Official Zero Suit Samus Matchup Thread

[PhantomX]

Well, how about this... I issue a blanket MM challenge to any/all ZSS mains that will be at Apex. $5 apiece, 2/3?

 

[cba]

Great Phantom.

Im not Snakeee or Spec or Cake but im gonna try and do my best.

that $5 MM sounds good, count me in.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

Olimar's uptilt and nair beat all of our moves too, but that doesn't give him advantage over us, lol. This is part of the reason I say we need to wait. Wario players think Wario has advantage, you guys think ZSS does.

Don't take this the wrong way, but I have yet to see a character match-up discussion about ZSS on another character discussion forum that isn't full of "yeah, we have the advantage and ZSS is only good when her suit pieces are out and is easily gimped!"

The G&W forums STILL have this outdated information all over the place as well as a few other character discussion forums. ZSS just isn't taken very seriously in match-up discussions and frankly, ZSS is way too easy to write off as being an easy match-up because there's so little representation. The amount of times I've seen Snakeee go "No, the match-up is even" and someone goes "No, you only have 3 moves" is unbelievable. Seriously.

 

[sasook]

Link boards don't consider the matchup in their favor ^_^

 

[Kataefi]

Neither do Zeldas. Must be a triforce thing ^^

 

[Tatty_bonga]

Not sure if anyone has brought this up in any of the threads, but if you're ZSS and your up against a R.O.B player in a Tourney, check out this video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrIGVZ3JjMw
This is achieved by using down smash, then foot stooling ( jumping off his head) followed by a fast fall, then repeat. It's infinite if you get it down just right, and it's not banned. It takes alot of practice to get it down right, but some of those R.O.B players are almost impossible to find the right match-up against, especially if your main is ZSS.

I hope this helps for those special cases in Tournaments.

Down with R.O.B!

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

Not sure if anyone has brought this up in any of the threads, but if you're ZSS and your up against a R.O.B player in a Tourney, check out this video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrIGVZ3JjMw
This is achieved by using down smash, then foot stooling ( jumping off his head) followed by a fast fall, then repeat. It's infinite if you get it down just right, and it's not banned. It takes alot of practice to get it down right, but some of those R.O.B players are almost impossible to find the right match-up against, especially if your main is ZSS.

I hope this helps for those special cases in Tournaments.

Down with R.O.B!

You just wasted a lot of your own time.

 

[Tatty_bonga]

You just wasted a lot of your own time.

Well you were quick to respond so I guess you and I have the same case of having ALOT of time to waste. No reason to be antagonistic about it either, I'm just trying to help out.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

Well you were quick to respond so I guess you and I have the same case of having ALOT of time to waste. No reason to be antagonistic about it either, I'm just trying to help out.

Sorry, I didn't mean for it to come across that way. At least DeliciousCake didn't get to you first.

This has just been a very hot topic of discussion on the forums for the past week or so and there's a thread about it that even has the steps to doing the combo in the subject line. There's a big thread about it on the ROB forums, too.

 

[Tatty_bonga]

Sorry, I didn't mean for it to come across that way. At least DeliciousCake didn't get to you first.

This has just been a very hot topic of discussion on the forums for the past week or so and there's a thread about it that even has the steps to doing the combo in the subject line. There's a big thread about it on the ROB forums, too.

Ah, well I'm a bit new to the site, as you can clearly tell, and I can't find a good way to search for topics like this without having to read 40 something pages to see if it's already been posted. Pretty awesome infinite though I must say.

 

[DeliciousCake]

Ah, well I'm a bit new to the site, as you can clearly tell, and I can't find a good way to search for topics like this without having to read 40 something pages to see if it's already been posted. Pretty awesome infinite though I must say.

Maybe they should invent something like a search function... oh wait, they did. And the combo? Two threads down after the sticky. And Supermodel From Paris is right, if I had gotten to you first I would have exploded in your face. Granted, you were smart enough to not make a new thread about it.

 

[Tatty_bonga]

Maybe they should invent something like a search function... oh wait, they did. And the combo? Two threads down after the sticky. And Supermodel From Paris is right, if I had gotten to you first I would have exploded in your face. Granted, you were smart enough to not make a new thread about it.

Well, first off let me thank you for not exploding in my face... that would have been very unpleasant.
And second off, I just figured out there's advanced search, I was just searching all threads not specific ones.
Sorry for the pointlessness of my post! :D

 

[Zesse]

Your forgiven

 

[noradseven]

Ah, well I'm a bit new to the site, as you can clearly tell, and I can't find a good way to search for topics like this without having to read 40 something pages to see if it's already been posted. Pretty awesome infinite though I must say.

All infinite are gay unless they are they look totally bad ***, which none of the ones in smash do.

 

[ph00tbag]

All infinite are gay unless they are they look totally bad ***, which none of the ones in smash do.

The one on ROB rather looks really funny.

 

[sasook]

All infinite are gay unless they are they look totally bad ***, which none of the ones in smash do.

Link's jab wall infinite does >.> <.<

And the ZSS one on R.O.B. (has this been confirmed as an infinite yet?) is pretty funny looking xD.

 

[FadedImage]

yes it's infinite, if you're quick enough.

and I think it looks sick.

 

[noradseven]

yes it's infinite, if you're quick enough.

and I think it looks sick.

I guess I just don't like it because its two moves, not just a whole bunch of different 3-4 hit repeating loops being chained into each other.

Like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=huD4Z28aUtw , though only a few of these are true infinite rather than just 100%, but it doesn't matter. My fav is around the 2min mark, with the triple wall chase.

Also these videos are from the tutorial video you could buy for the game.

 

[Solid Jake]

*subscribes*

 

[Buuman]

55:45 Zuit suits favor?

 

[Nefarious B]

So how do people see the fthrow chain grab affecting any of these matchups?

My thoughts on the matchup now that the grab is a factor:
Bowser

65-35 Bowser has a bad spot dodge, he uses his huge shield to deal with damage. They won't have good options either way, and are already outclassed, the CG just narrows the differences in weight so to speak.

0%-64% + regrab

Captain Falcon
70-30 Atleast he's fast but has zero priority.

0%-60% + regrab

Ganondorf
70-30- Horrible speed, big heavy combo target, really this could even be 75-25

0%-60% + regrab

King Dedede
60-40 Big combo target who relies on a CG that doesn't work on us. This might even be higher, but I'm hesitant because he is heavy and kills us easy.

0%-60% + regrab

Snake
55-45- Snake gets uair juggled all day in the air, and CG gives us a good threat on the ground. He's still heavy and kills us super early

0%-60% + regrab
*Can drop a grenade between grabs at some points, but you can cg past them before they explode.

Link
70-30 Slow, easily gimped, doesn't even kill super early like the other heavies. CG doesn't really factor in though.

14%-39% + regrab

Wolf
60-40 He can compete with us in the air but he is slow on the ground and gets gimped. CG not really a factor though.

14%-39% + regrab

Falco
40-60 This matchup seemed pretty dependent on Falco's CG before, it still is. Our own CG is too small to matter that much.

7%-39% + regrab

Fox
50-50 ( this is assuming we don't land the dsmash infinite) CG is useless really, Fox is fast, and combos better than us. While he kills us early if he lands a usmash or uair we kill him early too.

17%-26% + regrab

ESCAPABLE CGs: Most of these are not easy to escape, so I think we can assume that this information is obscure enough that their mains won't be able to get out.

DK
65-35 DK is another big heavy target that we combo easily, but he has amazing range that can compete with ours in the midrange zone that ZSS loves. We can easily dsmash-spike his predictable recovery if we knock him out in the first place, and this CG can lead to that situation. Just don't let him donkey punch or smash for stupid-early kills and this is not bad at all, and with this nice CG it's even better.

0%-64% + regrab
*Can escape with a buffered jump+airdodge at some points.

Ike
65-35 This is kinda similar to DK but the recovery is not as easily gimped. He has punishable lag on all but a few attacks making this grab easy and powerful to pull off.

0%-60% + regrab
*Can escape with a buffered jump+airdodge at some points.

Charizard
65-35 I'd be most worried about Squirtle in this matchup, this just makes Charizard easier.

0%-60% + regrab
*Can escape with a buffered jump+airdodge at some points.

Sonic
60-40 We outrange him, in my opinion matchup experience is a factor in this fight though, and the CG, while nice, should be landing that often against good sonics.

0%-56% + regrab
*Can escape with a buffered jump+airdodge or Up B at some points.

Sheik
40-60 Shiek beats us in speed and comboability. This is another match where landing the cg will be tough, but great if it does.

0%-47% + regrab
*Can only escape the first regrab with a buffered spot dodge.

Mirror, and downb is a very easy escape so this CG should never happen.
ZSS
0%-47% + regrab
*Can escape with Down B.

 

[cba]

So how do people see the fthrow chain grab affecting any of these matchups?

The only problem is..... what CG?

 

[Nefarious B]

The only problem is..... what CG?

Should be a nice thread about 6 down sport

 

[Snakeee]

I'll be surprised enough if that cg works more than twice at 0.

 

[Nefarious B]

Well this is from the blog of the same guy who delivered Pikachu his crazy chaingrab, and I believe kprime said he's tested frame by frame for all possible escapes. That's proof enough for me though I haven't gotten it to where I can do it perfectly yet myself.

 

[Snakeee]

Well I need to try it out then. It's really hard to believe it can work to percentages like those though o_O

 

[NickRiddle]

Well I need to try it out then. It's really hard to believe it can work to percentages like those though o_O

I've tested it on debug. It's totally legit. The Snake one is tricky, since if you run too far, or not enough, you blow up his nade. -.-
I got the D3 one in a match though.

 

[cba]

I think that you have to Fthrow then pivot grab...
right?

 

[NickRiddle]

I think that you have to Fthrow then pivot grab...
right?

Nope. Forward throw, buffer run, regrab.

 

[cba]

i havent heard of buffer run...hmnmmn
let me use the sacred 'search' button...

It has worked for me but with the pivot grab..... to a snake.

 

[NickRiddle]

i havent heard of buffer run...hmnmmn
let me use the sacred 'search' button...

It has worked for me but with the pivot grab..... to a snake.

I meant you buffer a run out of the throw, so you run on the first frame possible. Then, you grab a few frames after you start moving.

 

[canthandletheSpeculosity]

Hmm...I leave for like 3 weeks and we're still on Oli?

 

[sasook]

Lol spec. Maybe we should just make new threads per character discussion like other boards do, like the R.O.B. boards.

 

[Nefarious B]

So ya wario?

 

[cba]

wario it is.

 

[canthandletheSpeculosity]

Lol spec. Maybe we should just make new threads per character discussion like other boards do, like the R.O.B. boards.

Yea but if we do that people who come here later on in time looking to learn ZSS wont be able to find some matchup threads. I say we should just have WEEKLY discussions. after the week is done we switch to a new character. And Faded and The Zero Suit apperently havent been here in a while either so we're not able to update this thread. I think we should either make a new matchup thread were someone else who is here often can manage or we make a temporary weekly matchup thread.

 

[cba]

I nominate Adapt, Snakeee or PepsiMista.

 

[sasook]

Yea but if we do that people who come here later on in time looking to learn ZSS wont be able to find some matchup threads. I say we should just have WEEKLY discussions. after the week is done we switch to a new character. And Faded and The Zero Suit apperently havent been here in a while either so we're not able to update this thread. I think we should either make a new matchup thread were someone else who is here often can manage or we make a temporary weekly matchup thread.

Well, we could always give links to them in the Resource Center.

 

[ph00tbag]

Yea but if we do that people who come here later on in time looking to learn ZSS wont be able to find some matchup threads. I say we should just have WEEKLY discussions. after the week is done we switch to a new character. And Faded and The Zero Suit apperently havent been here in a while either so we're not able to update this thread. I think we should either make a new matchup thread were someone else who is here often can manage or we make a temporary weekly matchup thread.

TheZeroSuit is almost always here. TheZeroSuit is just really lazy.

 

[canthandletheSpeculosity]

Fine, So we all vote for separate discussion threads then when either of them are ready to update we add it to the main discussion thread?