Official BBR Tier List v5

[SupaSairentoZ7℠]

One thing that makes Luigi deadly is his Pimp Hand attack. (Also known as his Fsmash) That move comes out fast and is powerful. I fear that more than his Super Punch.

 

[Psychoace]

<3

Btw, what kind of positive match ups do characters like Zelda/Jiggly/Falcon have? If you gonna put Zelda above anyone besides Ganondorf, I'm guessing she is gonna have to have favorable match ups against more then him too.

Falcon:

Wario depending on the stage
Bowser
Ike (I don't agree with this)
Yoshi...maybe
Link
Ganondorf

off the top of my head. We don't have a lot of our matchups done either.

We also have a pretty neutral/soft counter (55/45 or 60/40) matchup spread with a lot of characters.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

i laughed irl pretty hard actually

im drunk and its 7am. and im going to have to ask you
wtf does that mean LOL

It was a friendly match during a tournament [some people play friendlies outside of tournaments, believe it or not!] in germany.

for the record ive seen atomsk beat ikons mk in tourny with ganon so doesnt mean a lot

Well there's a difference between:

- Doing something that's possible but requires precise technical execution [sweetspot fair a Kirby out of a powershield] and practice.
- Going against the odds to an absurd extent as to beat a meta knight with Ganondorf

The former is a technical thing that every player is free to learn and guaranteed. The latter requires a solid number of major screwing up to be even realistic.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Oreo, trying to explain why Luigi is awful is a waste of time. You know this, lol.

 

[Flayl]

Bowser

What Bowsers have you played?

 

[-LzR-]

Bowser is heavily underrated. Definitely the top of low tier at worst. I don't main Bowser so I have a hard time explaining, so Flayl do the job

 

[Atomsk_92]

Luigi has possibly top 5 boxing in the game.

 

[Shaya]

Who cares about boxing when you can have swords, bananas, lol-falco and disjointed arms and legs?

 

[BSP]

What good Luigi's have people played?

I agree with most of the flaws listed, but you can't assume you're going to keep Luigi out forever.

 

[Exceladon City]

Not really, Luigi's range is better than Mario's with the exception of Fsmash.

Luigi's Nair comes out on Frame 3 interrupting stuff while also killing them, nair. His jab is also better because the follow up he gets are far more dangerous than Marios.

People are overrating how much his speed holds him back.

I play Luigi. I know just how bad he is. Nair, realistically doesn't kill until like 160. Why? Because you're Nairing out of potentially bad situations every 10 seconds. Luigi has a great up close game but it doesn't mean **** if people just tell him "No" and get away from him.

Characters Luigi can get in on pretty handily:








7-8 characters. Everyone else can keep Luigi out pretty reliably. Lucario is iffy. If the Lucario thinks to Ftilt everything Luigi does, Luigi is screwed. Ryu, it's not just his speed that holds him back. It's everything that I mentioned. Luigi is a character that is good at scary facing people because he's throwing aerials at you all day and they hit hard. Nobody ever thinks "Wait, he's slow as **** and he can't stay in. I'm gonna move or wall him out." Once you learn to shrug off Luigi's scary face, he's not nearly as threatening.

Oreo, trying to explain why Luigi is awful is a waste of time. You know this, lol.

They are lucky Crash isn't in here. lol

 

[DMG]

Ice climbers have desynchs: Blizzard while the other one Utilts or Uairs is kinda funny lol

 

[Exceladon City]

Ice climbers have desynchs: Blizzard while the other one Utilts or Uairs is kinda funny lol

It can stall Luigi for a bit. He can just fireball through it and go smack around the other climber. Before people think I'm theorycrafting about Luigi, I've been playing him seriously since '08. So I know what I'm talking about.

 

[Z'zgashi]

Falcon:

Wario depending on the stage
Bowser
Ike (I don't agree with this)
Yoshi...maybe
Link
Ganondorf

off the top of my head. We don't have a lot of our matchups done either.

We also have a pretty neutral/soft counter (55/45 or 60/40) matchup spread with a lot of characters.

We JUST discussed this a month or two ago, it's 55:45 yoshi, and arguably even 60:40. You guys agreed. >.>

 

[Orion*]

It's getting to the point where i need to tag all of my posts with or else people think i'm being completely serious.
because that describes me perfectly.

great troll/sarcasm post

lol like, you expect people to tell youre sarcastic if you write a (very possible) one liner that another person would write, and have no emotes.

I dont think theres any character that you can realistically keep out forever.

and when luigi does get in, he gets it in.

this

It was a friendly match during a tournament [some people play friendlies outside of tournaments, believe it or not!] in germany.

then just say friendly lol

Well there's a difference between:

- Doing something that's possible but requires precise technical execution [sweetspot fair a Kirby out of a powershield] and practice.
- Going against the odds to an absurd extent as to beat a meta knight with Ganondorf

The former is a technical thing that every player is free to learn and guaranteed. The latter requires a solid number of major screwing up to be even realistic.

Who cares about boxing when you can have swords, bananas, lol-falco and disjointed arms and legs?

okay better example

in a friendly atomsk PSed like 3 of my sharking uairs from below in rapid succession on delfino and then just like dair/upBed oos

just because something is possible doesnt mean its plausible

 

[TheReflexWonder]

One thing that makes Luigi deadly is his Pimp Hand attack. (Also known as his Fsmash) That move comes out fast and is powerful. I fear that more than his Super Punch.

No, the Pimp Hand is F-Air. F-Smash is the Proctology Exam.

What good Luigi's have people played?

I agree with most of the flaws listed, but you can't assume you're going to keep Luigi out forever.

I've played BigLou for about three years now, and I've beaten him a whole lot due to abusing Luigi's weaknesses. He has picked up Diddy Kong in an attempt to be able to actually fight against the parts of the cast that just keep him away forever, and uses Luigi only for specific match-ups now.

Luigi is...pretty bad. Maybe not outright Low Tier, but,...pretty bad.

Who cares about boxing when you can have swords, bananas, lol-falco and disjointed arms and legs?

Exactly. Luigi's competitive strategies rely on using mostly-unsafe methods of approaching. People who know what they're doing can beat Luigi with relative ease, since they don't have to actually fight at all.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I play Luigi. I know just how bad he is. Nair, realistically doesn't kill until like 160. Why? Because you're Nairing out of potentially bad situations every 10 seconds. Luigi has a great up close game but it doesn't mean **** if people just tell him "No" and get away from him.

Characters Luigi can get in on pretty handily:








7-8 characters. Everyone else can keep Luigi out pretty reliably. Lucario is iffy. If the Lucario thinks to Ftilt everything Luigi does, Luigi is screwed. Ryu, it's not just his speed that holds him back. It's everything that I mentioned. Luigi is a character that is good at scary facing people because he's throwing aerials at you all day and they hit hard. Nobody ever thinks "Wait, he's slow as **** and he can't stay in. I'm gonna move or wall him out." Once you learn to shrug off Luigi's scary face, he's not nearly as threatening.



They are lucky Crash isn't in here. lol

This is coming from me in WI, gee wonder what Luigi live there. I've MM'd Lugi's multiple times, and played them in friendlies, it's not that simple. I'm well aware characters can keep him out like Marth, MK, etc. because of his bad traction, limited range, and speed. However that doesn't make him piss poor easy to wall out.

Also a lot of this can realistically apply to Mario as well, if Luigi's nair is supposedly bad at getting him out of situations, Mario's is not that much better if at all.

Ftilt is god like the match-up but Luigi can spot-dodge it to try and get in, he can also hop over and bair/dair Lucario in the head if he sees it coming. So yes it is very good at keeping him out but in no way does is it an allaround answer for every approach he has.

If he's bad, ok that fine, but we're trying to compare how good/bad he is with everyone else at that point and if he is around the same level as everyone else in his tier. He's not on the same level as E tier.

 

[Seagull Joe]

Never doubt Luigi. His ****ing Nair is so fast. His jab has awkward properties to it. His Fsmash titled upward and Up b kill stupidly early. Not to mention is hyphen smash might as well be a Dacus.

He can Dacit far too. I don't know how big his glide toss is, but his Dacit is almost all of Fd.

Anyone who has played Boss or Biglou knows how good Luigi is in the right hands.

 

[-LzR-]

Anyone who has played against Luigi knows how easy he is to beat with the right hands.

 

[stingers]

I agree (w/ Seagull), Luigi is pretty scary. I had a really hard time keeping Biglou out when I played him, but he's just a lot better than me =/ The fact Luigi's walk is decent is enough for him...If he actually had aerial mobility he'd be ******** lol

 

[Seagull Joe]

Anyone who has played against Luigi knows how easy he is to beat with the right hands.

*Sees location*

You sir have no idea how good Luigi can be.

 

[stingers]

oh right and his spotdodge is DUMB

it's the same as falcos iirc

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Anyone who has played against Luigi knows how easy he is to beat with the right hands.

Please tell me your Luigi secret so I can stop losing to YoshQ, please do tell. Tell me how I can keep him out and beat him with any character.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Luigi is bad, but there's no stopping the Mock Tornado.

 

[vVv Rapture]

I always thought Luigi was pretty good, it's just that no one has really unlocked his inner Weegee yet.

I feel like I should go play Luigi's Mansion, then try him out or something. I think if I play enough Luigi, then I become the Weegee and that's how you win. I think that's why I'm gonna go play Kirby Superstar Ultra now that I use that little pink ball thing.

 

[jbandrew]

... lol well if we're gonna list the reasons why he's bad I can pull out a whole list. I dropped Luigi because I used to play NAKAT all the time (who recently just beat Boss with MK not too long ago at Inui's Great Revival)

Look guys, Luigi has a problem getting camped, you'll realize this when getting camped haaard by ROB's, Foxes and Snakes that Luigi really can't do anything to stop them except running at them and trying to BS and approach. Fireball doesn't work to be that good of a projectile at all.

Another problem is Luigi's mobility in the air... once Luigi gets popped into the air how is he going to land when he has no air mobility and even his fast fall is slow..

If you want to get specific Metaknight really is the death matchup that Luigi's complain about,
mach tornado destroys every single one of his options except if the MK is being predictable with it; but no good experienced MK will tornado when they can be punished. Then we add Luigi's traction problem and bla bla bla....

Luigi can't get in on players who play safe/reactionary. If you play aggro, then maybe Luigi can BS an approach while you weren't looking and F u up, until then the character can really just stand in one place and wait for Luigi to do something lol.

Sorry to say, but Luigi can't camp as well as most characters and he can't approach as well either... so what does he have going for him except stupid kill power and good aerials? Nothing.

 

[NickRiddle]

Guys, it's really easy.
Throw out moves.
You just beat Luigi.
Practically every move is safe on shield.

Hit Luigi's shield? He has 3 options.
1. Slide away.
2. Side-step to NOT slide-away.
3. Roll for the same reason as above.

Use a move with minimal lag on Luigi's shield and react to whichever option he does.
If he doesn't shield... congrats, you hit him.

 

[Seagull Joe]

Guys, it's really easy.
Throw out moves.
You just beat Luigi.
Practically every move is safe on shield.

Hit Luigi's shield? He has 3 options.
1. Slide away.
2. Side-step to NOT slide-away.
3. Roll for the same reason as above.

Use a move with minimal lag on Luigi's shield and react to whichever option he does.
If he doesn't shield... congrats, you hit him.

Wrong. I'll give you an example:

If you retreat a Fair on Luigi's shield with Marth then he has time to drop his shield and jab.

And if you attempt somthing on his shield up close then that's a Nair to the face.

People complain about Olimar, yet Luigi is the Olimar reaper.

 

[MJG]

JC up smash helps olimar in that match up actually. I wouldn't say that it is terrible. The only good luigi I played was YoshQ and those matches were boring

 

[NickRiddle]

Wrong. I'll give you an example:

If you retreat a Fair on Luigi's shield with Marth then he has time to drop his shield and jab.

And if you attempt somthing on his shield up close then that's a Nair to the face.

People complain about Olimar, yet Luigi is the Olimar reaper.

If Marth i right next to Luigi, maybe.
If Marth is doing any sort of spacing, you're insane.
Nair is also only good as a landing move. You get hit by a rising nair below 40%? You can probably hit him for it.

 

[DMG]

Wrong. I'll give you an example:

If you retreat a Fair on Luigi's shield with Marth then he has time to drop his shield and jab.

And if you attempt somthing on his shield up close then that's a Nair to the face.

People complain about Olimar, yet Luigi is the Olimar reaper.

Right. And Wolf can always Usmash OOS people when they hit his shield, regardless of the move or character.

We're heard that one before lol. Might as well say Luigi can shield a MK dtilt at near max range and jab that while you're at it.

If Marth i right next to Luigi, maybe.
If Marth is doing any sort of spacing, you're insane.
Nair is also only good as a landing move. You get hit by a rising nair below 40%? You can probably hit him for it.

Shhhhhhhh

We don't talk about "understanding the game" to outsiders

 

[_Kadaj_]

these last few posts

 

[NAKAT]

... lol well if we're gonna list the reasons why he's bad I can pull out a whole list. I dropped Luigi because I used to play NAKAT all the time (who recently just beat Boss with MK not too long ago at Inui's Great Revival)

I beat him with Fox first. I don't even think he said Fox walls him.

 

[NickRiddle]

Shhhhhhhh

We don't talk about "understanding the game" to outsiders

Sorry, I had forgotten the most important rule.

 

[-Mars-]

Did JBAndrew just say that Fox walls Luigi??? Like really?

 

[BigLøu]

When Luigi is good at something he is REALLY GOOD at sometihing.

All the same though, his weaknesses are so bad making him a bad character. Really that's all there is to it, you need to have a consistency with his traits and unfortunatly when there is something exploitable with your character people will take advantage of it making your strengths useless.

Also Luigi olimar is even at best, if not olimars favor.

 

[Life]

Around the Sonic boards we say Luigi's really tough if you actually fight him. In order to beat Luigi, you walk away.

 

[DanGR]

Olimar>Luigi. It's just super hard to get used to. <_<

 

[Psychoace]

What Bowsers have you played?

Not many. I don't think we have any in Texas, I also didn't see any at mlg Dallas. up out of shield is like our only problem though.

We JUST discussed this a month or two ago, it's 55:45 yoshi, and arguably even 60:40. You guys agreed. >.>

Sorry college has started since then lol. I still think we beat Yoshi on bf. So throw Yoshi in the neutral/close pile.

 

[Pikabunz]

Zigsta uses Bowser.

 

[Zigsta]

Not many. I don't think we have any in Texas, I also didn't see any at mlg Dallas. up out of shield is like our only problem though.

Dang bro, you been living under a rock or something?!

I couldn't make MLG Dallas because I was shooting one of my super 16mm short films, which is now hitting film festivals across the nation.

Falcon-Bowser MU is 50:50, straight up. I've played it a pretty good bit.

You're DFW, right? Play me next time we're at the same tournament!