really move comfortably about the stage. Coming up from under with your upB becomes trickier here, because of the geography, so SDs might be occur more frequent;y then expected.
PLAY OR NAY(?): I'd say Nay. Especially against Lucas and Ness. This stage is supposed to be good against chain grabbers, but there will be better counter picks, I promise. Same thing for the spammers. This stage just does not have enough going for it. Also... don't take MK here. I have a feeling he'd kill you dead.
VIDEO: Pending...
NORFAIR
PROS: Lots of platforms. The fact that they ascend from the bottom one is nice, since Falcon has an awesome uair, and Falcon Dive is easy to land, on both an opponent and a ledge. A lot of people hate this stage, so if you're familiar with it, that's a plus. Also, there's a cool Falcon Kick glitch thing on the middle stages apparently. Look at Iwan's post on pg. 6 for details.
CONS: Lava, I guess. Also, there are some people who just perform here better then us. The list includes, but is not specific to: Marth, PT, R.O.B. and MK. Don't get caught in the blue capsule thing. Let your opponent go for that. Falcon is a big character, and that means the lava is harder to avoid.
PLAY OR NAY(?): Play. I'm not a huge fan of the stage, but it does benefit Falcon immensely if you know how to play it. Try throwing out a punch when the lava comes, if you're a stock ahead. You might be surprised at that you get.
VIDEO: P-p-p-pending.
PORT TOWN AERO DIVE
PROS: Home advantage!
CONS: Those cars, yo!
PLAY OR NAY(?): WTF?!?! WHY NOT!??
VIDEO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NbA0R-cXr4&feature=related
YOSHI'S ISLAND (MELEE)
PROS: The weird geography seems to benefit Falcon. That pit of death in the middle is also really easy for us to get out of. You know who it's not easy for? Ness, Lucas, and DK. I could also see Bowser maybe dying down there. The edge with the pipe is easy to grab, and is a beneficial area to edge guard from.
CONS: The slope on the right side can make it hard to get a knee in, I think. Watch out for them chain grabs!
PLAY OF NAY(?): Play I say, if it's legal. Most people don't know anything about this stage, so being comfortable on it could be beneficial. Lusiris says to bring spammers here. The slopes and whatnot mean that you both with probably be in the air a lot. You know who's good in the air? Captain Falcon! HYES! You can very often tech chase a kill on that slope. Do it to it.
VIDEOending?
PICTOCHAT
PROS: Since Falcon does best at something I call fighting passive aggressively, this stage should work nice for him, considering it splits up the fight in many of the geographical changes. This can allow you to regroup, and decide your next plan of attack, or it's just a good opportunity to spam down taunt. Also, the blast zone for the bottom is low and close to the stage. Try spiking and raptor boosting.
CONS: The neutral segment of the stage smacks a lot of FD, which isn't fun for Falcon. Remember: Just approach with aerials and follow up with tilts. Work on getting you opponent into the air.
PLAY OR NAY(?): I'd say play. I love this stage an awful lot. Some many of the stage changes are advantageous to Falcon. Multi-platformed stuff, the blowing wind. Since Falcon has such a good grab game, the hazards can be used to your advantage quite frequently.
VIDEO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lizrhFj60Y8
LYLAT
PROS: The three platforms help you here. Uair, bair, nair, up B, upsmash, and utilt, to your hearts content. Get the people on the platforms, and punish them for staying there. (Just don't get caught yourself).
CONS: The back ground is distracting? I dunno. Unlike BF, there are a lot of characters who can use those three platforms as well as you can, or better, so watch out.
PLAY OR NAY(?): Play, but it's a tricky stage so be prepared. The tilting aspect isn't a good or bad thing. It's just there. Get a feel for how it moves, and how to best utilize the stages current position. The tilting will mess up your AC'd knees and dairs, so rely on uairs and bairs. But, as I said in the thread, Falcon does a good job at getting back despite the tilting. Others don't. Go for the gimp when they're off the stage, you'll have a good chance at getting back. Be careful with the raptor boost for recovery. Don't become a victim of the tilting. Various projectiles have diminished power here. See: Earthbound kids. Fireballs are even more annoying though. Be thankful you don't have to deal with Doc's pills here.
VIDEO: I'll find a good one for ya.
CASTLE SIEGE
PROS:
CONS:
PLAY OR NAY(?):
VIDEO:
Anyway, this is like a third or fourth or fifth attempt at a Falcon Stage discussion thread, and hopefully this time it'll stick. I'll start with neutrals first, and then we can move on to um... the ones that aren't considered neutral. I'll post summaries of what people said that include pros and cons, and have a section for who we should play against on the specific stages, if we should play there at all.
First up:
FINAL DESTINATION
PAGES: 1-2
PROS: Virtually none. Wall jump to knee, or any other aerial really. This isn't something that necessarily sells the stage though...
CONS: No platforms for Falcon to play with. It's a spammers paradise. Ledges will kill you if you don't know what you're doing.
PLAY OR NAY(?): Nay. The whole cast basically will have an even bigger upper hand on you here. The worst neutral stage for Falcon. Avoid and/or ban it.
VIDEO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1AxIgEM8rU&feature=related
Rebaz, doing his best with what's he's got. As you can see, the stage doesn't help at all, and really only aids Link.
YOSHI'S ISLAND (brawl)
Pages: 2-3
PROS: The moving stage in the middle is nice to have. Many character can't utilize it nearly as much as Falcon can. The wacky ground can mess up people's projectiles, and Falcon needs all the help he can get against spammers. The ghost platforms can help with recoveries, and if they jump up on your opponent, they can help set up some cool aerials. Pay attention to the walls of the stage. You can jump off of them! They make recovering easier, as well. Also, the following characters, in their stage discussion board have talked about this stage hurting them, or being a bad stage to play Falcon on: Bowser, G&W, DDD, Ness. Also... shy guys.
CONS: This is a neutral stage, and most of the silly things about it, help Falcon out, albeit only slightly. That silly moving platform in the middle can make things wonky, and you don't ever want to be caught up there. Beware of Ike, Wolf, ROB, and Snake here.
PLAY OR NAY(?): Play. The music is awesome. And there are shy guys.
VIDEO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_d6Cwl5FhRY&feature=related
Close match, Silent Spectre. Good stuff, overall.
SMASHVILLE
PROS: The balloon! Slanted sides lead to Falcon Diving spikes against people who can't/ (forget to) tech. That's cool. Floating platform leads to uair and knee shenanigans, so track it and use it to your advantage. Stage is easy to grab. Yay!
CONS: Functions very much like Final D. Long flat platform. This makes approach pretty hard against some opponents. Watch out for Falcos, TLs, and ROBs here. Anybody that you wouldn't play on FD. Here won't be too much better, methinks.
PLAY OR NAY(?): Meh. I say play. I love this stage a lot. Hah. The music and background charm me to no end. "2 am" is the jam, man. Horizontal blast zone is close to the stage, apparently so keep that in mind. The floating platform and slanted stage ends should be your friends.
VIDEO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnnDOU76_Ac&feature=related
BATTLEFIELD
PROS: Platforms, platforms, platforms. They're pretty awesome for Falcon, and here they abound. Also, the curve of the edge allows for cool Falcon Dive spikes, if you know what you're doing. Uptilts, and upsmashes are nice here as well. Hmm... what else? Oh yeah, tech chase with knees, nairs and bairs, of course!
CONS: Watch out for nanner shenanigans and mine games on the platforms. Falco rules this area pretty hardcore, I believe as well. Anybody who is tall (see: Ike) should be taken on with caution. Just don't let the platforms be played against you.
PLAY OR NAY(?): Did you see the pros? Play! Falcon's best Neutral. Keep in mind... the background has four stages(?)
VIDEO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4422AJJnwE&feature=related
There goes rebaz... battlefield-ing it up. Go rebaz go.
BRINSTAR
PROS: On the slopes and what not of the stage, you've got some cool sliding shenanigans if you fast fall an aerial into them. So, that's cool. The tendril thingies also extend your hit box of the knee. The tendrils and slopes also help against spammers such as T. Link, Link, and the space animals.
CONS: Nearly everybody uses this stage better then Falcon. Move are hard to autocancel because of the weird geography. Falcon is a big character, and that make making the higher platforms to escape the lava difficult. Uair works well here, but it's hard to utilize, since Falcon doesn't really move comfortably about the stage. Coming up from under with your upB becomes trickier here, because of the geography, so SDs might be occur more frequent;y then expected.
PLAY OR NAY(?): I'd say Nay. Especially against Lucas and Ness. This stage is supposed to be good against chain grabbers, but there will be better counter picks, I promise. Same thing for the spammers. This stage just does not have enough going for it. Also... don't take MK here. I have a feeling he'd kill you dead.
VIDEO: Pending...
NORFAIR
PROS: Lots of platforms. The fact that they ascend from the bottom one is nice, since Falcon has an awesome uair, and Falcon Dive is easy to land, on both an opponent and a ledge. A lot of people hate this stage, so if you're familiar with it, that's a plus. Also, there's a cool Falcon Kick glitch thing on the middle stages apparently. Look at Iwan's post on pg. 6 for details.
CONS: Lava, I guess. Also, there are some people who just perform here better then us. The list includes, but is not specific to: Marth, PT, R.O.B. and MK. Don't get caught in the blue capsule thing. Let your opponent go for that. Falcon is a big character, and that means the lava is harder to avoid.
PLAY OR NAY(?): Play. I'm not a huge fan of the stage, but it does benefit Falcon immensely if you know how to play it. Try throwing out a punch when the lava comes, if you're a stock ahead. You might be surprised at that you get.
VIDEO: P-p-p-pending.
PORT TOWN AERO DIVE
PROS: Home advantage!
CONS: Those cars, yo!
PLAY OR NAY(?): WTF?!?! WHY NOT!??
VIDEO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NbA0R-cXr4&feature=related
YOSHI'S ISLAND (MELEE)
PROS: The weird geography seems to benefit Falcon. That pit of death in the middle is also really easy for us to get out of. You know who it's not easy for? Ness, Lucas, and DK. I could also see Bowser maybe dying down there. The edge with the pipe is easy to grab, and is a beneficial area to edge guard from.
CONS: The slope on the right side can make it hard to get a knee in, I think. Watch out for them chain grabs!
PLAY OF NAY(?): Play I say, if it's legal. Most people don't know anything about this stage, so being comfortable on it could be beneficial. Lusiris says to bring spammers here. The slopes and whatnot mean that you both with probably be in the air a lot. You know who's good in the air? Captain Falcon! HYES! You can very often tech chase a kill on that slope. Do it to it.
VIDEOending?
PICTOCHAT
PROS: Since Falcon does best at something I call fighting passive aggressively, this stage should work nice for him, considering it splits up the fight in many of the geographical changes. This can allow you to regroup, and decide your next plan of attack, or it's just a good opportunity to spam down taunt. Also, the blast zone for the bottom is low and close to the stage. Try spiking and raptor boosting.
CONS: The neutral segment of the stage smacks a lot of FD, which isn't fun for Falcon. Remember: Just approach with aerials and follow up with tilts. Work on getting you opponent into the air.
PLAY OR NAY(?): I'd say play. I love this stage an awful lot. Some many of the stage changes are advantageous to Falcon. Multi-platformed stuff, the blowing wind. Since Falcon has such a good grab game, the hazards can be used to your advantage quite frequently.
VIDEO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lizrhFj60Y8
LYLAT
PROS: The three platforms help you here. Uair, bair, nair, up B, upsmash, and utilt, to your hearts content. Get the people on the platforms, and punish them for staying there. (Just don't get caught yourself).
CONS: The back ground is distracting? I dunno. Unlike BF, there are a lot of characters who can use those three platforms as well as you can, or better, so watch out.
PLAY OR NAY(?): Play, but it's a tricky stage so be prepared. The tilting aspect isn't a good or bad thing. It's just there. Get a feel for how it moves, and how to best utilize the stages current position. The tilting will mess up your AC'd knees and dairs, so rely on uairs and bairs. But, as I said in the thread, Falcon does a good job at getting back despite the tilting. Others don't. Go for the gimp when they're off the stage, you'll have a good chance at getting back. Be careful with the raptor boost for recovery. Don't become a victim of the tilting. Various projectiles have diminished power here. See: Earthbound kids. Fireballs are even more annoying though. Be thankful you don't have to deal with Doc's pills here.
VIDEO: I'll find a good one for ya.
CASTLE SIEGE
PROS:
CONS:
PLAY OR NAY(?):
VIDEO: