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Counterpicking Made Easy

sasook

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I'd just like to say rather than Smashville, Battlefield is a much better stage for Link. Norfair and RC are correct though.
 

deepseadiva

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Lucas best is the ones you picked as 'Worst'
dude, Ness and Lucas suck at brinstar.
I personally asked both the Ness and Lucas boards. I can dig up quotes if you want.

I really disagree with the Zero Suit stages.

These stages don't match up to the evaluation in this ZSS thread which I like much more.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=155975
Hrm, I'll ask again then.

EDIT: Updated with new info from the Zamus boards - specifically Snakeee.

I'd just like to say rather than Smashville, Battlefield is a much better stage for Link. Norfair and RC are correct though.
Noted.
 

Nicole

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I disagree with Pirate Ship being one of GW's worst stages. We recently discussed it on the GW boards, and it got 7/10, so it's definitely in his advantage, just not one of his absolute BEST. Personally, I think GW does kind of poorly on FD, but I don't know that it would replace Pirate Ship as one of his worst...
 

AranOcean

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Battlefield is probably the best STARTER stage for Ike, but I wouldn't say it's the best possible. I believe Corneria gets that award.

I also fail to see how Jungle Japes is the worst for him...
It's simple to why Jungle Japes is the worst stage for Ike. If he falls in the water, it's almost impossible for him to recover (we all know how Aether works). The water takes him off the stage, he dies.
 

deepseadiva

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Updated, along with some PT board info.

DK ***** in the mansion. The ceilings = ground pound are evil, and the pillars give punch charge room.
DK boards decided on Corneria, Brinstar, and Jungle Japes as their "Triforce of stages."

What makes Rainbow Cruise such a good course for him?
Turtle Cruise.
 

Deoxys

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Wow, Snake's worst stages are SO wrong. Obviously Jungle Japes is one of them. Snake's not even bad on those other stages.
 

Morrigan

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He can't camp you on RC, his mines are useless because the stage constantly moves.
 

SuSa

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@Dekuu

Who the hell camps with mines?

Now then...

Norfair... Snake counterpick? .... No.... just no...

The C4/Mine options are basically ANYWHERE on the stage and you're good, if you camp on the top platforms, a utilt kills at "WTF HAX" low %'s, so does falling through the platform > Uair, the dthrow tech chase gets a "OMFG" boost because of the smaller platforms, multiple ledges to be able to get the dthrow infinite, you can't really be gimped as easily, the lava can save you from spikes, FTILT can KO pretty easily as well, you're still a pain to kill (the higher your %, the lower platform you camp on), grenade stripping in midair lets you basically put your grenades anywhere on the stage (just double jump to get to the far other side top platform), c4 has a hitbox underneath it so you can guard any SAFE approach to you by placing a c4 in front of you, much room to camp, because of our immense stage control, you can't really plank here, the stage actually ups are aerial game because of the huge empty space in the middle, so you'll be getting nair'd a lot.....

All I see in that stage is sex.
 

deepseadiva

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Wow, Snake's worst stages are SO wrong. Obviously Jungle Japes is one of them. Snake's not even bad on those other stages.
Aww... do I have to go ask the Snake boards... :urg:

Urrgg... I hate that place.
 

Cherry64

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Lawl what a bad amrth though. he got tooled in damage by falco. I mean the amrth has some skill but if thsi was final D he'd get pwned
 

Ken Neth

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LOL. It was recorded at 4:00 in the morning and I was on three hours of sleep from the night before. I was too tired to care about trying to space, or do anything really. /tired johns

I promise my marth really isn't that bad. I just uploaded it cause of how gay RC is LOL.
 

deepseadiva

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I've updated with some Snake info. Good...?

Isn't PTAD an amazing stage for Diddy?..
Even though it's counter/banned.. :|
Prolly, but not better for all the banana play on all the stationary stages.

Speaking of counter/banned stages, Onett is incredible for Olimar. Better than Corneria, I'd say.
Noted.
 

Ugg

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Prolly, but not better for all the banana play on all the stationary stages
I think it would atleast be better than Battlefield, unless I'm missing something.
Out of the 7 transformations it has, only 3 of which actually have platforms. The other 4 are just flat, perfect for banana play, and the mobile part is basically a moving FD.
 

Kief

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major bump for reference. i look here all the time. this should be stickied. as long as stuff about glitches is sticked >_>
 

:mad:

Bird Law Aficionado
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lol im a toon link and feel castle siege is pretty good stage for him, never had any trouble there.
I imagine the second stage of it would give you trouble since it eliminates your projectile game.
 

Pazx

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No mention of Skyland for ness? a very good stage for him...

Some of these I haven't actually done really... buut... looks pretty good to me...

Seriously, skyland is easily nesses best.

edit: Realised that brinstar is a melee stage

Twilighted.
 

:mad:

Bird Law Aficionado
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I mentioned that Skyland's good for Ness, but that was generally speaking.
Skyland's banned, and for good reason.
 

Cherry64

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Please help contribute to the empty spaces or correct existing ones.
EDIT: Sure thing Boss!


:pit: Pit
Best: Norfair, Lylat Cruise, Final Destination
Worst: Pokemon Stadium 1

EDIT: Agree'd whomever you got your info from knew what they were talking about.
:samus2: Samus
Best: Battlefield, Final Destination, Frigate Orpheon
Worst: Rainbow Cruise, Luigi's Mansion, Yoshi's Island

EDIT: here's the hiccup. personally Frigate orphean isn't her best but it' snot her worst it's nuetral defs, if you go samus for this stage prepare to fight more physical than spammy.

For worst, Did you know that in the samus boards people tell you to Cp Rainbow cruise for those hard matchups? it's a great stage for samus if you know the stage and fire dozens of homing missiles. And luigi's mansion is another one that is pretty good for her. just camp inside the house when he's inside the house. Her Uair can go through the second floor which is friggen awsome.she has numerious jab locks on luigi's mansion. all in all it's a great stage for her. and yoshi's island I guess is prolly her worst yeah.
Throwing my 2 cents in...
 

Xyro77

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your info on samus is wrong, TC

japes is samus ABSOLUTE worst stage

FD/BF are her best
 

Gameplayer209

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I don't really see why Luigi's worst stage is Final Destination... he can cyclone across the flat terrain, he can spam fireballs. Plus, he can recover from most parts of the stage. As a matter of fact, he can go under the whole stage and recover.
 

Ojanya

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You completely miss the point of counterpicking... It's not on which character is good on which stage, that may vary from player to player. The point of counterpicking is to analyze why you lost, and pick a stage that will limit that factor, if not eliminate it all together.
 

da K.I.D.

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You completely miss the point of counterpicking... It's not on which character is good on which stage, that may vary from player to player. The point of counterpicking is to analyze why you lost, and pick a stage that will limit that factor, if not eliminate it all together.
If you analyse why you lost with a character like link, 8 times out of 10 you will realise that it was because of your characters limitations. specifically his recovery, therefore you are going to want to pick a stage that minimises that weakness.

If you lose, you also want to analyse what you or your character did well in that round, and pick a stage that complements each the character's or the player's strengths (hopefully both)

Now you cant make a list of what stages every player will do well on. but the point of this list is to createa starting point for people to experiment with for later on when they need to know what stages to counterpick with
 

deepseadiva

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You completely miss the point of counterpicking... It's not on which character is good on which stage, that may vary from player to player. The point of counterpicking is to analyze why you lost, and pick a stage that will limit that factor, if not eliminate it all together.
Da K.I.D. explains it succinctly:

Now you cant make a list of what stages every player will do well on. but the point of this list is to createa starting point for people to experiment with for later on when they need to know what stages to counterpick with
Perfect.

Or of course, there's this I wrote in the OP:

Keep in mind this is just a general outlook on how characters do on specific stages - not to mention a democratic one. To truly excel in choosing the correct counterpick against any character or player look at things personally and carefully; don't blindly follow a list.
I'll update soon.
 
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