Should Diddy Kong be banned from competitive Brawl?

[Shaya]

The BBR is currently working towards reaching a final conclusion on Diddy Kong. This issue has divided the community for way too long and it’s time to address it, now that it’s a relatively quiet time tournament wise. We had both sides write up a short essay consisting of their main arguments and have had a final poll in the BBR to decide our official stance. The pro-ban side needs a 2/3 majority for Diddy to get banned, as always was the procedure for everything the BBR recommended to be banned. Note that at this very moment, the Diddy ban has gained a 2/3 majority in the BBR!

However, because this is such a major issue, we decided to let the community have a say in it as well. Below you’ll find the arguments presented by respectively the pro-ban side and the anti-ban side. Please read through these and make an informed decision. The results of this poll will count towards the BBR decision. One vote will be added for the side that reaches majority and an additional vote for every 2.5% past 50%.

Moderators are watching this thread closely. Spamming, flaming, trolling and especially the use of alternate accounts will be infracted without warning.




Pro-Ban Side

NEVER AGAIN​

1. Diddy Kong consistently spawns items.
Diddy Kong can have as many as two bananas out at any time, while we otherwise ban bananas from competitive play. One might argue Peach also has a chance of pulling out an otherwise banned item, but the key difference here is that it’s not something she can rely on. Diddy will pull out a banana 100% of the time and will pull out another if he so chooses… 100% of the time. No luck, no randomness, just sheer brokenness. Item play is simply against the nature of the game, and it especially breaks team dynamics where Diddy is the only character with stage control to such a large degree.

One route to take is limiting the usage of his down+B, but this would be a surgical (A.K.A. BAD) change akin to saying Ice Climbers aren’t allowed to do grab infinites any more. Bananas are such a core part of Diddy’s being, that we feel the monkey should disappear alongside his fruit. It’s EVERYTHING or NOTHING and you’re either with us or against us.

2. Diddy Kong is unbeatable, especially when he has two bananas out.
This isn’t really debatable, as Mew2King has said this. Therefore, it is FACT.

3. Diddy Kong can infinite the entire cast.
Another issue that can be traced back to his bananas is that Diddy can single-handedly infinite the entire cast with them. Unlike the ICs infinites, Dixie does not have to be nearby and he only requires a single banana to pull this off, on top of this, Diddy is actually a good character. This isn’t some match up-specific tomfoolery such as Dedede’s infinites, no… he does this to EVERYONE!

Video evidence:
[yt]GSnNWkCgnQQ[/yt]

4. Diddy Kong breaks neutral stages.
Diddy Kong makes it so that stages like Final Destination and Smashville, otherwise perfectly fine and neutral, take on the nature of counter-picks in sets with him. If it weren’t for (arguably questionable) counter-picks such as Rainbow Cruise, Diddy wouldn’t lose to characters like MK ever. One might even argue liberal stage lists are damage control for the fact that Diddy would otherwise **** the few characters with a chance of beating him, Meta Knight being a prime example.

5. Diddy is the primary character not named Meta Knight to solo tournaments.
Both Gnes and ADHD have demonstrated that Diddy can solo his way through tournaments in the US, as has Luigi Player in Europe. In monetary winnings, he might even do better than Meta Knight… seeing how Gnes ended up winning the MLG season finale, while M2K was the initial favourite. When looking at the Pound tournament series, the amount of 1st place prize money awarded to solo Diddy players is ~$1323, while the amount of 1st place money awarded to solo Meta Knight mains is exactly $0 (thanks go out to ChiboSempai for the math). What’s more, Mew2King practices exactly 8.1562234 times more than the next person on the “amount of practice” tier list, yet has dropped several sets to Diddy. The only way to explain this is that Diddy bull****s his way to victory.

As you can see, Gnes doesn’t need many more points to pass M2K. Smells like FRAUD (and a particular monkey throwing doodoo).

6. Diddy makes people quit the game.
Having to learn to play with items for just this matchup, as well as having to put up with a hyperactive screaming monkey, is more than should be expected from competitive players. This isn’t healthy for the competitive scene, and will in the long run destroy it, as more and more people realize Diddy is their only shot at winning money.

7. Sakurai himself says he failed to balance Diddy Kong.
The BBR got its hands on a rather obscure interview with Sakurai, which speaks for itself. Developer’s intent has always been important to us, so this is a major reason to ban Diddy Kong.

"Since I have no plans to create a new game with Nintendo, I can finally tell everyone the story behind some of Brawl's design choices. As many people know, I put my heart and soul into Melee. I did everything I could do make that game be as deep as possible. I was working at least sixty hours a week, and any game-change had to come through me for it to get implemented. By the time Nintendo asked me to make Brawl, I thought that the understanding of me having the final say was going to be the case again. Unfortunately, Nintendo decided that they wanted Brawl to be their marketing platform, like the Jump battle games staring manga characters.

I never intended to put Sonic, Wario, Pit, or Diddy into my game, but Nintendo wanted to hype new game franchises that were coming out. They figured increasing the name recognition of characters would increase sales. [Editor's note: It did.] Whenever I was coming up with the character list, I remember clearly getting a phone call from Mr. Yamauchi. He told me that no matter what, Pit must be in the game, since they were planning on resurrecting the franchise on the Wii at the time. At the time, I thought this was a great idea! So we did our best to create the character, making him rather unique. After he was announced to all the fans enjoyment, I received a memo from the higher ups with more requests. I quickly lost creative control.

Nintendo had just forged a relationship with Sega, and so they wanted to make the crossovers with Sonic sell, and the only way to do that was to increase the Sonic Brand. It's obvious to everyone that played the story mode, that Sonic was squeezed in to the narrative. This detracted from the overall composition of the game, and caused a total loss of focus. As you all know from my previous games, I have always loved having smaller character bases, because for every additional character you add, balance becomes impossible.

Many people have asked me why Meta Knight was so strong of a character. I hated how much the marketing was ruining all the meticulous balancing I had done, so I decided to make a character that would easily beat those other characters with very little effort. Even the story mode is completely trivial with Meta Knight. This worked extremely well against all of them but Diddy Kong. Try as I might, there was absolutely no way to reduce the effectiveness of Diddy Kong's bananas in the game, without removing them completely, which Marketing wouldn't let me do. The last three weeks of development were a constant struggle of breaking the engine, only to have Diddy Kong remain the same. Z/L Cancelling, Wave Dashing, Crouch Cancelling, and so forth were all removed in attempts to keep the game fun, and competitive."

Anti-Ban Side

1. Diddy having items is OKAY

While Diddy Kong may spawn items; however, so does Peach, but unlike Diddy she has a random element to it which strays from competitiveness. Diddy Kong's spawning of items has nothing to do with our competitive decision to play without items as a randomly spawning element. As a projectile, in comparison to Falco's lasers, one must pull them out, pick them up and then use them appropriately - a significant commitment.


2. Diddy Kong doesn't hard counter everyone! He makes us see even more characters in competitive play!

Diddy Kong, unlike Meta Knight, has a slew of match ups that are arguably in his disadvantage; his existence in the meta game promotes character diversity (at Meta Knight banned tournaments). Real life examples in high level tournament play include San's Ike, and there are still the likes of Peach, Luigi and R.O.B. who do exceedingly well against him. Character's such as Yoshi can circumnavigate bananas whilst chain grabbing him.

Diddy Kong in general is very easily countered and manageable by separating him from his bananas. He has weaknesses in kill power and lacks kill set ups outside of bananas.

3. Our current rule set favours Diddy Kong too much!

Diddy Kong's effectiveness comes from the stages available to him, such as Final Destination. With the removal of such stages, his accessibility to broken elements of play (such as infinites) are drastically reduced.

Diddy Kong is a perfectly competitive character with the removal of bananas (which is arguably his most proliferating feature). With the likes of LGLs implemented to reduce the effectiveness of Meta Knight, the banning of Diddy's Down B or applying an "Item Thrown Limit" will allow him to remain in the game without centralising competitive play. However, an ITL has counter plays that may stretch the limits of fairness in terms of what a Diddy Kong may be forced into positional wise.

4. Diddy's ahead of the game!

Diddy Kong's metagame is one of the most advanced at this point of time because of the likes of ADHD. Other characters haven't had the opportunity to develop.
While Diddy is advanced, there is a general widespread lack of Diddy Kong mains, and most player's have not been able to develop effective anti-diddy strategies.

He is a gimmick character, who once figured out and learned to counter will dwindle in popularity and dominance in tournaments.

5. Players need to GET BETTER!

Diddy Kong requires practice and effort to compete against, and the majority of the smash community are lazy and are not willing to work at the game and are likely to prefer banning a character rather than learning to counter it.

If we want our game to be seen as a competitive fighter without being a massive widespread joke, we must NOT ban Diddy Kong because there is a high likelihood that we'll just want to ban Falco after that, or Snake, or Marth, because they're also really good. Players will come to hate that they can't touch Falco's bread and want to ban that too. Our community needs to man up and stop faltering on the path to glory!

 

[Shaya]

Quotes from BBR members

Pro-Ban:​

This character is ****ing broken. I lost to a Diddy Kong at my last tournament and that is BULL ****. He has combos. Who else in Brawl has real combos? Meta Knight? DI that weak sauce ****. Diddy trips you then does whatever the **** he wants afterward. He's combing you into taunt just because he can and you have to bend over and take it. He's unbalanced on certain stages and forces us to include stupid starters and CPs just to control his monkey ***. He infinites EVERYONE.

Christ, he makes items on command. What the hell is he doing still in the competitive scene?

he shuts down option covering, has countless options of his own (thanks to bananas and forward B to escape juggles and tons of small tricks), broken shield camping + spot dodge in the mix, and VERY hard, safe punishes thanks to bananas and quick, powerful good-ranged moves (like Fair mixed up with say, air dodge to spot dodge, among other things and you cannot cover all his options but mathematically his damage output given the odds of you guessing right average out to his favor in most scenarios), I think he's the best character on neutrals.

Diddy is also unplankable esp with a LGR if you just space your peanuts well

Diddy:
...consistently spawns items that are banned on their own. If we ban items, we should ban Diddy too because just limiting his down+B would be a surgical change and therefore bad.
...is one of few non-MK characters to solo tournaments and have an even matchup with MK. He is therefore broken.
...makes sounds that are very distracting to the opponent. No one should have to put up with a screaming monkey.
...can infinite the entire cast. Doesn't even require Dixie to be nearby.
...is unbeatable as soon as he gets two bananas. Mew2King says so, therefore it is FACT.

Only peach and ROB can also spam items. However, peach's has a random element to it which makes it more balanced, and Rob's sucks. Diddy ALWAYS gets a banana. Every time. Not to mention he has a perfect glide toss for combos and moves that flow into one another. Total Bull****. It even beats Tornado. TORNADO. At first, I thought we could limit Diddy to just one banana at a time. Then he got a single banana lock. "But others can do that to him!" So? He GETS TO CHOOSE when the item is out, meaning he controls when people can starting infiniting each other like this is ****ing MvC all of a sudden.

Neither Peach' turnips or Dedede's Waddle Dees/Doos are items that also exist outside of those characters (in the item list) and we don't allow Dedede to spawn anything else. Peach sometimes does spawn regular items, but it happens too infrequently to be a problem and it's not something she can bank on. Diddy on the other hand will get a banana 100% of the time and can have as many as TWO out on the stage. At some point you just have to say that enough is enough.

Diddy Kong has banana locks on pretty much every single character in the game. While it requires a ton of technical skill, this shouldn't be a factor when considering how overpowering the technique is. I mean, Meta Knight's perfect planking is an isolated technique that we were able to pacify with the LGL that most tournaments use, but we can't really do the same to Diddy Kong and his locks.

It'd be a little absurd to suggest that we limit his banana usage (too subjective), so what would be another optional step? Ban Diddy Kong. The tactic of banana locking someone is not something that we can single out as easily at Meta Knight's LGL or IDC. Banning him is obviously the next best choice we have on the matter.

The banana lock has a ton of uses outside of simple guaranteeing a KO (when done perfectly).

Assuming we have a 300% limit on all infinites (which I assume this would be considered), Diddy Kong players can abuse this by locking the opponent up to the maximum allowed damage before finishing the opponent off. Bananas to very little damage, so it's an effective way to kill time in a match. This demands that the opposing player be able to manage what little time they have left after getting locked to not only attempt to regain some control (the lead), but to do it against a character who can set him up two more times using the same exact technique.

It guarantees a KO, it can be used to abuse the time limitations, and all it takes for the banana lock is a single hit confirm off of a banana. In other words, the set up is pretty simple to manage, especially considering that Diddy Kong can spawn bananas at will, and can have up to two bananas on the stage.

Why we haven't been focusing on this character and how easy he is to abuse is beyond me. And remember, this is just a single problem Diddy Kong provides for us in the game.

DIDDY is BROKEN@!!!!

All diddy has to do is shield and throw a banana. So broken. BAN!!!!

Diddy Kong is bull****, I played Gnes at Pound 5 and I had maybe a stock lead. He made a comeback by pulling 2 bananas and got me to last stock last hit. I had to pull some smart *** **** to win the match. Then ADHD 3 stocked my MK like it was nothing, like seriously? I want this char GONE.

Diddy dominates Europe. One of the best European Brawl players and the best in Austria, Luigi_Player, uses Diddy and pretty much always wins. He even sometimes switches to worse characters just to get more of a challenge.

i dont get why diddy kong wasn't banned earlier. our rules clearly state that no items are allowed and diddy kong has a move that produces items. bananas create so many infinites too, its ridiculous. why should smash be degenerated to jumping on people while throwing bananas down on them repeatedly? i'm certain that if other items were allowed, even more infinites would come up, but they're banned and so those problems don't arise.

i dont see anyone having any issues ko'ing out of the nana infinite. single nana, double nana, it doesnt matter he just infinites everyone. neutral stages are supposed to be neutral aren't they? his infinites definitely make every single mu in his favor.

Diddy Kong is stupid, and promotes playing gay. What stages do you want to take Diddy Kong to?
Not neutrals.
What are the only stages that people complain about in Brawl?
Not neutrals.

If we get rid of characters who are obviously broken on neutral stages, we can get rid of CPs, making the game much more balanced. Who needs to argue whether Picto is broken, or if Brinstar is stupid for MK? With Diddy Kong gone, we have the main threat on SV, FD, and BF gone. This would allow us to play on these three neutrals stages only, like men... and the Japanese.

so my character used to **** diddy like 65:35
now the mu is practically even
BAN DIDDY!

yeah but seriously, imo diddy dominates on neutrals and the only reason he has a (possible) bad mu with mk is because of mk's cps. now that we see diddies learning how to fight on cruise and winning there i'm convinced he dominates the metagame. the reason he isnt winning every tournament is because we dont have enough good diddy players. adhd and gnes? i mean those guys are pretty good but do they really abuse diddy's broken options? i dont think so.

If we have a LGL for characters like ROB and PIT, we should have an "Items thrown" limit of 25 for Diddy Kong.

Without an ITL Diddy completely changes the game in every way. This isn't allowed in Street Fighter, and shouldn't be allowed in Smash.

So say we all.

Diddy Kong completely changes the way that starter stage lists are created.

If it weren't for DDK, 5 stage starter lists are perfect...except the fact that DDK has 3 of his best 4 stages on that list already. It is basically a "Where do you want Diddy to get a free CP to" for the first match. He has 2 counterpicks on you every set.

So then we make a 7/9 stage starter lists, but nobody ever agrees with it and then everybody will just go to "Smasvhille" which is, again, a Diddy Counterpick. Brinstar and Rainbow Cruise are even being discussed to be banned by the public, which will further STRENGTHEN diddy's stranglehold on the stage list.

The only reason we don't want to ban uber gay stages like brinstar and rainbow cruise is so Diddy Kong can be counterpicked;
If we ban Diddy, we can ban all the bad stages we've always hated and find uncompetitive

I'm not going to lie, Diddy Kong is the reason that I've stopped playing Brawl. Shortly after MLG, many players began to use Diddy in Louisiana, following the blue print for dominance that was shown by GNES as he destroyed all the competition. Routinely, every single match that I would play in friendlies against Lee would be him utilizing Diddy Kong. At least with MK, I have complete control of my character, but once Lee began to utilize the infinite banana locks I simply couldn't take it anymore.

Many would equate the Diddy Locks to being extremely situational, and no worse than a chain grab from the Ice Climbers. I assure you, that at least against the Ice Climbers I could abuse the fact that Nana has the IQ of a Melee player. At least against Falco, I only have to worry about the chain grab at early percents, but I never have a reprieve against the incessant locks from Diddy Kong. No other character has so many sources of guaranteed damage from something as spammable as bananas. All it takes is one whiffed move, or a hit against his shield, and I'm being comboed off the stage. A banana with a shield shuts down almost every approach in the game, when coupled with someone that is skilled with power shielding. Every other character in the game has a flaw that can be abused, and it's only now that the meta game is shifting to where we are seeing highly skilled players utilizing the set knock back of bananas to generate ridiculous levels of damage and stage control.

After a few weeks of putting up with this, I decided to step away from Smash back in late November. Due to Diddy Kong's bombastic ruining of the Meta Game in my state, I failed to contribute to the match up chart discussions. This of course, deprived the chart from a wealth of knowledge, that ultimately resulted in a skewed match up chart.

**** Diddy Kong. He ruined this game. The only reason people are still using Meta Knight is because they don't like the Diddy Kong ditto. That's worse than the Snake Ditto. You might as well flip a coin and decide who the victor is. Do we really want to result to that?

doesn't down b not add a count to items thrown, only if u pick up a banana and throw it?

that's a big problem here, we can't limit diddy's item use in any numerically hard fashion here then, leaving the only option to actually remove the character

Can we at least ban him in teams? It's really gay and unfair when I get a dthrow setup, only to have my partner trip on a banana. He completely destroys the teams dynamic of brawl by having exclusive stage control in a game mode that, by nature, is supposed to be chaotic and disorderly. Lucas/Ness can't be regrabbed in teams because of their partner...Wario can't be grab released...so why can Diddy still banana lock me?

Has anyone given this any thought?

Also, has everyone forgotten about the fact that Gnes, often thought of as the SECOND-BEST Diddy Kong, NOT EVEN THE BEST, won the LARGEST TOURNAMENT IN BRAWL'S HISTORY WITH WORLD CLASS PLAYERS FROM ALL OVER THE NATION WITHOUT EVEN DROPPING A SINGLE GAME. Imagine what ADHD, a far better player in all aspects of the game, would've done. I mean, not like he could've done any better than that but...you know what I mean.

Consider the fact that no MK, main or secondary, has ever made first-place money at Pound, one of the most influential and iconic tournament series of our community. You know who has? Spoilers:

Spoiler

Diddy. Diddy has.

I dont think people should HAVE to learn how to play with items just to be able to have a chance at winning vs diddy kong. its unreasonable. we might as well turn items on whenever someone is playing vs a diddy. no one else can produce an item on their own that creates a huge shift in momentum in the way that diddy's bananas do. however if lets say a smart bomb appeared randomly in front of falco, they would now be on equal footing.

diddy's infinites are too overpowered too. like theres no way to really justify that one in my opinion. it doesnt resemble anything else in the game at all like how ice climbers infinite is a cg. they're not even that hard to set up so why bother waiting for people to actually start implementing them?

I heard Sakurai himself said he doesn't think Brawl should be a tournament type of game so he created diddy to mess with the tournament scene and prevent it's health, he said it so himself in a recent interview at TGS 2010. problem is the interview's in japanese, i can post a translation later when I have time

But UNLIKE Metaknights planking which is easily stopped by most of the cast, Diddy's bananas are much much more difficult to overcome. EVEN CHARACTERS WITH REFLECTOR SHIELDS HAVE TROUBLE WITH DIDDY. THATS SO RIDICULOUS! PEOPLE WITH REFLECTOR SHIELDS ARE SUPPOSED TO BE ABLE TO EASILY DEAL WITH ALL CAMPING BY HOLDING THEIR REFLECTOR!

But diddy is so overpowered he can get past reflectors AND EVEN PUNISH YOU FOR RELFECTING THEM by letting them hit you when he charges barrels.

I mean..you don't really need a new tactic or anything, diddy can already infinite pretty much the entire cast can't he? Just no one here does it. Just use diddys infinite to push him over the edge to being banned.

One thing no has discussed yet is Diddy's planking ability. Frankly I'm surprised ADHD/Gnes/Felix haven't abused the crap out of this.

After doing some research and talking to GIMR, I figured out that if Diddy just repeatedly grabs the ledge and upBs really fast, he's invincible for about 32 frames, and there's only about a 5 frame window to get damage in, and if you miss you're caught offstage to get spiked, or you take 17% from diddy's upB.

The worst part is that on stages like BF he can just wall cling to avoid the LGL.

I used to think Diddy was beatable, but clearly some of these exploitations have gone overboard.

Five frames is such a tiny amount of time, it's absurd. It's not enough of a window for a human being to be expected to stop, and Diddy's spike lets him threaten anyone willing to challenge him on the ledge with instant death. Meanwhile, his recovery will let him survive and he can B-reverse cancel his popgun to banana pull to hit people up on the ledge while offstage.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~​

Anti-Ban:​

What is your problem with Diddy Kong? I don't particularly buy how you fools could lose to a degenerate species of a human. This stupid little monkey is so simple to beat. GO IKE, get a few jabs in, grab him here and there, get the hard read and fsmash him. Voila. San has done the possible, and so can you. Pick up Ike. He hard-counters Diddy. Screw what the match-up chart says. It's actually +4 Ike. Diddy is a character that one can't possibly even consider banning.

Anyways, Diddy should not be banned. Yoshi can chain-grab him. OVER bananas.

Diddy isn't that good!

I don't know, Diddy's infinites are only really effective on Final Destination. We should consider banning FD instead of Diddy Kong, or maybe implementing a banana hit count to prevent abuse of locks.

Diddy shouldn't be banned. Diddy PREMOTES character versatility. He promotes underused characters that COMPLETELY DESTROY him but are otherwise underused like luigi and peach.

His matchup chart is terrible. He has no +4's and only 2 +3's. That means EVERYONE AND THEIR MOM can compete with him.

Also ALL you have to do to defeat diddy is seperate him from his bananas. Everyone that can't separate Diddy from his bananas is bad and therefore their opinion shouldn't count.

Bananas also only do like 5 damage MAX. That's like laser damage and bananas are WAY slower than lasers. You got to pull them out, then pick them up, and finally THEN you can throw 1.

He has a terrible recovery, doesn't kill until over 250% with proper DI and has NO KILL SETUPS BESIDES BANANAS, which you should be controlling not him, because you SEPARATE DIDDY FROM HIS BANANAS.

This character is no where near banworthy and anyone who can't beat him is a noob that can't separate him from his bananas.

I'm a bit on the fence about this, guys. I mean, he does have the banana locks, banana infinites, banana gimps, banana combos(as was shown earlier), and he likes banana splits. What else is he going to have that intrinsically changes the game? I'm not sure if I want to know, really.

Though, at the same time, those all can be used against him, too, and who doesn't like a banana split? Maybe that's why Ganondorf is the worst in the game, but I digress. There's so much to consider with Diddy, it's absurd. I mean, sure, when you get to learn him, he isn't that big of a headache, but there's so much to learn! >.<

... Hm... though some of his moves have really weird SDI properties... but he can easily stop the infinites of the ICs simply by having a banana in his hand. No one else can replicate that as easily. I don't know, I'll have to think about it for now.

This is a tough one, but I'm gonna have to say no. I know he seems bannable right now but there just aren't enough Peach's in the scene, because of Peach's weakness to MK and Snake. Diddy shouldn't be banned because characters like Peach has an 80-20 advantage against him, and I mean that. i've figured out a few trickys lately and I'm positive she ***** him. Why wont anyone listen to me !?

Insta throwing isn't useful for everyone but with Peach against diddy, in couple with short hop down airs, make it child's play to approach diddy with peach.

if I wasn't as Godly as I am with peach i'd probably think he should be banned too, so I can sympthaize with you guys. Play to win, get better. or just use peach for an 80-20 advantage.

Also Diddy's metagame is just really advanced because of ADHD, other chars just haven't had a chance to catch up to him. He made all the diddy's good and its because of that diddy's metagame is just far ahead of everyone else.

Also would like to point out no one has enough diddy practice yet. He is entirely a gimmick character and once people figure him out you won't see him doing well in tournaments.

diddy loses to ike xD

It's not just any diddy here, it's Gnes, he's the best Diddy. I mean sure San has beaten tons of MKs, but no Mew2Kings Antis or Allys.

The biggest thing here is that Diddy's items (which many find to be the most broken ailment about him) can be taken away from him and used by the opponent. A MK's opponent can't suddenly use his nado (except for Kirby lol).

We have recently decided to put a LGL for MK only, basically allowing the use of surgical changes in the game to keep a character legal. Should we ban the use of Diddy's down B? If it keeps the character legal it's for the better (and he's still a legit character without them).

I mean don't get me wrong, I'm against banning anything DiK related (ok I tried to make a cool abbreviation since DK doesn't work but DiK just looks stupid and not right...) since I don't think he's broken.
MK has no bad matchups. Diddy though? Does he lose to Ike? Maybe. Does he lose to MK? Perhaps. Does he lose to ROB? Yes. Does he lose to Peach and Luigi? Many think so. Diddy is not overcentralizing to the metagame, if he does get too popular, then other characters will rise up.

Hang on, hang on guys that is ludicrous. The items thrown limit isn't fair because of how easy it is to do on accident. What if a diddy kong already at 24 items thrown (or whatever the limit is) is forced to airdodge into a banana on the ground and accidentally picks it up. Now he can't throw it without risking being DQed. Must he then stand there and take hits until he forceably drops the banana. Also what if diddy kong accidentally hits down b trying to monkey flip? Should diddy be DQed for accidentally plucking bananas when he is within one throw of being DQed.

ALSO NOW the entire metagame will be centralized around players getting diddy to 1 throw shy of the limit then trying to FORCE bananas into diddys hands by baiting airdodges into them or baiting diddy during attacks to grab them with his huge grab boxes. It just isn't a fair nerf!

Omni, it's lazy players not willing to work at the game like you which are going to push this character's banning to actually happening
geez why are half the ppl in the bbr in the bbr anyway

if you're on your game you can easily track down what diddy does and win. you can use his bananas, anyone can. his most "broken" ailment can be stolen and used by anyone

 

[NO-IDea]

****. Diddy is broken.

 

[Ripple]

aren't you guys a little early this year?

****. diddy is broken! infinite everyone you say, might vote's for yes

 

[Browny]

^ Get @ Australia, were future

 

[Ripple]

^ Get @ Australia, were future

it was funnier 2 years ago when they had a word filter that replaced smash with halo. lol, that was hilarious

 

[SN Viper]

what a ****ing waste of time i mean come on April fools haha dumb

 

[Browny]

what a ****ing waste of time i mean come on April fools haha dumb

shaya skipped a whole day of classes to do this

 

[Spelt]

This is pretty legit.

 

[Kinzer]

Needs moar collap-

Nevermind.

@#$% Diddy.

 

[Juushichi]

10/10. Will laugh again.

 

[MK26]

we have put up with diddy's bull**** for too long
its either him or the starter list
get ps2 on that ***** now to curb the pro-ban side before this vote goes too far

honestly after that vid im seriously considering picking up diddy, mastering the naner infinite and nothing else, and just running show with one move

EDIT: o wait i can do that with meta knight too tho
without requiring gratuitous amounts of tech skill...
****

 

[Chuee]

Diddy? We should be focused on banning Mario.
tho good Arpil fools lolololol

 

[z00ted]

no!

Ban Metaknight instead!

 

[Chuee]

no!

Ban Metaknight instead!

MK doesn't spawn items.

 

[Tesh]

First I was wondering how a troll could make polls.

Then I realized it must be April 1st in your time zone already. Congrats you jerks.

 

[K Balls]

If you guys hate diddy kong that much, either get better or don't play the game. He isn't even the best character in the game. And think if diddy kong was ban then everyone or most people would ***** about other characters being banned; therefore an epidemic occurs.

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

First I was wondering how a troll could make polls.

Then I realized it must be April 1st in your time zone already. Congrats you jerks.

Well it's not in my time zone.....

Almost time for me to poof from the internets....

 

[BSP]

It's not April fools yet for me soooo...

Sure, why not?

 

[Sinister Slush]

You guys should discuss on banning Yoshi, He can Wavedash still, Has a chaingrab on 16 characters. And A free Usmash/Uair on Ness Popo and Jigglypuff...
THAT'S ALMOST 50% OF THE CAST!

 

[MK26]

^x4: obvious troll is obvious

seriously, if that video doesnt convince you that there is something wrong with diddy, that he can potentially get a stock off a single naner throw if another banana is nearby, then i dont know what your problem is
that **** is broken and should not be in this game

(more proof that diddy+dixie survived until late in development but was removed when the devs ran out of time and they did a shoddy job implementing naners without acquiring the proper tech skill to test them to the limit)

 

[SupaSairentoZ7℠]

Whenever I use R.O.B., Ike, or Peach I don't have difficulties with Diddy. Everyone else those banana locks are a killer...

 

[Zigsta]

I completely forgot about April Fool's. Thanks for reminding me, haha.

 

[Browny]

http://forums.heroesofnewerth.com/showthread.php?t=241214

see, now THAT is how you do a proper april fools prank (the avatars all changed)

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

Why didn't you wait for tomorrow to post this

 

[Spelt]

It is tomorrow for shaya.
he lives in the future~*~*~*~


Edit: loling so hard right now.

 

[Chuee]

REALLY NOW SWF?
FRIDAY BACKROUND?
DAMMiT

 

[san.]

Change the site back please. It's giving my browser too many errors.

 

[C.J.]

I see you guys went all out this year.

 

[Chuee]

Change the site back please. It's giving my browser too many errors.

It's giving my eyes and ears too many errors.

 

[z00ted]

oh man, you guys done gone did it this time!

 

[Tarmogoyf]

I was gonna vote proban, but I am a gay terrorist.....

 

[John12346]

I may be a staunch pro-MK ban, but I'm willing to turn a blind eye for now so we can all understand the significant threat to the metagame that Diddy poses.



Ban the ****er.

 

[Mr.Jackpot]

If somebody doesn't tell me this is a joke I'll shoot myself. Because it's not April Fools where I live yet.

 

[san.]

They made the forums unusable for a day, go figure.

 

[z00ted]

deal with it

 

[pass the syrup]

ugh. April fools is my least favorite day on the internet. This better be bull.

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

If you guys think this is serious you can go DI yourself

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Your joke was beaten by censors.

 

[DtJ Composer]

ROB Metaknight Kirby Sasuke Jungle Dedede Donkey Kong Diddy Kong Developer Glyph This DI Ike Marth Lucario Ice Climbers Mario Luigi Peach Sheik Shiek Zelda Ganondorf Link Bowser Composer Th3 Infraction Xiivi Moderator Samus Zero Suit Samus ***** Disco Room Legion of Doom Dekuu Teran Olimar Wario Snake Pikachu Fox Jigglypuff Falco Captain Falcon Lucas