Peach's Frame Data

Since I've done so much trolling lately I've decided to do something good for the boards for once. I have compiled frame data for most of peach's moveset.This frame data tells you exactly which frame the hitbox becomes present after inputting the move. I will do attack lag and landing lag for non auto cancelled moves later.

I used virtualdub to watch each attack hit a player frame by frame. There ARE some missing moves, so if anyone could get the data for those moves it would be appreciated. I was super shocked with the results. Credit out to 3GOD and hotgarbage for additional data.

Jabs

Jab:
1st jab total: 19
1st jab hits on frame 2
1st jab shield hit lag: 6
1st jab shield stun: 5
1st jab advantage: -18
2nd jab hits on frame 9 (counting frame 1 as first frame of 1st jab)
Linking to 2nd jab advantage: -8 (opponent has 8 frames between shield stun and 2nd jab hit box)
Both jabs total: 29
2nd jab shield hit lag: 6
2nd jab shield stun: 7
2nd jab advantage: -19

Jab Advantage Info

Mario: +1
Luigi: +3
Peach: +3
Bowser: 0
DK: +1
Diddy: -1
Yoshi: +1
Wario: 0
Link: 0
Zelda: +3
Shiek: -1
Ganon: 0
Toon Link: +2
Samus: +3
Pit: +2
Ice Climbers+1
ROB: +2
Kirby: +4
MK: 0
Dedede: +2
Olimar: +4
Fox: 0
Falco: -1
Wolf: -1
C. Falcon: -1
Pika: 0
Squirtle: 0
Ivysaur: +2
Charizard: +1
Lucario: +3
Jigglypuff: +7
Marth: +3
Ike: 0
Ness: +2
Lucas: +1
G&W: +2
Snake: +1
Sonic: 0

Dash Attack

Dash Attack:
Total: 37
First hits on frame 6
First hit shield hit lag: 6
First hit shield stun: 7
2nd hit box hits on frame 17
Linking to 2nd hit advantage: -10 (opponent has 10 frames between shield stun and 2nd hit box)
2nd hit shield hit lag: 6
2nd hit shield stun: 7
2nd hit advantage: -19


Aerials

Credit to 3GOD for this data. Landing lag represents the amount of lag the aerial has when landed without auto-cancelling.

Nair:
First hits on frame 2(behind Peach), frame 3 infront of Peach.
Landing lag: 11
Hit lag: 10
Shield stun: 14
Advantage: -7
KO Potential: 144%

Dair:
First hits on frame 12
Landing lag: 9
Hit lag: 6
Shield stun: 7
Advantage: -8

Fair:
First hits on frame 16
Landing lag: 22 (auto-cancels on frame 20 and after)
Hit lag: 10
Shield stun: 14
Advantage: -18 (if auto-canceled, advantage is -2)
KO Potential: 124%

Bair:
First hits on frame 6
Landing lag: 9
Hit lag: 9
Shield stun: 13
Advantage: -5
KO Potential: 142%

Uair:
First hits on frame 8
Landing lag: 9
Hit lag: 8
Shield stun: 11
Advantage: -6
KO Potential: 161%

Tilts

Dtilt:
Total: 27
First hits on frame 12
Shield hit lag: 8
Shield stun: 10
Advantage: -13

Ftilt:
Total: 36
First hits on frame 6
Shield hit lag: 10
Shield stun: 14
Advantage: -26
KO Potential: 139%

Utilt:
Total: 37
First hits on frame 10
Shield hit lag: 8
Shield stun: 11
Advantage: -24
KO Potential: 158%

Smashes

Fsmash:
Total: 40
First hits on frame 15 (in front of Peach)
Shield hit lag: 9 (tennis), 11 (golf), 12 (frying pan)
Shield stun: 13 (tennis), 15 (golf), 17 (frying pan)
Advantage: -21 (tennis), -21 (golf), -20 (frying pan)
KO Potential:
Tennis Racket: 99%
Golf Club: 131%
Frying Pan: 135%
D-Smash = 6th frame

Dsmash:
Total: 44
First hits on frame 6, 11, 16, 21
Shield hit lag: 6 (last hit)
Shield stun: 7 (last hit)
Advantage: -22 (last hit)

Usmash:
Total: 44
First hits on frame 14
Shield hit lag: 11
Shield stun: 15
Advantage: -26
KO Potential: 80%


Specials

Neutral-B first counters on frame 11
Side-B first hits on frame 23
Up-B first hits on frame 7

Other

Standing Grab first grabs frame 6
Dash Grab first grabs on frame 6
Pivot Grab first grabs on frame 14
Jump airborne on frame 6
SH airborne for 45 frames
Turnip Throw = 12th frame
Aerial Turnip Throw = 8th frame

Dodges/Rolls

Credit again to 3GOD.

Spot Dodge:
Total: 25
Invincible Frames 2 – 20

Roll Backward:
Total: 31
Invincible Frames 5 – 20

Roll Forward:
Total: 31
Invincible Frames 4 – 19

Air Dodge:
Total: 49
Invincible Frames 4 – 19

Dude, awesome data.

No wonder Nair's so fast. :D

GOOD STUFF. Look at all those fast moves.

THANK YOU SO MUCH!!! This makes up for your shenanigans

Wow! Some of those results are pretty shocking.
Nice data.

Jab being peach's third most ranged move, and hits on frame 1. Using it way more now.

I just don't understand the lingo... can somebody help me? Like translate what this means in english? =[

Peach bomber is really only 10 frames long before the hitbox? You were running this at 60 fps, right?

Each attack has its own animation. Though it takes a certain amount of time for the hit box of a move to be present during this animation. Since the game runs at 60 Frame Per Second, we can determine how many frames in a second it will take for X attacks hit box to come out.

Do you get it?

this doesn't seem accurate, niko are you sure you synced our footage correctly?

You really just had to post that before me eh? I just realized now I forgot to deinterlace the video I used to analyze peach's attacks.

So theoretically that would mean each piece of data is 1/2 the amount of frames of the actual attack. Could anyone confirm this for me?

I'm going to go ahead and deinterlace the video now and start redoing all this. I'm extremely sorry. It's probably just 2x the amount of frames. Though I'm uncertain.

It always felt the ftilt was going before a lot of things. =D
Nice job Niko.

Just deinterlaced the video and I can confirm that everything was off by half. I have updated the OP with all the proper data. Sorry for any inconvenience.

Requesting sticky.

I think what he means is that the frame data in the original post is 1/2 of the actual data, across the board. FTilt is still behind other things, in comparison (still a good move though)

That's exactly what I meant. I have already fixed the OP so no worries, all the data is accurate now.

2nd frame jab is still...not bad.

Niko_K said:

Requesting sticky.

Click to expand...

Just stick it in Airgemini's thread, and later in the guide. Sticky isn't really needed.
Or even remotely a possibility due to these mods >_>.

Thats pretty awesome, thanks Niko

Airgemini's thread has a bunch of stuff in there that really doesn't need to be stickied. There are WAY too many useless stickies here.

The only stickies should be:

Peach Brawl Finder
Excel_Zero's Guide
Video Archive
This thread.

This is just static info though. Put it in the Peach Guide.
And though Airgemini's thread is kinda scrambled, this should go there too.

Ok, then.. if Jab is only 2 frames, shouldn't we be abusing the first jab??

like jab -> jab cancel -> jab -> repeat??

Good stuff Niko. I thought something was fishy when you put her jab as coming out on frame 1. Zamus' jab beats Peach's by a frame fo sho.

DeLoRtEd1 said:

Ok, then.. if Jab is only 2 frames, shouldn't we be abusing the first jab??

like jab -> jab cancel -> jab -> repeat??

Click to expand...

I think her jab has some cool down time even if you cancel it. It's significantly slower than her double slap.

Is it possible to get her spot dodge, roll, and air dodge info too? I'm a little saddened by the upb info even if I'm not surprised. Ah well, it's still effective enough to save her butt when it counts.

Proof that miracles exist. Thank you...

Very interesting data indeed. And Villi is right, the first jab has some cooldown time so jab cancelling seems like a no no. It would be great if you could though because it doesn't send them very far back at all

Awesome! A frame data thread 8D!!!!

Let me add what I've collected so far to this. But first off some of the data seems off..... For instance, both my and 3GOD's data puts her bair at hitting on the 6th frame.

Here is 3GOD's very detailed data on her aerials: http://smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=4904075&postcount=4



Here's what I've got so far: (btw, I got my data by capturing from virtualdub and then using virtualdubmod+avisynth to bob deinterlace (kernelbob) to achieve 60fps)

(and cooldown=time after an attack when the hitbox is no longer out and you can't move)

GROUND:
Upsmash:
startup: hits on 14
esimated cooldown: 16 at least
total: 44

Fsmash: - (need to test for each weapon)
startup: hits on 14
estimated cooldown: incomplete
total: 38

slap:
startup: hits on frame 2
cooldown 1st slap: 17
8 frames in between slaps minimum
cooldown 2nd slap: 20

Dtilt:
startup: hits on frame 12
estimated cooldown: 15
total: 27

Ftilt:
startup: hits on frame 6 at point blank, frame 7 at point of furthest reach
estimated cooldown: 20 (if you're attacking someone on the ground it's 30 for all practical purposes because the hitbox lingers above your head, thus making you vulnerable to any incoming ground attack)
total: 36


AIR: (ll= landing lag. I was lazy >_____>)
dair
startup: hits on 12
ll: 9
autocancels: immediately after last hitbox comes out (<- take advantage of this?)

bair:
startup: hits on 6
ll: 10
ac's on: incomplete

nair:
startup: hits on 3
ll: 11
ac's on: incomplete

fair:
startup: hits on 17 (This conflicts with both your and 3GOD's data. I need to test it again)
ac's on: incomplete



SHIELD/DEFENSIVE GAME:
shield lag: incomplete

jump dair:
hits on 17

Autofloated dair:
hits on 25 (changes depending on hight autofloated)

jump bair:
hits on 11

jump nair:
hits on 8

Spot Dodge:
25 Frames total
Invincible Frames: 2 – 20

Rolling and airdodge data (found by 3GOD):
(http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=188742)



MISC:
jump: 5 frames (she is airborne on the 6th frame)

*Auto Floating has no animation and thus takes 0 frames*







EDIT: (when you capture are frames being inserted/dropped? That may explain the discrepancies)

3GOD said:

Air Dodge lasts 49 Frames
Invincible Frames 4 – 19

Click to expand...

Are you kidding me?? Her air dodge is CRAP! 16 frames of invincibility out of 49 frames... *sigh* Good to know.

Thanks for the extensive info hotgarbage! I will update the first post with credits to 3GOD and you.

Villi said:

Are you kidding me?? Her air dodge is CRAP! 16 frames of invincibility out of 49 frames... *sigh* Good to know.

Click to expand...

Yes, yes it is. -_-

at least you can drop turnips out of it XD

I haven't seen anyone use dodge dropping at all, using the dodge drop covers up your airdodge unless they use an aerial to catch your turnip and proceed to connect their aerial.

I believe within the first 4 frames of the airdodge you can press z to drop the turnip at the same time. I made a video demonstrating that back in february.

It's awesome because you can dodge moving backwards and drop the turnip going vertically so you can retreat while covering up.

Villi said:

Are you kidding me?? Her air dodge is CRAP! 16 frames of invincibility out of 49 frames... *sigh* Good to know.

Click to expand...

I've noticed this as well. I never air dodge with Peach because it sucks. The only time I'll do it is to dodge projectiles and such. IMO it's a blessing in disguide, you won't rely on it and you won't get punished for it.

HOLY CRAP! Grab is only 8 frames. But forward air gives 12 frames of shield stun. Doesn't this mean if you auto cancel a forward air a grab is gauranteed because they will be in shield stun? If so, this is taking me to the next level and I <3 <3

Niko_K said:

Each attack has its own animation. Though it takes a certain amount of time for the hit box of a move to be present during this animation. Since the game runs at 60 Frame Per Second, we can determine how many frames in a second it will take for X attacks hit box to come out.

Do you get it?

Click to expand...

Yeah but... The Advantage... and the...
Ungh.
I just don't get the terms. =[

Some more info:

- dtilt does indeed come out on frame 12; I tested it again to make sure
- fair comes out on frame 16 (I was wrong about that); it reaches maximum horizontal range on frame 17
- dsmash comes out on frame 6
- OOS lag is 7 frames (so jab OOS would hit on frame 9)
- turnip throw on the ground is 8 frames.... I'll test smash throw in a bit

I wonder what would happen if the player with his shield being hit with fair buffered a grab during shield stun

They'd still have to wait 12 frames whereas if you buffered your grab after your forward air it's only 8 frames. Technically no matter what you have the advantage no? This doesn't even take into consideration how many frames their grab takes to come out.

EdreesesPieces said:

I've noticed this as well. I never air dodge with Peach because it sucks. The only time I'll do it is to dodge projectiles and such. IMO it's a blessing in disguide, you won't rely on it and you won't get punished for it.

HOLY CRAP! Grab is only 8 frames. But forward air gives 12 frames of shield stun. Doesn't this mean if you auto cancel a forward air a grab is gauranteed because they will be in shield stun? If so, this is taking me to the next level and I <3 <3

Click to expand...

Yea Peach's air dodge is awful...as if getting back on the ground wasn't bad enough already

And if my Fair hit's someones sheild I always try to either jab or grab so I'd say it's very possible. Although wouldn't it be more possible for someone to grab you first when you're landing? This happens to me sometimes when I jump and Fair but if you're ground floating then it sounds very viable

What do you all think about using air dodge out of float? Get into a float height so that when you drop out and air dodge you'll have your invincibility frames active until you hit the ground where you can buffer into something else.

Niko_K said:

I wonder what would happen if the player with his shield being hit with fair buffered a grab during shield stun

Click to expand...

This is how your DDD friends will react when you abuse fair to jabs. I'm almost positive I get grabbed before I hit the ground, as Rickerdy says, because I should be able to get a jab in or at least trade some damage for the grab.

I do tend to fair from over-head which is when that happens, so probably if I auto-floated, I would still be able to jab him before anything he can do comes out. Dtilt and fsmash outrange/punish DDD's grab, so if he's doing split second reactions I can sometimes space myself to hit his shield so he'll react and then I dtilt or fsmash.

EdreesesPieces said:

They'd still have to wait 12 frames whereas if you buffered your grab after your forward air it's only 8 frames. Technically no matter what you have the advantage no? This doesn't even take into consideration how many frames their grab takes to come out.

Click to expand...

I am not sure, but I think hit lag is that period of time where everything stops after an attack connects. Since shield stun and hit lag overlap, that gives peach a 4 frame advantage, not taking into account landing lag. You get 2 frames of lag from a soft landing and 4 frames from a fast falled landing.

In the OP, it says she has a 0 advantage if she auto-cancels... shouldn't that be 0 or 2 depending on if she fast falls or not? Does she get 4 frames regardless or are those 4 frames on account of something else?

You might still have a chance to buffered grab if your grab is faster, or equal and you're on the lower numbered port.

hotgarbage said:

Autofloated dair:
hits on 25 (changes depending on hight autofloated)

Click to expand...

Are you positive this is right? I went into training room on a wave-bird and double tap jumped into a float with the computer. I short hop dair'd with player 1 and floated dair'd with the CPU and it looked like they started and stopped at the same time. I even tested it out with both of them floating at different heights and it was the same.

Oh my... air dodge sucks. That's why I get hit all the time when I'm trying to get back to the ground. Ike loves to hit my Peach with his fully charged smashes -_-

I actually forgot about the landing lag for auto-canceled aerials. A perfectly auto-canceled Fair will have an "advantage" of -2 frames.

That means a Jab from Peach should beat out any attempt to counter out of shield (assuming they don't shield the Jab also).

Also, I got this for the grabs - I notice someone said 8 frames, but I got it captured as grabbing on frame 6 (both standing and running) and frame 14 for pivot grab (these are a little hard to be certain on since it has a little give on the pivot).

Here's all the data I have on Peach if you want to reorganize it and put in the original post or compare it to other data...most of it should be pretty accurate. The "KO Potential %" is what % a fresh move KO's Mario from the center of FD with no DI.

Jab:
1st jab total: 19
1st jab hits on frame 2
1st jab shield hit lag: 6
1st jab shield stun: 5
1st jab advantage: -18
2nd jab hits on frame 9 (counting frame 1 as first frame of 1st jab)
Linking to 2nd jab advantage: -8 (opponent has 8 frames between shield stun and 2nd jab hit box)
Both jabs total: 29
2nd jab shield hit lag: 6
2nd jab shield stun: 7
2nd jab advantage: -19

Dash Attack:
Total: 37
First hits on frame 6
First hit shield hit lag: 6
First hit shield stun: 7
2nd hit box hits on frame 17
Linking to 2nd hit advantage: -10 (opponent has 10 frames between shield stun and 2nd hit box)
2nd hit shield hit lag: 6
2nd hit shield stun: 7
2nd hit advantage: -19

Dtilt:
Total: 27
First hits on frame 12
Shield hit lag: 8
Shield stun: 10
Advantage: -13

Ftilt:
Total: 36
First hits on frame 6
Shield hit lag: 10
Shield stun: 14
Advantage: -26
KO Potential: 139%

Utilt:
Total: 37
First hits on frame 10
Shield hit lag: 8
Shield stun: 11
Advantage: -24
KO Potential: 158%

Dsmash:
Total: 44
First hits on frame 6, 11, 16, 21
Shield hit lag: 6 (last hit)
Shield stun: 7 (last hit)
Advantage: -22 (last hit)

Fsmash:
Total: 40
First hits on frame 15 (in front of Peach)
Shield hit lag: 9 (tennis), 11 (golf), 12 (frying pan)
Shield stun: 13 (tennis), 15 (golf), 17 (frying pan)
Advantage: -21 (tennis), -21 (golf), -20 (frying pan)
KO Potential:
Tennis Racket: 99%
Golf Club: 131%
Frying Pan: 135%

Usmash:
Total: 44
First hits on frame 14
Shield hit lag: 11
Shield stun: 15
Advantage: -26
KO Potential: 80%

Nair:
First hits on frame 3
Landing lag: 11
Hit lag: 10
Shield stun: 14
Advantage: -7
KO Potential: 144%

Dair:
First hits on frame 12
Landing lag: 9
Hit lag: 6
Shield stun: 7
Advantage: -8

Fair:
First hits on frame 16
Landing lag: 22 (auto-cancels on frame 20 and after)
Hit lag: 10
Shield stun: 14
Advantage: -18 (if auto-canceled, advantage is -2)
KO Potential: 124%

Bair:
First hits on frame 6
Landing lag: 9
Hit lag: 9
Shield stun: 13
Advantage: -5
KO Potential: 142%

Uair:
First hits on frame 8
Landing lag: 9
Hit lag: 8
Shield stun: 11
Advantage: -6
KO Potential: 161%

Neutral-B first counters on frame 11
Side-B first hits on frame 23
Up-B first hits on frame 7

Standing Grab first grabs frame 6
Dash Grab first grabs on frame 6
Pivot Grab first grabs on frame 14

Jump airborne on frame 6
SH airborne for 45 frames

Spot Dodge:
Total: 25
Invincible Frames 2 – 20

Roll Backward:
Total: 31
Invincible Frames 5 – 20

Roll Forward:
Total: 31
Invincible Frames 4 – 19

Air Dodge:
Total: 49
Invincible Frames 4 – 19

Rickerdy-doo-da-day said:

Yea Peach's air dodge is awful...as if getting back on the ground wasn't bad enough already

And if my Fair hit's someones sheild I always try to either jab or grab so I'd say it's very possible. Although wouldn't it be more possible for someone to grab you first when you're landing? This happens to me sometimes when I jump and Fair but if you're ground floating then it sounds very viable

Click to expand...

If you auto-cancel you can do another move immediately...so I don't think you should be too worried....

However if they powershield.... but who would want to take that kind of chance against a fair

Someone should compile all these a make a super technical guide.