• Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

The Official Marth Video Critique Thread

Status
Not open for further replies.

Shaya

   「chase you」 
BRoomer
Joined
Jun 8, 2007
Messages
27,654
Location
/人◕‿‿◕人\ FABULOUS Max!
NNID
ShayaJP
I'm happy to look at any saved matches if you upload them onto the internet as a .bin or whatever.

This requires an SD card. You put the save on the sd card, put the sd card on your computer, then upload that match's file and I'll watch it. If I'm impressed Ill even record it and put it on youtube for you.
 

chaosscizzors

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 23, 2007
Messages
211
Location
Michigan
I'm happy to look at any saved matches if you upload them onto the internet as a .bin or whatever.

This requires an SD card. You put the save on the sd card, put the sd card on your computer, then upload that match's file and I'll watch it. If I'm impressed Ill even record it and put it on youtube for you.
thanks =D
i was starting to wonder if i was going to be ignored or not lol.

but ya, i'll upload that file later to rapidshare or something and pm you the link. and btw, it's kinda off topic but i've got a bunch of other replays from most of the characters i use. idk if you'd be interested in seeing them but i'd certianly appreciate all the help i can get.
 

chaosscizzors

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 23, 2007
Messages
211
Location
Michigan
ok then, can't wait to hear what you have to say. i know i'm probably not that good but i'd like to at least think i'm not that bad either, or would that be a wrong assumption?
 

BacklashMarth

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 2, 2008
Messages
1,784
Location
Directly above you tipping a dair.
ok then, can't wait to hear what you have to say. i know i'm probably not that good but i'd like to at least think i'm not that bad either, or would that be a wrong assumption?
I would critique your video but i dont think that fox was all that good. Sure you have a range advantage but i saw that fox doing some really unwise things. Get up another video (preferrably one where you lose) and i will give you my input.
 

chaosscizzors

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 23, 2007
Messages
211
Location
Michigan
i figured you'd say that, unfortunately. my friend is not good at all, but if i can get another better opponet could you critique that for me? which means the whole replay thing again and... ugh... this sucks

if that ever happens, it probably wont be for weeks, or it could be tomarrow, idk. =/
 

Punishment Divine

Smash Champion
Joined
May 21, 2008
Messages
2,863
Location
Long Island, NY
I want to get a vid up here, but all my vids are against the people I play all the time and I don't know how reliable the info you get off of that can be.

Would it be better for me to get vids at the next tourney (Which I actually think is COT4 for me lmao) or would these be good? I would also need someone to convert my vids, I lack recording equipment DX
 

Fire Blazer

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 4, 2008
Messages
44
Location
Cleveland, OH
Hm... I'd like somebody to get to critique me, but like the guy above me, it wouldn't be great to show a video like this regardless of the quality, just because I'm sort of used to the gameplay... That, and any of the videos I have aren't very good quality and have problems with them anyway for one reason or another, so... D:

Yeah, if anyone wants to play me via wi-fi so I can get a video up, hit me a PM or post here saying so and I'll hit you a PM so I can get some critique on my play... I've been swept 2/3 of my tournaments so far, it's kinda ridiculous
 

Shaya

   「chase you」 
BRoomer
Joined
Jun 8, 2007
Messages
27,654
Location
/人◕‿‿◕人\ FABULOUS Max!
NNID
ShayaJP
0:07 - Rolling behind like that yielded no profit, nor ever would. Your opponent was the one who remained in the corner at the start of the match; yet you easily reversed the situation against your favour (however, your opponent didnt capitalise). Fox's style against Marth generally revolves around forcing approach with lasers and then using his speed to 'get in' to do the rest, you gave him a lot of breathing room here that could have been supressed.

0:15 - The move selection and thought process here is a bit off. Marth's uair is excellent in every way, and as he had gone with the dair was asking for an uair juggle/combo.

0:24 - Overall your Marth needs a speed up. This scene could have had you moving faster; by not jumping again after seeing his side b. It made you take longer to get to the ground to punish, etc etc.

0:28 - Absoloutely wasteful. You retreated for no reason back to the stage where a continuation of fairs/rapage/gimping could have occured that the Fox player had nothing they could have done. This is a prime example of your lack of experience and situations like these are GOLD and should be prospected IMMEDIENTLY.

0:37 - There was no reason for you to not take an edgehog opportunity. You had plenty of time to do what was needed. THIS SITUATION WAS BLACK GOLD, BLACK GOLD.

0:45 - You landed with a shield and mistakingly grabbed in the wrong direction. Smarter play involving jump cancelling said shield to an aerial could have been quite more beneficial.

0:46 - Please don't tell me you asked people to critique a wifi match seriously. Otherwise you're senses are needing a lot of work as your reaction ability is lacking. You need a lot more experience.

0:48 - Avoidable with a properly 'recognised' forward movement to cover the extra distance from his retracting body OR FAST FALL TO SHIELD. FAST FALL TO SHIELD. FAST FALL TO SHIELD TO JUMP CANCEL LOVE.

0:50 - You decided to punish the whiffed usmash with a dancing blade when Fox being as light as he is well within killing percent. Dsmash. Realise it. USE IT. Or anything really, an fsmash probably would have killed him, even untippered.

1:05 - Work on just dashing of the stage to a quarter circle motion to edge hog. Please. A player should never make a mistake like this; ever.

1:11 - Good, but faster movement with your hands would have allowed an uair. Uairs are great move to be within your habits.

1:19 - Slow roll and you shielded/didnt react to any of it. Repeat 0:46 p2. This was an easy opportunity for some ******.

1:24 - Your reactions are just extremely slow, and if this was on wifi it's your only excuse. BUT GIVING ME WIFI MATCHES TO CRITIQUE IS PAINFUL. You're sitting on this being extremely defensive never knowing to aggress style, and when you do aggress even slightly you don't even look at what's going on...

1:39 - Why did you retreat... that way? Fox's side b is slow enough.

1:44 - Wow, this was an exact repeat, EXACT repeat of 0:24. You also made the exact same mistake, and your opponent did the exact same thing...

1:47 - Full hop for no reason...

2:04 - Fthrow on Fox means another fthrow to dair or tipper fsmash or... gah... why...

2:09 - Unneeded roll back. You also don't know how to edge guard... You were no where near the ledge but you fsmashed.

2:15 - Why didn't you just grab the ledge? ...

2:22 - You retreated again back to the stage for NO REASON.

2:27 - You then failed to know what edgeguarding with Marth actually is with an fsmash... Your opponent is bad, but you shouldn't have shielded either.

2:28 - Marth's uair, please realise it's existance.

2:36 - This was wifi right? I'm not happy I'm critiquing wifi.

2;44 - You really have to learn about how to MOVE properly and also where you'll move to and what your attack will reach to WHEN YOU DO SOMETHING. I see some 'logic'/hope to do something but most players would know how to do it. Unless this is wifi *sigh*

2:48 - Shouldn't have happened with smart pressuring with fairs/dtilts.

2:54 - Nice reaction speed. I hope it wasn't a fluke.

Your opponent is bad, you're just slightly better. You have little experience or idea about how Marth actually moves or how his moves actually work. Over all there were so many painful scenes to watch where you just failed where most Marths would not. Your speed and reactions were slow, and you purposely allowed them to be slow by adding the 'extra' movements. You need to play better people, you need to learn how to actually pressure opponents and punish appropriately. Some parts were okay, you reacted properly with a move that covered the situation, but you often didn't continue on due to fear or something, I'm not sure.

Good luck for your Marth in the future
I'll leave that match on youtube if you want, it's not on my main account so I don't really care.
 

nintendoboyyy22

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 6, 2008
Messages
266
Location
Nashville, Tennessee
Ok so I would like critique plz. :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNp8FUwArag&feature=channel

Just the first match obv. This was my first IRL tourney experience, so I was a little nervous and didn't play to my full potential, and I did alot of stupid things. (Counter, etc.)

Anyways, critique would be appreciated, plz and thx.

(And lol @ me using MK after the first match. I promise I will go Marth exclusively in Singles once I get more IRL tourney experience vs. all characters.)
 

Pr0phetic

Dodge the bullets!
Joined
May 11, 2008
Messages
3,322
Location
Syracuse, NY
0:11 - Ok i know it isn't a bad habit, but don't go using the Green DB4 all the time, people can DI out of it.
0:37 - Shield conservation man. After he missed the original hit, his Shuttle Loop is weak. But, you hold shield instead of taking advantage of his landing lag, on a platform nonetheless.
0:56 - Nice whiffed Fair 0.o
1:04 - Perfect opportunity to get some damage on MK. however, you wait around for him to safely recover. I know you don't want to get gimped, but don't be easy on him either.
1:07 - Bad ledge trap, be a little more unpredictable.
1:21 - Ditto. look @ 1:07.
1:41 - You whiffed like, 5 attacks 0.o He's standing there, shielding, and your hitting air. And at the end, you get a Dsmash to the face.
2:38 - Perfect opportunity to hit with a Usmash, which now I just noticed, You've used only one Up DB4 and one UTilt. Abuse your up moves on BF.
2:42 - Random Dash Attack on the opposite side of the stage? 0.o You lose all stage control basically.
3:25 ~ 3:27 - You did two rolls, a good player would've punished you bad. Don't give him the chance to **** you.
4:00 - You are so lucky. That could've been a stock right there, and game. Stop spamming counter at this point, he's predicting it.
4:10 - Yet again predicted ledge attack, end game.

Your Marth is decent, which is good. However, you literally let him **** you. You overused counter (bad), you became predictable(very bad), and underused your Up moves (super bad). Limit your Green DB4 usage aswell, because you only successfully shield poked a few times. oh, and finally, work on your ledge options, defensive and offensive.
 

Punishment Divine

Smash Champion
Joined
May 21, 2008
Messages
2,863
Location
Long Island, NY
okay I just watched game one. Im gonna assume the Snake got that utilt he really wanted and won lol.

GAME 1

:26 - You kinda just let him place that dsmash instead of running up and trying to interrupt him/punish his lag

:36 - you got hit by the very, imo, obvious ftilt and got pushed offstage. Now it starts...

:37-:45 - You fell for the Rain of Mortars. I used to have this problem hardcore. Just recover low, grab the ledge, and react from there otherwise you will get ***** by ftilt and mortars.

1:01 - usmash wasn't appropriate here, imo. I usually only use usmash if I time it to hit them after they AD, and he was just too low here.

1:10 - don't be afraid to stop DBing if he rolls, although I'm not sure if you had the time to react here.

1:15 - again, mortars are **** but you kinda jumped into that one. Go low

1:25 - Stop rolling lol. Walking places = pro and probably would have netted you some damage here

1:29 - You tried to grab when a DB would have done fine and got punished for it

1:50 - You know that Snake loves to approach with his shield, and you know that this guy does too, so why did you try to DS? Luckily he didn't punish correctly -_-

1:55 - how does he keep rolling like that? lol

2:08 - you got shield pressured. Hardcore. This shouldn't happen to any Marth. Reverse DS OoS or shielddrop DB would have worked well here, but you just rolled away in panic.

2:11 - that was fancy and all, but you're lucky that worked. Walk away to fsmash would have sufficed.

2:44 - I'm pretty sure you could have used dtilt's IASA frames to do SOMETHING here, even just walk away, but you got shieldgrabbed.

2:50 - L 2 DI nub! Nah, but seriously, you can DI Snake's nair. Learn how.

3:21 - Again, the shield approach was obvious, but you still DS'd

3:33 - you reacted before it was right to, and he punished you by DIing different to ftilt

4:00 - why in God's name did you roll? And right in front of him while you're at it?


From this game I can tell that you roll way too much, and you don't walk. You need to walk. Walking is amazing. You also had a hard time killing him because you failed to do simple things like walk away from him/stutter step back and fsmash, or dsmash, you just went for moves that don't kill. You also had trouble recovering. Recovering low is pro for Marth, especially against someone like Snake who harasses you while staying on stage. You also jumped into some dumb stuff, i.e. that C4 kill and a couple ftilts, and failed to punish some stuff properly, i.e. his approaching habits. You kept the pressure well at some parts but at other parts you just let him camp, and thus take control. You need to make more use of your tilts, and FF your aerials in the actual fight, not just in between stocks XP

Second one coming up


GAME TWO

:49 - I don't think DS was the best option here, due to that mortar

1:10 - C4 you say? I think you know your mistake here :p

1:20 - Why do you keep rolling and such to reset the situation?

1:59 - you keep going for a usmash, but you could have easily grabbed a stock from an fsmash here.

2:18 - if you DS in the middle of BF, Marth always lands on the top platform, and I find Snake can't really punish you there. FFing wasn't needed

3:07 - Rolling got you *****

3:45 - Save a kitten - don't dair on stage

3:55 - you reacted inappropriately here. You had many OOS options but failed to use them at the appropriate time, but luckily BF is ****.

The campfest/flashfest that follows - Yeah, stop trying to get flashy kills, and stop rolling into his ftilt. You're lucky it wasn't killing you/he wasn't punishing you


All in all you made the same mistakes, so I won't really analyze them here.


OVERALL

Overall you have a decent Marth. You need to stop rolling so much and start walking. Walking is amazingly sexy and you can do anything out of a walk. Rolling is horrible, and leads to you getting punished. Pretty much fix the things I stated in your Game 1 analysis and you'll be doing fine. Stop trying to do flashy things, also. I know it was friendlies and all but I'm analyzing this like I would a tourney match. You also shouldn't let him get up to ridiculous percents like he was. I know Snake is heavy, but over 200 is just where you should be saying "alright, wtf am i doing?" Work more fsmash into your game, and I can't believe I just ****ing said that. You set up some nice juggle traps, and your spacing was pretty good. You were also able to keep pressure fairly consistently.

- More Walking
- Less Rolling
- More tilts (every time lulz)
- Stop trying to be flashy
- Understand your OoS options better
- Learn to read your opponents obvious stuff better
- Punish things
- Don't do really punishable things
- Don't just let him camp you
- Don't let him live until ridiculous percents, incorporate more kill moves

I don't really feel like doing Game 3, sorry XD
 

chaos_

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 29, 2008
Messages
459
well sometimes when i try to reverse ds it dodge rolls but i'll work on perfecting it
 

Scott!

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 25, 2008
Messages
1,575
Location
The Forest Temple
@Chaos, I watched your third video, and while I'm not pro enough to analyze it second by second, I did notice a couple things.

If Snake has a proximity mine out when I'm respawning, I like to make a point of blowing it up while I'm invincible, just so it doesn't come back to bite me later. You could have done that after your first stock, I believe. Not really a problem, just a suggestion.

Also, repeating a theme I saw in PunishmentDivine's reviews of your other two videos, roll less. I can remember you rolling multiple times around Snake, and receiving the inevitable Ftilt. Walking really is sexy, and rolling really doesn't work.

I also noticed an almost lack of a ground game outside of rolling, juggle Utilts, and specials. If I remember correctly from the matchup thread about Snake, Dtilt outranges just about everything Snake has except for the second hit of his Ftilt. And, though I make this mistake too often, DB is not a good approach. At least once, I think he punished you for it.

Did I see a Dair onstage? Cause that's just asking for an Ftilt to the face. I'm not 100% sure I saw one, since the tv screen was reflective and stuff, so parts were tricky to see, but I thought I saw one.

There were a few times when you jumped into things that ended badly, but you played smarter towards the end. That, or the Snake really let his game go. But you pressured him out of his game, it seemed.
 

Schwaumlaut

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jan 8, 2009
Messages
135
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2X1UhQE-6M&feature=channel_page

Click to watch Glov bring the raep to my Marth. >_<

Stuff I have figured out myself:

Shorthop more, fsmash less. No counters on approach.

This was my first game against a Wolf player, so I think some of the spacing issues come from that.

Please provide additional criticism or elaborate on the stuff I've mentioned.

Oh, yeah. Also, there are several points where I fsmash on Norfair when I meant to fall through the platform and fair.
 

Punishment Divine

Smash Champion
Joined
May 21, 2008
Messages
2,863
Location
Long Island, NY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2X1UhQE-6M&feature=channel_page

Click to watch Glov bring the raep to my Marth. >_<

Stuff I have figured out myself:

Shorthop more, fsmash less. No counters on approach.

This was my first game against a Wolf player, so I think some of the spacing issues come from that.

Please provide additional criticism or elaborate on the stuff I've mentioned.
I watched game one, and I am able to critique it, however it's very late now and I'm tired. I'll do it tomorrow.
 

chaos_

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 29, 2008
Messages
459
@Chaos, I watched your third video, and while I'm not pro enough to analyze it second by second, I did notice a couple things.

If Snake has a proximity mine out when I'm respawning, I like to make a point of blowing it up while I'm invincible, just so it doesn't come back to bite me later. You could have done that after your first stock, I believe. Not really a problem, just a suggestion.

Also, repeating a theme I saw in PunishmentDivine's reviews of your other two videos, roll less. I can remember you rolling multiple times around Snake, and receiving the inevitable Ftilt. Walking really is sexy, and rolling really doesn't work.

I also noticed an almost lack of a ground game outside of rolling, juggle Utilts, and specials. If I remember correctly from the matchup thread about Snake, Dtilt outranges just about everything Snake has except for the second hit of his Ftilt. And, though I make this mistake too often, DB is not a good approach. At least once, I think he punished you for it.

Did I see a Dair onstage? Cause that's just asking for an Ftilt to the face. I'm not 100% sure I saw one, since the tv screen was reflective and stuff, so parts were tricky to see, but I thought I saw one.

There were a few times when you jumped into things that ended badly, but you played smarter towards the end. That, or the Snake really let his game go. But you pressured him out of his game, it seemed.
usually when i blow up his mine he just goes to another area and does it again but i like to keep his mine there to use my own setups but i'll start blowing up his mines when i respawn and i will start using alot more tilts.
 

Schwaumlaut

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jan 8, 2009
Messages
135
Sorry to post this again, but it seems like it's falling off the page.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2X1UhQE-6M&feature=channel_page

Stuff I have figured out myself:

Shorthop more, fsmash less. No counters on approach.

This was my first game against a Wolf player, so I think some of the spacing issues come from that.

Please provide additional criticism or elaborate on the stuff I've mentioned.

Oh, yeah. Also, there are several points (especially on Norfair) where I fsmash when I meant to fall through the platform and fair.

Other stuff I have noticed since writing that:

Spotdodge instead of rolling.

Practice against someone who abuses Wall of Pain style bair tactics. This also gave me a lot of trouble when I played against a DK player.

Not sure what I should do about my excessive dsmashes - on the one hand, they come out in 7 frames and are great for punishing people trying to roll past me. On the other, they are so laggy that they make me get kicked in the face a lot.
 

Pr0phetic

Dodge the bullets!
Joined
May 11, 2008
Messages
3,322
Location
Syracuse, NY
Sorry to post this again, but it seems like it's falling off the page.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2X1UhQE-6M&feature=channel_page

Stuff I have figured out myself:

Shorthop more, fsmash less. No counters on approach.

This was my first game against a Wolf player, so I think some of the spacing issues come from that.

Please provide additional criticism or elaborate on the stuff I've mentioned.

Oh, yeah. Also, there are several points (especially on Norfair) where I fsmash when I meant to fall through the platform and fair.

Other stuff I have noticed since writing that:

Spotdodge instead of rolling.

Practice against someone who abuses Wall of Pain style bair tactics. This also gave me a lot of trouble when I played against a DK player.

Not sure what I should do about my excessive dsmashes - on the one hand, they come out in 7 frames and are great for punishing people trying to roll past me. On the other, they are so laggy that they make me get kicked in the face a lot.
Ill get your once ill return home.
 

Doomblaze

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 9, 2006
Messages
412
Location
Shanghai, China
Space your Fairs better, this applies to everyone, not just wolf. You should not be getting shield grabbed if you space it properly. Mix it up more, U-smash works like D-smash against rollers if you bait the roll, and gets them up in the air for a juggle trap.
Try juggling him by going up in the air and fastfalling with his air dodges so you can Uair him after hes vulnerable again. He cant do ANYTHING against that because his Dair has a lot of startup lag and you outrange him plenty.
Nice job using dancing blade.

thats pretty much it, you figured most of it out for yourself
gl
 

Schwaumlaut

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jan 8, 2009
Messages
135
Is it safer to space fairs so that you get the maximum horizontal distance, but are on roughly the same level as your opponent, or is it better to hit them with the downward swipe and be a little bit higher than they are?

Also, where did I get shieldgrabbed from fair? I watched the video again, but maybe I missed it. The only times I recall getting shieldgrabbed from fair was against tether grabs like Zamus and Toon Link.
 

Schwaumlaut

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jan 8, 2009
Messages
135
I think I figured out part of the reason I screwed up so many ledge falls: you can't fall through Norfair's platforms if you're standing above the part you can grab on recovery. This was a revelation for me.
 

phi1ny3

Not the Mama
Joined
Apr 15, 2008
Messages
9,649
Location
in my SCIENCE! lab
Can you critique my friend's Marth... I'm trying to help him improve but my Marth knowledge is far from competitive level.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ApqIYZLv4k4&fmt=18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSKWNvnfJEo&fmt=18
At least he doesn't spam fsmash...

He needs dtilt more and to use nair more effectively. Dtilt would've been great against that sheik since she was shielding a lot, and DB is not very good for shield pressure. Also, he needs to stop using dair onstage like that, it's a bad habit. He also needs to learn to cut off DB if he isn't hitting with the third/fourth hit, it makes him a sitting duck. The first match was overall better, but the only real unfortunate thing was that he fell for edge mindgames on the last stock, lol. The second match on the other hand, I saw sloppy marth things. Also, using grab would be pretty nice.
 

feardragon64

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 9, 2008
Messages
2,154
Location
San Francisco
Since it's been a while since I've asked for a critique of my Marth, I was hoping I could get a critique of the only recent video I have. Sorry but its doubles, but it's an offline match, which is rare for me. Anyways, doubles advice appreciated as well as just general play style. Thanks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RslRUcOaZ5o&fmt=6

Sorry about the music too. =[
 

Steel

Where's my Jameson?
BRoomer
Joined
Mar 30, 2008
Messages
7,587
Location
Los Angeles, CA
Fear you are leaning way too far in when you fair and put yourself in a bad spot. Your sword placement needs serious work, especially since Marth mostly camps in teams.

also lol@ bowyer and panda using those chars
 

feardragon64

Smash Champion
Joined
Apr 9, 2008
Messages
2,154
Location
San Francisco
Fear you are leaning way too far in when you fair and put yourself in a bad spot. Your sword placement needs serious work, especially since Marth mostly camps in teams.

also lol@ bowyer and panda using those chars
Thanks. I guess I was being stupid about spacing since I was so confused about what the hell was going on. Doubles is so hectic X_X How exactly do you space with two potential targets AND one person you're NOT supposed to hit standing equally close to the other targets? Bleh.

Also, it was a money match. Panda and bowyer let us pick their characters lmao.
We lost. But at least we got to the 3rd round(i.e. the one in the vid),
 

Steel

Where's my Jameson?
BRoomer
Joined
Mar 30, 2008
Messages
7,587
Location
Los Angeles, CA
bowyer spammed warlock punch and panda spammed ground pound ROFL

anyway like i said, you camp. go aggro most of the time and youll probably get hit by something stupid... your horrid body placement is no excuse just cus it was doubles.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom