-
Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!
You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!
Fox Match-Up General Discussion
- Thread starter M@v
- Start date
- Status
JigglyZelda003
Smash Hero
we know M@v <3
im still on vacation till monday unfortunately. or is it wednesday? i forget if CSU counts MLK day.
on topic:
im ok with either of them but i prefer Ness since i handle Lucas a bit better since i play as him as well. Ness i don't play often, pkfire spammers aside.
M@v
Subarashii!
I would say Ness first imo. I should have some time tomorrow to get this guide caught up thankfully. 
M@v
Subarashii!
Alright we are all caught up to Lucario. Lucario will go on for the Rest of Sunday. Then I will switch it to Ness. We have discussed a lot, so lets hammer out a number. I think the original notion of 6:4 Lucario looks good?
KheldarVII
Smash Ace
45:55 Lucario for me.
gantrain05
Smash Master
heres that match of me (fox) vs disciples lucario, fox isn't my main but i use him quite a bit in tourneys, any tips from u guys? i think i fought him pretty well, but the stage got the best of me, and i got hit by a fully charged aura sphere at the end cuz i thought i had another jump, and by the time i realized id idn't it was too late lol.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlzTI8QwA2A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlzTI8QwA2A
Conviction
Human Nature
Not to burst your bubble if you're looking for critizim please post this in, rate my Fox thread.
gantrain05
Smash Master
well i figured since we are on the lucario matchup i might as well post it since it is fox vs lucario. just to learn a little more about fox, cuz thats what im doing in this thread, thats why i participate in fox's matchup discussions, cuz im tryin to get better with him =/ i'm not really looking for people to say "oh thats a pretty decent fox" lol.
Conviction
Human Nature
Doesn't critizim show you what you're lacking (overabusing) and tell what to improve on?
Lightning93
Smash Champion
Real criticism is supposed to be productive yes, but you have to be able to point out what your audience did well so that they may continue along that good path, and not abandon a trait that was really working well for them. Of course it is also for suggestions for which the person can hope to improve on.
Gaintrain, I agree with Iblis that if you want a good rating of your Fox you should visit the thread he mentioned, but since this is a Fox vs Lucario discussion I don't see any reason why you shouldn't have posted that. I'll watch it right now...
Dang, you got screwed over by those lasers. From watching that match I could tell Lucario had a hard time spacing on Corneria just because you were all over the place situated at different angles. Although that pit seemed dangerous for both of you to be at, much like most matchups, it seemed like Fox had an easier time of abusing it. I saw you interrupted a couple of his f-airs using an n-air, and that he didn't use jab canceling as much, but when he did grab you, you lost a stock. His airial range cost you a stock as well, and so did his aura ball, and that just shows you have to finish him quick when he gets to higher percents.
I say 60:40 Lucario.
Gaintrain, I agree with Iblis that if you want a good rating of your Fox you should visit the thread he mentioned, but since this is a Fox vs Lucario discussion I don't see any reason why you shouldn't have posted that. I'll watch it right now...
Dang, you got screwed over by those lasers. From watching that match I could tell Lucario had a hard time spacing on Corneria just because you were all over the place situated at different angles. Although that pit seemed dangerous for both of you to be at, much like most matchups, it seemed like Fox had an easier time of abusing it. I saw you interrupted a couple of his f-airs using an n-air, and that he didn't use jab canceling as much, but when he did grab you, you lost a stock. His airial range cost you a stock as well, and so did his aura ball, and that just shows you have to finish him quick when he gets to higher percents.
I say 60:40 Lucario.
JigglyZelda003
Smash Hero
yeah im all for 4:6 Lucario
Yanoss1313
Smash Journeyman
yep sounds about right
Lightning93
Smash Champion
Yeah I played a Lucario last night. From the fight I could tell it was his advantage, although it wasn't too bad.
phi1ny3
Not the Mama
I've fought a few foxes in my area, and I can say 60:40 lucario's favor is accurate (though this is the fox board's decision to make).
M@v
Subarashii!
4:6 lucario it is. NEXT, as requested, Ness, the first of the mother boys:
JigglyZelda003
Smash Hero
yeah but we agree on 40:60 Lucario. his Ftilt is too good. and were on Ness now right? i'll go get marth to scare them over here.
Meh. Marth doesn't scare me! I don't know what to really say about this one. Fox can die early on in a match against Ness. Than again, Fox's attacks come out pretty quick. I'm not sure if I fought good enough Fox's, though. The ones I seem to ever fight are the ones that like to use smash attacks a lot. What I do know is that Ness' nair > Fox's u-tilt. Still, I don't come across many, so I'm not exactly sure what to share.
Sonic The Hedgedawg
Smash Hero
I'm offering my help, but it looks like the OP is busy so I'll repost it for him to see.
Toronto Joe
Smash Master
im getting the unlimited replay thing for my wii on friday, i will tell nessftw to have some friendlies with me and put them up
right now i see it as 55:45 ness or 60:40 ness
right now i see it as 55:45 ness or 60:40 ness
M
+9999999999
Fox's lightweight makes it difficult for him to stay onstage against Ness. Take caution to not get grabbed at high %, even something like 80% could let one throw put you on the line of death. Ness' dair spike can destroy both Fox's side and up B recovery, so you'll want to be smart about how its used.
On the other hand, with the right mindset, Fox can put Ness in the same position. Ness' Pk thunder is gimpable enough, but being shined by Fox of edge hurts our chances of coming back a lot. Fox is also fast enough to just jump off and eat the thunder himself.
Ness' utilt can juggle Fox far longer than other characters because of his fall rate, and you should, like every other character should, be wary of his awesome fair.
On the other hand, with the right mindset, Fox can put Ness in the same position. Ness' Pk thunder is gimpable enough, but being shined by Fox of edge hurts our chances of coming back a lot. Fox is also fast enough to just jump off and eat the thunder himself.
Ness' utilt can juggle Fox far longer than other characters because of his fall rate, and you should, like every other character should, be wary of his awesome fair.
Lightning93
Smash Champion
Oh lol, yeah I just saw you in the allisbrawl chat Toronto, saying you were going to upload something. I said hi, but you ignored me lol.
Ness, is a tough one because of his crazy airial movement and his powerful attacks. His throws are too good, and then can set you up for some serious gimping on his part. Luckily his recovery isn't too hard to gimp yourself, but you have to do it quick or else you're in for some major knockback. His physics make him good for you to combo, but his I know his moves can interrupt yours so be careful. Stay on the offense, but make it a careful offense so you don't get punished and comboed back. Stick to simple combos, retreat then get ready to approach again because your turn to take some damage will come up next.
Ness, is a tough one because of his crazy airial movement and his powerful attacks. His throws are too good, and then can set you up for some serious gimping on his part. Luckily his recovery isn't too hard to gimp yourself, but you have to do it quick or else you're in for some major knockback. His physics make him good for you to combo, but his I know his moves can interrupt yours so be careful. Stay on the offense, but make it a careful offense so you don't get punished and comboed back. Stick to simple combos, retreat then get ready to approach again because your turn to take some damage will come up next.
60:40 Ness, no doubt.
Fair is stupid good, throws are stupid good, his gimp is no slouch, his aerials in general have stupid hitboxes that screw you up, you can't camp him, he can't camp you, but he definitely has the advantage in this matchup.
I hate playing Lucas and Ness.
Fair is stupid good, throws are stupid good, his gimp is no slouch, his aerials in general have stupid hitboxes that screw you up, you can't camp him, he can't camp you, but he definitely has the advantage in this matchup.
I hate playing Lucas and Ness.
Toronto Joe
Smash Master
im very sorry, i mustve not been paying attention or in match.......Hi!
And also, Ness up-b out prioritizes rising fair so recovery is a *****, oh and sometimes you can get out of Pk Fire with jab spam
Conviction
Human Nature
Maybe you can use SDI?im very sorry, i mustve not been paying attention or in match.......Hi!
And also, Ness up-b out prioritizes rising fair so recovery is a *****, oh and sometimes you can get out of Pk Fire with jab spam
KheldarVII
Smash Ace
Shine the fire., although Ness can absorb it... but then he's open.
_clinton
Smash Master
- Joined
- Dec 5, 2006
- Messages
- 3,189
Why do people think Marth scares us Ness users...EIDI gets rid of the death grab for one thing...so sorry Fox...you guys are still one of the only ones to get ***** by a grab from a rat still...btw is the rat sleeping right now? That picture of Pikachu is scary as hell...
Still...why would I want to absorb the fire when I could just Dair you in the teeth for using shine on it?
The Ness boards think this is 60:40 Ness...for some reasons or so...
Fox is the most open to PKT2 KOs for how light and how fast he falls...as in he dies at the lowest % for it in this game overall...btw at 19% or so...if you get hit by a Dair on the ground...make sure you use your double jump ASAP ok...just saying...
Anyway...I think Pikachu is waking up...and that thing is scary as hell in that pic...so I'm going to run away FTM...I'll be back maybe
1st off Ness isn't open when he is absorbing things...like Fox and Wolf...Ness and Lucas' magnets are treated like a shield for a few frames after absorbing something...they can cancel lag...
Still...why would I want to absorb the fire when I could just Dair you in the teeth for using shine on it?
The Ness boards think this is 60:40 Ness...for some reasons or so...
Fox is the most open to PKT2 KOs for how light and how fast he falls...as in he dies at the lowest % for it in this game overall...btw at 19% or so...if you get hit by a Dair on the ground...make sure you use your double jump ASAP ok...just saying...
Anyway...I think Pikachu is waking up...and that thing is scary as hell in that pic...so I'm going to run away FTM...I'll be back maybe
Lightning93
Smash Champion
Ah... as long as your not Fox all you have to worry about is his godly QAC mindgames. And annoying airials, and spam, and easy recovery... oh sh#@ he just woke up!
But yeah, Ness has a definite advantage, he is just to OP for Fox in the air, and it's really hard to get a good approach and combo going unless Ness completely screws up.
But yeah, Ness has a definite advantage, he is just to OP for Fox in the air, and it's really hard to get a good approach and combo going unless Ness completely screws up.
gantrain05
Smash Master
yeah, i was playing neomagics ness at my last tourney, we were doin a bunch of friendlies, and i don't think my fox beat him even once....ness can really make it hell for even a good fox....especially a ness as good as his. 60-40 ness easy imo.
NinjaFoxX
Banned via Warnings
60:40 ness
and i just got beat by a reallly good ness in a tourney(FOW is too good)
its best to watch out for...everything really, i dont suggest approaching, all his moves outdo yours. the only thing you should be doing is baiting. grab release usmash actually works in this one, be sure you use it.
theres more but im hella sleepy so just pick at this for a bit...
and i just got beat by a reallly good ness in a tourney(FOW is too good)
its best to watch out for...everything really, i dont suggest approaching, all his moves outdo yours. the only thing you should be doing is baiting. grab release usmash actually works in this one, be sure you use it.
theres more but im hella sleepy so just pick at this for a bit...
_clinton
Smash Master
- Joined
- Dec 5, 2006
- Messages
- 3,189
Grab release Usmash huh...tell me would you...how fast is Fox's upsmash?
JigglyZelda003
Smash Hero
yeah i tried that before and Ness shielded it. on the ground does Fox have a bit more goin for him? i know going to the air against Ness is just asking for ****......
gantrain05
Smash Master
well you can dashdance around and try to mindgame him into slipping up, because really pretty much all of ness's attacks outprioritize fox's so its tough.
JigglyZelda003
Smash Hero
omg its like peach, >__>
mindgames ftw.
but where should we take Ness and where to avoid going, other than lylat?
KheldarVII
Smash Ace
You can take Ness to BF, Lylat, Yoshi's Island, Yoshi's Island (Melee), Luigi's Mansion, Frigate, or Corneria.
JigglyZelda003
Smash Hero
i usually go YI (brawl) anyway automatically to lessen pkfire usage.
Exceladon City
Smash Hero
Well the Ness player in the tournaments I frequent has a pretty good Ness. Ness' PKT2 will end Fox and it'll do it at fairly low percents. Like 45% or so. Back Throw is his kill throw and if you're not careful PKF combos will cause problems. Ness' Bair is also a pain if sweetspotted. Which is something he didn't do too often in my match against him. Grab Ness out of Fairs and punish PKT2's that have an off trajectory and recoveries that don't quite make it to the edge.
I have a video of a match against him so if you want to use that as a basic reference. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvN3xHZs468
I have a video of a match against him so if you want to use that as a basic reference. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvN3xHZs468
_clinton
Smash Master
- Joined
- Dec 5, 2006
- Messages
- 3,189
YI enjoys ****ing PK Thunder if it ****s anything...PK Fire is fine...
Nah...Most of these stages are just fine for Ness...BF pumps up his air game a lot (although Fox's usmash can hit through the 1st platform) and actually adds to his PK Thunder mind tricks, LM makes PK Fire go from an ok move to a very fine move...Corneria...well I guess that would be in Fox's area (Bloody Usmash of Fox and the whole KO power it packs)...still its not like Ness is limited in kill power for that area as well...
Lylat is pretty annoying...but it does add a whole extra bag of tricks to Ness' edge guard game at least...I don't play on YI Melee that much and I'm aware of what makes Ness hate Frigate somewhat
Meh...
- Status