olimar matchup stage counterpicks: anything you want to fill in not already filled on

[DanGR]

you can't kill with upsmash on lylat though. D:

 

[Dabuz]

yeah, and considering its longer allows better defense play and camping, screws over alot of bad matchups like wolf or falco with moving ledge, the ceiling and edges are about the same and olimar's pikmin aren't affected as much as other projectiles, overall better it seems

 

[Dyyne]

you can't kill with upsmash on lylat though. D:

But the sloped edges allow for good d-smash and b-throw kills.

 

[Dyyne]

I actually saw m2k say in his "tips vs mk" thread that lylat is mk's best neutral. Sorry to double post, but this thread is getting kind of low, so w/e.

 

[Dabuz]

yeah, but recently ive been playing mks on both bf and lylat and lylat is working ALOT better against mk, it may be mk's best neutral but i think its olimar's also



do you by any chance have any other stage cps to contribute?

 

[Dyyne]

Well, I started playing ness a bit, and I was playing against my friends d3 on luigi's. I realized that ness can stand on those two little platforms on the bottom floor, and pk fire hits alot easier. It can also hit the pillars on the side of luigi's, which makes the fire pillar appear. Ness can u-tilt juggle pretty well here too. Basically, I'm not sure luigi's is as useful as usual here.

EDIT: I also think that yoshi's (pipes) is a really great olimar level too. I realize that it is often banned, but when it's not, it's amazing I think. It has many characteristics that hugely benefit oli. Some help others too, but I think oli does especially.

1. The middle part that can result in sd's doesn't harm oli too much, because he can tether from almost anywhere down there, and still grab the edge.
2. Both side have slopes. Camping is amazing on these slopes. Oli's pikmin toss while standing on a slope is so hot. It angles perfectly. It's amazing. Oli's grab is also amazing on the slopes.
3. The only section where gimping can occur is on the left side, which can be avoided.
4. The left side isn't even bad for oli. Because it is so close to the blast line, b-throw, d-smash, etc. kill so excellently here. Another thing is that:
http://www.smashbros.com/en_us/stages/images/stage21/stage21_080107a-l.jpg
If you look all the way on the left, you'll see that it is flat, then rises on the left, then declines on the right. Oli can be standing on the flat part or the rising part on the left, and grab people on the declining part on the right. It is amazing.
5. The right side of the stage, again, can be camped amazingly, and oli can get easy b-throw kills since it's a walkoff.

All in all, yoshi's pipes are ridiculously amazing.

 

[Dabuz]

would you say its a bad stage then against ness? also, im qouting you yi segment, and making this into a stage discussion thread also where i qoute anything useful

 

[Dyyne]

I'm not completely positive that it would be bad against ness, but from experience, I know it's a good ness level. I can't say for sure who it benefits more, but it should be experimented with I think.

 

[Dabuz]

definetely a ness(and lucas) stage more so than olimar stage

 

[Dyyne]

bump because discussion has stopped, and I don't have anything more to add at the moment, but my previous posts haven't really been addressed.

 

[Dabuz]

guess no one cares anymore...

 

[deepseadiva]

I CARE. Like really. So lemme ask something to spark some discussion. Would any of you agree on this?:

Olimar
Best: Luigi's Mansion, Corneria, Norfair
Worst: Rainbow Cruise, Skyworld

It's for this thread, discussing each character's 3 general best and worst stages.

If no, suggestions?

 

[Dabuz]

add frigate orpheon to that bad stages list and i guess i would agree

 

[Dyyne]

Well, rainbow cruise is debatable (by me), but the general consensus is it is horrible, so I guess. Isn't jungle japes bad for oli also? And can we get some discussion on yoshi's pipes? Because I think it's wtf good, and it is a legal counterpick on the sbr list, although it may be banned other times.
Also, wouldn't he **** on green hill zone too? Easy kills because it's walk off, no gimping, and grab/ pikmin toss camping are hot on slopes. Agreed?

 

[Dabuz]

i completely agree

 

[Crizthakidd]

rofl its dabuz. teach me lolimar man ive been facing some good ones. anyway mk> olimar on lylat if the stage ledge start moving

 

[Dyyne]

Rofl this thread keeps dieing. I'm gunna make a thread where we talk about each stage individually (strats and stuff), as apposed to counterpicks, but let's try to update this list as we talk about the stages, since the list isn't done and there was still stuff on the table to be talked about.

 

[Dabuz]

uh olimar wrecks lucas on yi and fd, thoughts, and im thinking fd for lucario, because bf seems to give him lots of help i think, thoughts?

 

[Dyyne]

I would think that FD would be better against lucario than bf for the neutral pick, but they're are probably better options. (assuming they aren't banned) Yoshi's pipes, and luigi's come to mind as good counterpicks.

EDIT: Maybe you should make the format something like:

Character
Best neutral
Best counterpick
2nd best counterpick
Worst
2nd worst

Don't have to, but we can get more info in that way.

 

[Dabuz]

ill try and do that when i have some free time

 

[Dyyne]

FD for d3? On bf, his ftilt takes up alot of space on the ground and it may be difficult to get to him due to that and waddle somethings walking around. FD just gives you more room to deal with him. Although, d3's size may make bf better since you can combo him well there. Thoughts?

 

[asob4]

final is probably best
since the way to beat him is to camp your oli off!

 

[Dyyne]

^ In full oli terms-
oli is probably oli
since the oli to oli him is to oli your oli off!

 

[Dabuz]

;format:
character
best neutral
best cp stage
second best/third best/ect. cp
worst(is always rainbow cruise)
second worst


Bowser
n/a
luigi mansion
n/a
rainbow cruise
n/a
Captain Falcon
n/a
luigi mansion
n/a
rainbow cruise
m/a
Diddy Kong
bf
norfair
luigi's mansion
rainbow cruise
n/a
Donkey Kong
n/a
luigi mansion
n/a
rainbow cruise
n/a
Falco

n/a
luigi mansion
norfair
rainbow cruise
jungle japes
Fox
n/a
luigi mansion
lylat cruise/ battlefield
rainbow cruise
n/a
game and watch
yoshis island
n/a
n/a
rainbow cruise
norfair

Ganondorf
bf
luigi mansion
norfair/basically any stage good for olimar
rainbow cruise
n/a
Ice Climbers
bf
norfair
n/a
rainbow cruise
yoshis island/fd/sv/any stage with long flat ground
Ike
bf
luigi mansion
n/a
rainbow cruise
n/a
Jigglypuff
n/a
corneria
luigi mansion
frigate orpheon
rainbow cruise
King Dedede
fd (or bf, pending)
n/a
luigi mansion
rainbow cruise
frigate orphean/ jungle japes
Kirby
n/a
luigi mansion
corneria
rainbow cruise
n/a
Link
bf
n/a
luigi mansion
rainbow cruise
n/a
Lucario
n/a
n/a
n/a
rainbow cruise
n/a
Lucas
n/a
n/a
n/a
rainbow cruise
n/a
Luigi
fd
bf
n/a
rainbow cruise
n/a
Mario

n/aluigi mansion
pokemon stadium/ lylat
rainbow cruise
n/a
Marth
bf
luigis mansion
lylat
rainbow cruise
n/a
Meta Knight
lylat cruise(if its a neutral) otherwise bf
poke stadium 1
lylat cruise/corneria
rainbow cruise
luigi's mansion(wtf?! you serious!, but that our best stage!)
Ness
bf
n/a
n/a
n/a
rainbow cruise

**Olimar** d--(^.^)z
mirrors: they don't count with olimar
Peach
yoshi island
n/a
n/a
rainbow cruise
n/a

Pikachu
lylat cruise(unless its considred non neutral) otherwise bf
lylat cruise
corneria
rainbow cruise
delphlino plaza
pit
n/a
luigi mansion
n/a
n/a
rainbow cruise

Pokemon Trainer
fd
luigi mansion
fd/sv
rainbow cruise
n/a
R.O.B
bf
bf
lylat cruise
rainbow cruise
frigate
Samus
n/a
luigi mansion
any other good oli stage
rainbow cruise
n/a

Sheik
fd
fd
n/a
rainbow cruise
n/a
Snake
bf/fd(your preference)
luigi mansion
bf/fd(your preference)
rainbow cruise
n/a

Sonic
n/a
norfair
n/a
rainbow cruise
n/a
Toon Link
bf
luigi mansion
bf
rainbow cruise
n/a
Wario
fd(pending)
luigi mansion
fd(pending)
rainbow cruise
n/a
Wolf
lylat cruise(if its a neutral) other wise n/a
luigi mansion
lylat cruise/pokestadium 1
rainbow cruise
jungle japes

Yoshi
lylat cruise(if its neutral) otherwise n/a
lylat cruise
n/a
rainbow cruise
n/a

Zelda
fd
luigi mansion
fd
rainbow cruise
n/a
Zelda/Shiek
bf(zelda) fd(sheik)
luigi mansion
bf/lylat cruise(zelda)
fd/lylat cruise(sheik)
rainbow cruise
n/a
Zero Suit Samus
fd
corneria
fd
rainbow cruise
n/a





stuff like this gives me an idea, the pending list where im not usre or someone brought up a certain point about a level makes me unsure will go

guess ill start it now:

The Pending list
1: wario on fd?
2: wario on bf?

heres current updated list, thought/ bowser, captfalcon, lucas time! also, yoshi island and fd good against lucas?

 

[Dyyne]

I think norfair would be good for lucas, since it can screw up his up-b tricks. Also, his horizontal pk fire is much less useful on this stage I believe. RC might be good too, for similar reasons.
As for a neutral, I think FD would be the best choice, but I can't say for certain.

 

[Dabuz]

ill agree with fd and norfair, but rc lets him takes control of his great aerial game though, also, yi is really good against lucas to, trust me, ive two stocked good lucases there because olimar wrecks all approaches which he can force against lucas on there

 

[asob4]

lucas has a sub-par aerial game >.>

 

[DanGR]

I never get to counterpick against ness, lucas, or lucario.

 

[asob4]

lmao

i've only had to counter pick vs BoA's lucario
and that's only cause he's BoA

 

[KillerSOS]

I beat Lucario everytime no counterpicks either

 

[DanGR]

This one Ness player brought me to the Olimansion. He used pkfire on the pillars to help undiminish his other attacks. I still 2 stocked him though. lol.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

battlefield messes with lucario's recovery because he can't wall cling as well as he can to fd or yi. it's pretty much impossible to edgehog a good lucario at fd.

 

[KillerSOS]

Yeah... but Luciro is a sub par person...

 

[Jim Morrison]

I thought Frigate Orpheon was pretty Oli-unfriendly?

 

[KillerSOS]

Its not as bad as some people think. Platform is very friendly =)

 

[Dyyne]

Frigate Orpheon is still very olimar unfriendly when compared to most other stages.

 

[KillerSOS]

I actually perfer it to FD...

 

[Dyyne]

I understand if that's a personal preference, but it is not better than FD. Sure, you have a platform, but it isn't even as good as on bf.

 

[asob4]

i think frigate is a great oli stage
just camp the left side :D

 

[KillerSOS]

Thanks asob exactly what I was trying to say